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OK Gang, I am still waiting for further information on this but here is a preliminary report.

The Starry Night version I have (6.4) quotes the following proper motion for Vega (0.2008, 0.2872) (RA,Dec) arcsec/year. The current SIMBAD website quoted values are (0.20094, 0.28623) [same units]. In Black Genesis I used (0.20103, 0.28747) which was at the time the SIMBAD quoted value.
SIMBAD: [simbad.u-strasbg.fr]

So anyhow that is clearly not the issue because those differences in proper motion yield less than 0.002 degrees differences over 14,000 years. (Compared to the 1.36 degrees movement of the whole proper motion itself.)

My version of Starry Night Pro shows Vega culminating at a declination of 86.2407 degrees, 12008 BC, which is 0.299 degrees less than the culmination declination I gave in Black Genesis. The difference between my value and Starry Night's value (for the declination) is not due to our very slightly different proper motions. It is because I used a different method to calculate Earth's pole movement. I calculated it from scratch, using the published equations I referenced in BG and in Origin Map. I have a query out to Starry Night, asking them details on how they calculate Earth's pole for such ancient dates, so I can identify our differences. But I haven't heard back from Starry Night yet. FYI, the reason I calculated such extremely ancient dates myself is because when I started doing such calculations circa 2001, the available software either used a much worse approximation for such extremely ancient dates, or simply didn't do dates before Julian date 0 (circa 4700 BC). I am willing to consider that maybe, today, Starry Night Pro's values might be better than mine. But I can't tell until I find out exactly how Starry Night does their calculations. And, importantly, note that these Vega shaft calculations are the only ones where such a small difference (0.3 degrees over 14,000 years) makes any difference to the interpretations. It will be interesting to track this down.

And, given that, it is interesting to look at the shaft situation if we end up taking the Starry Night value as (possibly, don't know yet) better. The center of the shaft is declination 86.544, and the edges of the shaft if we consider the outer edges at the outside of today's Pyramid are 86.2825 and 86.8052 degrees. So if Vega culminated at 86.2407 degrees it just missed shining down the shaft by 0.04 degrees, IF the whole pyramid was there 12,000 BC (and if the shaft angle did not shift geophysically at all over 14KY, and that is another separate issue). BUT we are pretty sure the whole pyramid as it is today was not there 12,000 BC. As we indicate in Black Genesis, we think, possibly if anything was there it might have been the part of the shaft that goes through the bedrock. That part is shorter, and so has a wider angle to the sky. Its edges are at declinations 86.187 and 86.900 degrees. So if Starry Night's values are correct (again, not certain about this) Vega started shining to the bottom of the bedrock shaft circa 12,120 BC, and continued shining down the shaft through its culmination 12008 BC until 11,896 BC when Vega's declination descended too low to shine down for another 26,000 years.


