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Simon Prentis Wrote:
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> On this particular point I would simply note that
> the so-called 'language gene' FOXP2 is not
> specific to language, even if it is implicated in
> certain language disorders. Indeed it is highly
> unlikely that any such single gene could be found,
> as with most behavioural characteristics. At best
> a 'suite' of genes might be identified, but the
> beauty of the 'digital' idea of the evolution of
> language is that it doesn't require such
> speculation, but is a stand-alone system. Our
> ability to use language makes use of cognitive
> capacities that we by-and-large share with many
> other primates. In my view, language is
> essentially a trick, not a trait -- albeit one
> that would have led us to evolve in a direction
> that enhanced our capacity to process it.

I take your point completely. The researchers in the study were not trying to imply FOXP2 or any other gene was the sole language gene. They had simply explored how small changes even SNP's in that gene and others such as ERC1 and BCL11A cause difficulties in cognizing language suggesting that there is a connection between them and how the brain processes. The thesis of the paper is that there is unlikely to be a single gene or even a gene system but that language is a process that combines both genotype and phenotype and even culture in a complicated sort of dance of neural and anatomical change.

At the end of the paper they speculate that our ability to process entire genomes at speed should now give us the tools to compare humans and other hominids who presumably did not have language for changes in genotype that could have allowed the sort of sophisticated ability with language that we possess. In other words now that we have more and more complete genomic information on other species of human it should be possibly, not easy, but possible to make comparisons about language by studying genes we know have an effect when there is variation even at at a single nucleotide level.

"Examination of the two amino-acid coding changes that distinguish the human sequence from that of chimpanzees reveals that they are not unique to humans (Krause et al. 2007) but also present in Neandertal and Denisovan samples. Some have taken this as one of the supporting points in favour of the view that our Neandertal cousins also possessed some form of spoken language (Dediu & Levinson, 2013), although it is important to stress that the status of a single gene is not enough to resolve whether or not an ancient hominin could speak. Further in-depth comparisons of modern human and Neandertal versions of FOXP2, examining the parts of the genetic locus that do not code for protein, identified human-specific changes that might potentially affect the way that the gene is regulated (Maricic et al., 2013). Although the functional data to support this hypothesis are tentative at present (Maricic et al., 2013), this work represents another example where ideas about evolutionary impact do not remain speculation, but are open to empirical testing."

"Other accounts consider the evolutionary emergence of proficient spoken language as a multistage process involving multiple phenotypic components and multiple genomic changes (Fitch, 2012), with some hypotheses placing importance on gene–culture interactions (Fisher & Ridley, 2013; Laland, Odling-Smee, & Myles, 2010). Now that we have access to comprehensive descriptions of genomic changes along different branches of the hominin tree, it will become feasible to empirically evaluate different evolutionary accounts, to assess which are more compatible with the available molecular data."

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 1353 Graham Hancock 07-Sep-21 11:10
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 152 greengirl5 07-Sep-21 21:53
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 141 greengirl5 07-Sep-21 22:59
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 160 Simon Prentis 08-Sep-21 11:49
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 114 Glass Jigsaw 10-Sep-21 21:13
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 105 Simon Prentis 11-Sep-21 21:51
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 116 Simon Prentis 08-Sep-21 11:42
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 152 cjcalleman 07-Sep-21 22:47
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 163 Simon Prentis 08-Sep-21 12:13
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 192 Susan Doris 08-Sep-21 00:58
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 126 Simon Prentis 08-Sep-21 13:37
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 164 Susan Doris 08-Sep-21 17:59
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 99 Simon Prentis 08-Sep-21 20:37
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 87 Susan Doris 09-Sep-21 05:13
