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Dear Kimberley

In regards to (Luke 7:37-38), the main thrust of this programme that I watched was that from a historical point of view that there were a lot of women called Mary at the time and that perhaps M Mag was deliberately associated with this particular Mary who was a walker of the night (to put it politely). I am all for the idea of redemption and forgiveness though regardless of whether M Magdalene was a lady of ill repute or not and you are that right it is an excellent lesson in humility.

You said

“In the book of Genesis we read: "therefore shall a man leave his family and cleave unto his wife and the two shall become one." They are not two separate people anymore, but one.

This is why Paul said what he did. As long as there were good men to spread the Gospel, the woman were to listen and learn. This was only to avoid power struggles between men and women in the churches. There IS a certain amount of dignity in silence and "taming the tongue." For when one keeps silent, they keep from offending anyone. Very difficult to do.”

While I agree with completely with the first part, I have a problem with women roles to listen and learn. I feel that we all should listen and learn regardless of our sex and we all should be able to have a voice IMHO. I feel that God has many ways of making his voice heard through people but I do not feel that it is completely the man’s prerogative to be that mouth piece. So perhaps you could say I am not St. Pauls biggest fan on this! This again is in my humble opinion and I would not want to offend you in anyway. The trick is to know when to keep you mouth shut, as you say – something that I am still trying to get right as I can be a little on the opinionated side at times:-)

However, one other point that the programme raised was that from studying the other Gospels was that as Alatariel pointed out there seemed to be a power struggle between Mary and Peter. Mary, so the this documentary claimed, really “got” Jesus’s teachings better than perhaps than some of the other disciples and that she got one to one teaching from him and that he valued her highly. It also seems that she became a leader in her own right as did other women that followed her. This however was suppressed later in the Church’s evolution. She did meet all the criteria of a disciple in the sense that she received his teaching and was very much a part of ministry, the only thing that made her different was the fact that she a woman. I am of course taking this from a secondary source and have not read the translations myself of the other Gospels which is on my ever growing list of things to read!!!

I do like your point about the Old Testament women by the way! I also have got a lot out of talking with you about this and have really enjoyed the evidence that you have presented. You have been very generous with your time to me. I have quite a few gaps and you have really helped me fill a few in - Thank you :-)