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Subject Views Written By Posted
Zep Tepi 462 loveritas 07-Mar-13 11:01
Re: Zep Tepi 295 PB Bytes 08-Mar-13 15:17
Re: Zep Tepi 290 loveritas 08-Mar-13 20:31
Mostly offline next couple of days 324 Thomas Brophy 08-Mar-13 23:57
Re: Mostly offline next couple of days 265 loveritas 09-Mar-13 00:34
Re:the waves of which dashed in powerless fury against its base. 303 Thunderbird 10-Mar-13 20:18
Nice To See You're Back 326 loveritas 12-Mar-13 04:22
Re: Nice To See You're Back 305 Thomas Brophy 16-Mar-13 04:52
GHMB 'Decorum' and Other Issues 301 Dr. Lew Graham 16-Mar-13 14:03
Re: GHMB 'Decorum' and Other Issues 300 Thomas Brophy 16-Mar-13 20:18
High on Ego 272 loveritas 16-Mar-13 21:59
and self righteous arrogance 305 Sirius7237 16-Mar-13 22:18
Re: GHMB 'Decorum' and Other Issues 326 Bobajot 17-Mar-13 02:15
Re: GHMB 'Decorum' and Other Issues 303 Aine 17-Mar-13 22:04
Relying Upon One's Discernment 351 Dr. Lew Graham 18-Mar-13 01:35
Re: Relying Upon One's Discernment 829 cladking 18-Mar-13 20:58
Atrophy of Discernment 338 Dr. Lew Graham 18-Mar-13 21:34
Re: Atrophy of Discernment 340 cladking 18-Mar-13 21:59
A Miracle? 319 Dr. Lew Graham 18-Mar-13 23:42
Accidently hit "quote" instead of post and failed to correct 324 cladking 19-Mar-13 00:20
Miracles? 284 Dr. Lew Graham 19-Mar-13 00:30
Re: A Miracle? 216 PB Bytes 19-Mar-13 00:47
Typo 322 Dr. Lew Graham 19-Mar-13 01:00
Sarcasm? 298 Sirius7237 19-Mar-13 03:04
More Hypocrisy 301 loveritas 19-Mar-13 05:32
Re: Typo 280 PB Bytes 19-Mar-13 03:26
yes, maybe thinking is not ultimate ground of being 291 Thomas Brophy 18-Mar-13 23:03
Re: yes, maybe thinking is not ultimate ground of being 306 cladking 19-Mar-13 02:16
I addressed your question on Zep Tepi, no? 292 Thomas Brophy 18-Mar-13 04:41
Re: I addressed your question on Zep Tepi, no? 306 loveritas 18-Mar-13 06:07
Re: I addressed your question on Zep Tepi, no? 373 Thomas Brophy 18-Mar-13 22:30
Re: I addressed your question on Zep Tepi, no? 341 loveritas 18-Mar-13 22:38
I'll Rephrase the Question 317 loveritas 19-Mar-13 20:42
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 313 Aine 19-Mar-13 21:37
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 315 loveritas 20-Mar-13 11:54
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 323 Thomas Brophy 20-Mar-13 17:47
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 328 Thunderbird 20-Mar-13 18:29
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 307 loveritas 20-Mar-13 21:33
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 300 Spiros 20-Mar-13 22:13
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 338 Laird Scranton 21-Mar-13 16:50
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 344 Spiros 21-Mar-13 19:16
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 333 Audrey 24-Mar-13 04:25
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 299 Thomas Brophy 24-Mar-13 06:10
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 263 loveritas 24-Mar-13 06:54
Starry Night Pro calculation still not clarified 349 Thomas Brophy 29-Mar-13 22:02
Re: Starry Night Pro calculation still not clarified 323 loveritas 30-Mar-13 02:05
Re: What if?...... 288 Thunderbird 30-Mar-13 20:56
Re: What if?...... 284 loveritas 30-Mar-13 23:55
Re: Zawiyet el-Aryan meridian observation shaft/Water clock 535 Thunderbird 31-Mar-13 03:37
Re: Zawiyet el-Aryan meridian observation shaft/Water clock 316 loveritas 31-Mar-13 07:56
Bond of Heaven and Earth 474 loveritas 01-Apr-13 01:25
Djed-raising ropes? 321 Thomas Brophy 01-Apr-13 01:40
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 329 loveritas 01-Apr-13 05:18
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 300 Thomas Brophy 01-Apr-13 06:47
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 324 loveritas 01-Apr-13 06:58
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 309 Thomas Brophy 01-Apr-13 07:05
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 294 loveritas 01-Apr-13 07:11
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 316 Thomas Brophy 01-Apr-13 07:24
Re: Ability....and transitions of time. 315 Thunderbird 01-Apr-13 23:19
Re: Ability....and transitions of time. 289 loveritas 01-Apr-13 23:53
Re: King and Queen Ascending/Descending 379 Thunderbird 02-Apr-13 20:07
Re: King and Queen Ascending/Descending 283 loveritas 02-Apr-13 22:37
Re: Bond of Heaven and Earth 339 Thunderbird 01-Apr-13 03:55
Some basics... 324 Thomas Brophy 31-Mar-13 00:16
Re: Starry Night Pro calculation still not clarified 329 Spiros 30-Mar-13 06:30
Help ask Starry Night 303 Thomas Brophy 31-Mar-13 00:58
Re: Help ask Starry Night 384 Spiros 31-Mar-13 17:58
Starry Night Pro 'fesses up to precession calculation errors 882 Thomas Brophy 02-Apr-13 19:29
Re: Starry Night Pro 'fesses up to precession calculation errors 367 Spiros 02-Apr-13 20:59
Re: Starry Night Pro 'fesses up to precession calculation errors 301 Thomas Brophy 02-Apr-13 21:22
Starry Night Pro precession calculation fix delayed 372 Thomas Brophy 10-May-13 22:39
Re: Starry Night Pro precession calculation fix delayed 323 loveritas 11-May-13 01:22
Re: Starry Night Pro precession calculation fix delayed 309 Spiros 13-May-13 22:10
What is your culminating declination? 305 Thomas Brophy 13-May-13 22:49
Re: What is your culminating declination? 291 Spiros 13-May-13 23:27
Re: What is your culminating declination? 314 Thomas Brophy 14-May-13 00:13
Re: What is your culminating declination? 265 Spiros 19-May-13 01:31
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 394 Thomas Brophy 21-Mar-13 04:20
Einstein Not Necessary 296 loveritas 21-Mar-13 06:37
Memory & Einstein 293 loveritas 24-Mar-13 23:10
Re: Memory & Einstein 331 Thomas Brophy 24-Mar-13 23:43
Re: Zep Tepi 301 Eddie Larry 14-May-13 03:45
Re: Zep Tepi 311 Sirfiroth 15-May-13 02:15
Re: Zep Tepi 272 Eddie Larry 15-May-13 03:02


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