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 149 cjcalleman 08-Sep-21 16:48
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 129 Simon Prentis 08-Sep-21 21:03
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 123 cjcalleman 09-Sep-21 00:15
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 132 Simon Prentis 09-Sep-21 00:48
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 175 greengirl5 09-Sep-21 04:53
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 89 Simon Prentis 09-Sep-21 18:26
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 88 cjcalleman 09-Sep-21 16:09
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 101 Simon Prentis 09-Sep-21 20:45
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 98 cjcalleman 10-Sep-21 17:22
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 134 Simon Prentis 10-Sep-21 20:34
Chemicals reacting 116 greengirl5 10-Sep-21 22:47
Re: Chemicals reacting 120 Eddie Larry 11-Sep-21 13:32
Re: Chemicals reacting 110 greengirl5 11-Sep-21 21:31
Re: Chemicals reacting 122 Simon Prentis 12-Sep-21 01:25
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 104 Susan Doris 11-Sep-21 05:59
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 89 Susan Doris 11-Sep-21 05:51
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 96 Simon Prentis 12-Sep-21 10:08
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 100 Susan Doris 13-Sep-21 05:07
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 128 Edmond 09-Sep-21 10:39
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 160 Eddie Larry 09-Sep-21 12:57
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 116 Simon Prentis 09-Sep-21 18:09
One original language 117 greengirl5 09-Sep-21 21:32
Re: One original language 126 Simon Prentis 09-Sep-21 23:56
Re: One original language - I just finished your book! 106 greengirl5 10-Sep-21 01:56
Re: One original language - I just finished your book! 95 Simon Prentis 10-Sep-21 17:47
Re: One original language - I just finished your book! 162 greengirl5 10-Sep-21 22:15
Re: One original language 99 cjcalleman 12-Sep-21 19:52
Re: One original language 113 Simon Prentis 13-Sep-21 01:13
Re: One original language 95 cjcalleman 13-Sep-21 17:10
Re: One original language 110 Simon Prentis 13-Sep-21 21:33
Re: One original language 88 Susan Doris 14-Sep-21 10:06
Re: One original language 110 greengirl5 14-Sep-21 13:01
Re: One original language 91 Susan Doris 14-Sep-21 13:09
Re: One original language 102 cjcalleman 14-Sep-21 15:31
Re: One original language 86 Simon Prentis 14-Sep-21 18:01
Clever animals, clever us! 92 greengirl5 14-Sep-21 22:33
Re: One original language 112 cjcalleman 15-Sep-21 17:57
Re: One original language 93 Susan Doris 16-Sep-21 05:23
Re: One original language 84 Eddie Larry 16-Sep-21 15:27
Re: One original language 139 Susan Doris 16-Sep-21 16:27
Re: One original language 92 cjcalleman 16-Sep-21 17:32
Re: One original language 98 Susan Doris 17-Sep-21 05:22
The tortoise and the hare 141 Eddie Larry 17-Sep-21 16:28
Re: The tortoise and the hare 83 cjcalleman 18-Sep-21 17:02
Re: The tortoise and the hare 73 Eddie Larry 18-Sep-21 18:03
Re: The tortoise and the hare 131 cjcalleman 18-Sep-21 19:42
Re: The tortoise and the hare 96 Susan Doris 19-Sep-21 04:37
Re: The tortoise and the hare 127 Sirius7237 19-Sep-21 05:10
Re: The tortoise and the hare 120 Susan Doris 19-Sep-21 08:36
Re: The tortoise and the hare 94 Sirius7237 19-Sep-21 14:18
Re: The tortoise and the hare 125 cjcalleman 19-Sep-21 19:05
Re: The tortoise and the hare 123 Sirius7237 19-Sep-21 22:52
Re: The tortoise and the hare 141 Glass Jigsaw 20-Sep-21 03:18
Re: The tortoise and the hare 83 Susan Doris 20-Sep-21 05:17
Respect for Simon 116 drrayeye 20-Sep-21 07:17
Re: Respect for Simon 118 Susan Doris 20-Sep-21 08:36
Re: Respect for Simon 120 Sirius7237 20-Sep-21 18:24
You just gish galloped again 97 drrayeye 20-Sep-21 18:28
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 175 Sirius7237 20-Sep-21 18:37
Re: Still waiting, Ray???????? 112 Sirius7237 20-Sep-21 18:52
Re: Ray???????? 119 Sirius7237 20-Sep-21 18:52
Re: Still waiting, Ray???????? 108 Glass Jigsaw 21-Sep-21 23:04
Re: Still waiting, Ray???????? 143 Sirius7237 22-Sep-21 00:30
Re: Still waiting, Ray???????? 103 Susan Doris 22-Sep-21 05:01
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 86 Susan Doris 21-Sep-21 05:44
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 85 Sirius7237 21-Sep-21 16:04
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 79 Susan Doris 21-Sep-21 16:38
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 75 Aine 27-Sep-21 00:37
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 71 Susan Doris 27-Sep-21 05:25
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 72 Eddie Larry 27-Sep-21 18:27
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 76 Aine 27-Sep-21 21:04
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 72 Eddie Larry 28-Sep-21 02:34
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 80 Sirius7237 28-Sep-21 03:24
Re: Just one example, Ray???????? 71 Aine 28-Sep-21 16:20
Re: Respect for Simon 92 Susan Doris 21-Sep-21 05:41
Re: The tortoise and the hare 136 Sirius7237 20-Sep-21 18:17
Re: The tortoise and the hare 76 Susan Doris 21-Sep-21 05:55
Re: The tortoise and the hare 102 Susan Doris 20-Sep-21 05:36
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 111 Edmond 20-Sep-21 12:18
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 126 Simon Prentis 20-Sep-21 14:03
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 99 cjcalleman 20-Sep-21 17:40
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 112 Simon Prentis 20-Sep-21 21:32
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 76 Susan Doris 21-Sep-21 07:24
Origin of language 116 Simon Prentis 22-Sep-21 01:08
Re: Origin of language 77 Susan Doris 22-Sep-21 05:11
Re: Origin of language 80 Simon Prentis 22-Sep-21 12:35
Re: Origin of language 74 Susan Doris 22-Sep-21 13:02
Re: Origin of language 67 Aine 27-Sep-21 00:19
Re: Origin of language 65 Susan Doris 27-Sep-21 05:36
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 67 Aine 27-Sep-21 01:04
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 70 Susan Doris 27-Sep-21 05:58
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 60 Aine 27-Sep-21 15:59
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 74 Susan Doris 27-Sep-21 18:01
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 67 Aine 27-Sep-21 21:09
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 77 cjcalleman 28-Sep-21 18:09
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 76 cjcalleman 21-Sep-21 18:37
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 120 drrayeye 21-Sep-21 23:42
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 76 cjcalleman 22-Sep-21 15:02
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 100 Simon Prentis 22-Sep-21 17:39
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 70 Susan Doris 23-Sep-21 05:49
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 91 Simon Prentis 23-Sep-21 11:43
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 116 cjcalleman 24-Sep-21 15:46
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 105 Simon Prentis 24-Sep-21 22:02
The structure of scientific revolutions 113 drrayeye 25-Sep-21 02:21
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 82 Edmond 25-Sep-21 09:51
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 85 Simon Prentis 25-Sep-21 11:44
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 108 Susan Doris 25-Sep-21 15:45
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 77 Edmond 27-Sep-21 07:24
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 72 Susan Doris 27-Sep-21 10:37
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 64 drrayeye 27-Sep-21 16:07
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 68 Susan Doris 27-Sep-21 18:04
Gives Simon perspective on alternative POV's 70 drrayeye 27-Sep-21 18:58
Re: Gives Simon perspective on alternative POV's 105 Susan Doris 28-Sep-21 05:09
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 67 Eddie Larry 27-Sep-21 16:34
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 70 Aine 27-Sep-21 17:31
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 62 Eddie Larry 27-Sep-21 17:54
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 62 Aine 27-Sep-21 21:14
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 67 Edmond 28-Sep-21 08:51
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions Catch 33 70 Eddie Larry 28-Sep-21 23:47
Jung 71 drrayeye 29-Sep-21 19:56
Re: Jung 68 Eddie Larry 29-Sep-21 23:02
archertypes 71 drrayeye 28-Sep-21 23:24
Re: archertypes 81 Susan Doris 29-Sep-21 05:30
Simon's book 64 drrayeye 29-Sep-21 19:44
Re: Simon's book 60 Susan Doris 30-Sep-21 05:34
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions 75 Simon Prentis 25-Sep-21 09:56
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions 81 drrayeye 25-Sep-21 18:18
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions 102 Sirius7237 25-Sep-21 18:27
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions 88 drrayeye 25-Sep-21 18:41
Re: Show one example of me gish galloping, ray - one example??. 85 Sirius7237 25-Sep-21 23:34
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions 125 Susan Doris 26-Sep-21 04:34
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions 139 Simon Prentis 25-Sep-21 18:57
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions 85 drrayeye 26-Sep-21 14:26
Re: The structure of scientific revolutions 66 Aine 26-Sep-21 23:50
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 100 Susan Doris 25-Sep-21 05:10
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 109 Susan Doris 22-Sep-21 05:21
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 75 Sirius7237 21-Sep-21 15:48
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 101 Sirius7237 20-Sep-21 18:33
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 116 Simon Prentis 20-Sep-21 21:49
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 73 Eddie Larry 20-Sep-21 23:16
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 73 Simon Prentis 20-Sep-21 23:45
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 71 Sirius7237 21-Sep-21 00:06
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 99 Simon Prentis 21-Sep-21 01:05
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 75 Susan Doris 21-Sep-21 05:40
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 86 Sirius7237 21-Sep-21 15:40
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 95 Susan Doris 20-Sep-21 14:19
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 77 Sirius7237 20-Sep-21 19:08
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 123 Eddie Larry 20-Sep-21 20:10
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 123 Sirius7237 20-Sep-21 21:04
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 119 Eddie Larry 20-Sep-21 21:24
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 114 Sirius7237 21-Sep-21 00:18
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 116 Eddie Larry 21-Sep-21 19:02
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 99 Eddie Larry 20-Sep-21 15:49
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 91 Edmond 21-Sep-21 07:39
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 89 Simon Prentis 21-Sep-21 10:36
some perspective 91 drrayeye 21-Sep-21 17:42
Is it just me... 122 Simon Prentis 22-Sep-21 00:44
Re: Is it just me... 88 Sirius7237 22-Sep-21 00:56
Re: Is it just me... 123 Simon Prentis 22-Sep-21 01:38
Re: Is it just me... 116 Sirius7237 22-Sep-21 04:04
Re: Is it just me... 126 Simon Prentis 22-Sep-21 11:44
Re: Is it just me... 75 Sirius7237 22-Sep-21 22:39
Re: Is it just me... 110 Simon Prentis 23-Sep-21 14:01
Re: Is it just me... 76 Susan Doris 23-Sep-21 15:05
Re: Is it just me... 92 Susan Doris 22-Sep-21 06:09
Terrific! 73 drrayeye 22-Sep-21 01:36
Re: Is it just me... 88 Susan Doris 22-Sep-21 06:00
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 97 Edmond 22-Sep-21 09:09
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 128 Susan Doris 22-Sep-21 13:21
Re: The tortoise and the hare, evolutionary paradigm problems 104 Eddie Larry 21-Sep-21 17:47
Re: The tortoise and the hare 81 Aine 27-Sep-21 01:16
Re: The tortoise and the hare 75 Sirius7237 28-Sep-21 03:21
Re: The tortoise and the hare 67 Aine 28-Sep-21 16:23
Re: The tortoise and the hare with oxygen 83 Edmond 28-Sep-21 08:59
Re: The tortoise and the hare with oxygen 60 Sirius7237 29-Sep-21 02:31
Re: The tortoise and the hare with oxygen and time 101 Edmond 30-Sep-21 08:36
Re: The tortoise and the snowshoe hare 128 Sirius7237 01-Oct-21 18:10
Re: The tortoise and the hare 71 cjcalleman 28-Sep-21 18:01
Re: The tortoise and the hare 80 Susan Doris 19-Sep-21 04:50
Re: One original language 84 Susan Doris 14-Sep-21 10:16
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 135 drrayeye 09-Sep-21 19:22
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 104 Simon Prentis 09-Sep-21 21:08
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Do Re Mi 135 Edmond 10-Sep-21 09:37
Re: Do Re Mi 105 Simon Prentis 10-Sep-21 14:09
Re: Do Re Mi 111 Susan Doris 10-Sep-21 15:38
Re: Do Re Mi 103 Simon Prentis 10-Sep-21 18:08
Re: Do Re Mi 79 greengirl5 10-Sep-21 23:07
Re: Do Re Mi 92 Susan Doris 11-Sep-21 07:03
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 99 Christine 10-Sep-21 10:33
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 90 Simon Prentis 10-Sep-21 14:27
Re: Strange similarity? 118 Sirius7237 10-Sep-21 16:37
Re: Strange similarity? 126 Simon Prentis 10-Sep-21 21:01
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 109 Edmond 10-Sep-21 17:04
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 117 greengirl5 10-Sep-21 23:18
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 146 Sirius7237 11-Sep-21 15:57
Re: Scripts also use archetypal structure 128 Edmond 12-Sep-21 09:23
Re: Scripts also use archetypal structure 89 Susan Doris 12-Sep-21 09:56
Re: Indus and Harappan script as emblems 70 Edmond 28-Sep-21 09:34
The word became flesh 137 Edmond 11-Sep-21 08:26
Re: The word became flesh 103 Simon Prentis 12-Sep-21 11:59
Archetype is also in language 92 Edmond 14-Sep-21 10:23
Re: Archetype is also in language 129 Susan Doris 14-Sep-21 13:02
Thanks, Edmond 128 drrayeye 14-Sep-21 20:09
Re: Archetype is also in language 107 Simon Prentis 15-Sep-21 00:52
Archetype is also in language 86 Edmond 15-Sep-21 09:33
Re: Archetype is also in language 109 Susan Doris 15-Sep-21 15:05
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 89 Susan Doris 15-Sep-21 09:36
Swear words. 158 greengirl5 15-Sep-21 13:20
Re: Swear words. 76 Simon Prentis 24-Sep-21 10:04
Re: Welcome to Simon Prentis Author of the Month for September 2021 74 Susan Doris 30-Sep-21 05:49


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