Warm regards

Susie

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Mysticism and Knights Templars 786 Melusine 26-Feb-04 04:39
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 388 Mark Staab 26-Feb-04 05:21
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 309 Melusine 26-Feb-04 13:31
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 307 Kboldt 26-Feb-04 15:52
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 271 Melusine 26-Feb-04 18:23
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 355 Dominick Ohrbeck 15-Mar-04 18:35
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 348 Milo 26-Feb-04 15:58
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 312 Melusine 26-Feb-04 18:28
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 390 Milo 26-Feb-04 19:43
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 300 Melusine 26-Feb-04 21:06
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 309 Milo 26-Feb-04 21:13
Re: I found an interesting site for you Milo 403 Melusine 28-Feb-04 17:41
Re: I found an interesting site for you Milo 304 Milo 28-Feb-04 18:11
Re: I found an interesting site for you Milo 316 Melusine 28-Feb-04 18:21
Will do, thanks! n/t 318 Milo 28-Feb-04 18:29
Smokescreen for science and wealth? 294 ananda 02-Mar-04 15:46
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 300 Milo 02-Mar-04 19:19
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 304 Kboldt 02-Mar-04 20:24
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 294 Milo 02-Mar-04 20:58
I forgot to add... 318 Milo 02-Mar-04 21:05
Re: I forgot to add... 348 Kboldt 02-Mar-04 21:28
Superiority raises its ugly head 292 Archietype 03-Mar-04 08:12
Re: Superiority raises its ugly head 321 Milo 03-Mar-04 15:10
Re: Superiority raises its ugly head 324 Archietype 04-Mar-04 17:25
Re: Superiority raises its ugly head 318 Milo 04-Mar-04 17:48
Re: writing 393 Archietype 04-Mar-04 18:31
Re: Superiority raises its ugly head 308 Mark Staab 04-Mar-04 18:08
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 341 Alatariel 04-Mar-04 00:42
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 299 Melusine 04-Mar-04 01:10
Over the Rainbow... 393 Milo 04-Mar-04 01:26
Re: Over the Rainbow... 367 Melusine 04-Mar-04 01:39
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 341 Lee McGiffen 04-Mar-04 09:32
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 322 Melusine 04-Mar-04 09:48
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 396 Milo 04-Mar-04 01:13
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 313 Melusine 04-Mar-04 10:04
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 364 Melusine 04-Mar-04 10:07
My two cents... 337 Milo 04-Mar-04 16:16
Re: My two cents... 314 Kboldt 04-Mar-04 18:09
Re: My two cents... 251 Milo 04-Mar-04 19:23
Re: My two cents... 274 Kboldt 04-Mar-04 19:32
Re: My two cents... 367 Milo 04-Mar-04 20:30
Re: My two cents... 348 Melusine 05-Mar-04 09:30
Re: My two cents... 249 Kboldt 05-Mar-04 13:49
Re: My two cents... 285 Melusine 04-Mar-04 21:46
Re: My two cents... 225 Milo 04-Mar-04 22:32
On further thought... 300 Milo 05-Mar-04 06:08
Re: On further thought... 348 Melusine 06-Mar-04 15:29
Re: On further thought... 299 Milo 06-Mar-04 16:55
Re: My two cents too 250 Alatariel 05-Mar-04 01:30
Re: My two cents too 280 Milo 05-Mar-04 02:09
Re: My two cents too 290 debraregypt 07-Mar-04 17:27
Re: My two cents too 273 Milo 07-Mar-04 18:31
Re: My two cents too 343 Melusine 09-Mar-04 07:41
Re: My two cents too 331 Milo 09-Mar-04 08:07
Re: My two cents too 282 Mark Staab 09-Mar-04 08:56
Re: My two cents too 299 Melusine 09-Mar-04 22:13
Re: My two cents too 339 debraregypt 10-Mar-04 01:08
Re: My two cents too 293 Milo 10-Mar-04 01:19
Re: My two cents too 337 Kboldt 10-Mar-04 15:01
Big Misunderstanding!!! 345 Milo 10-Mar-04 16:59
Re: Big Misunderstanding!!! 331 Kboldt 10-Mar-04 17:36
Some more cents... 283 Anthony Taylor 09-Mar-04 19:37
Re: Some more cents... 287 Milo 09-Mar-04 20:12
Re: Some more cents... 303 Melusine 09-Mar-04 22:22
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 238 Alatariel 05-Mar-04 01:23
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 318 Milo 05-Mar-04 02:36
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 351 smetters 05-Mar-04 13:31
The Message of the Marriage of Cana 383 Kboldt 05-Mar-04 17:08
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 331 smetters 05-Mar-04 17:30
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 281 Kboldt 08-Mar-04 13:52
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 322 smetters 08-Mar-04 17:47
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 343 Kboldt 08-Mar-04 19:49
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 364 Alatariel 08-Mar-04 22:40
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 348 Melusine 09-Mar-04 08:20
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 374 smetters 09-Mar-04 13:27
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 320 Kboldt 09-Mar-04 13:45
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 275 Mark Staab 09-Mar-04 15:02
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 369 smetters 09-Mar-04 15:31
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 304 Mark Staab 09-Mar-04 15:57
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 328 smetters 09-Mar-04 16:54
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 295 Melusine 09-Mar-04 22:37
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 273 Mark Staab 10-Mar-04 01:42
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 304 Melusine 11-Mar-04 01:52
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 299 Mark Staab 11-Mar-04 07:03
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 368 Mark Staab 09-Mar-04 16:35
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 228 Melusine 09-Mar-04 22:32
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 299 smetters 10-Mar-04 10:45
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 284 smetters 09-Mar-04 15:18
I for got this part... 369 Kboldt 05-Mar-04 18:03
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 365 Milo 05-Mar-04 18:21
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 340 Alatariel 07-Mar-04 03:16
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 407 Milo 07-Mar-04 04:13
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 276 David L 07-Mar-04 05:30
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 282 Milo 07-Mar-04 05:35
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 288 David L 07-Mar-04 05:48
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 287 Milo 07-Mar-04 06:20
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 354 Melusine 11-Mar-04 02:05
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 263 Kboldt 08-Mar-04 14:53
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 349 Milo 08-Mar-04 16:16
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 371 Alatariel 07-Mar-04 15:58
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 305 David L 07-Mar-04 05:36
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 379 Melusine 11-Mar-04 02:03
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 349 Nebankh 07-Mar-04 22:30
Re: The Message of the Marriage of Cana 300 Melusine 11-Mar-04 04:00
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 301 ananda 04-Mar-04 13:10
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 296 smetters 04-Mar-04 13:34
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 354 ananda 02-Mar-04 23:14
Feudalism is still with us, thanks to the secret socieites 347 Milo 02-Mar-04 23:40
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 287 Melusine 03-Mar-04 03:01
Re: Smokescreen for science and wealth? 378 ananda 03-Mar-04 03:36
The Biblical struggle against the anti-Christ 338 Milo 03-Mar-04 04:25
Re: The Biblical struggle against the anti-Christ 258 Melusine 03-Mar-04 11:50
Re: The Biblical struggle against the anti-Christ 338 Milo 03-Mar-04 15:21
Re: The Biblical struggle against the anti-Christ 286 Melusine 04-Mar-04 01:46
Re: The Biblical struggle against the anti-Christ 334 Milo 04-Mar-04 02:03
Re: The Biblical struggle against the anti-Christ 351 Melusine 04-Mar-04 09:52
Re: The Biblical struggle against the anti-Christ 336 Milo 04-Mar-04 16:45
Re: The Biblical struggle against the anti-Christ 277 Melusine 04-Mar-04 19:54
Re: The Biblical struggle against the anti-Christ 287 Milo 04-Mar-04 20:28
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 292 smetters 03-Mar-04 20:49
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 298 Alatariel 04-Mar-04 00:52
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 338 Melusine 04-Mar-04 01:57
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 264 Alatariel 08-Mar-04 00:03
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 345 Melusine 09-Mar-04 08:00
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 347 Melusine 04-Mar-04 01:37
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 422 smetters 04-Mar-04 13:45
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 341 Melusine 04-Mar-04 16:08
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 296 smetters 04-Mar-04 18:34
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 303 ananda 04-Mar-04 18:47
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 320 Melusine 04-Mar-04 19:45
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 290 Melusine 05-Mar-04 10:07
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 360 smetters 05-Mar-04 12:46
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 284 Melusine 05-Mar-04 16:09
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 338 smetters 05-Mar-04 16:35
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 241 Alatariel 05-Mar-04 00:58
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 272 ArmchairObserver 05-Mar-04 09:28
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 322 Milo 04-Mar-04 17:01
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 297 smetters 04-Mar-04 19:00
Lucifer and the Great Work 290 Milo 04-Mar-04 20:16
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 234 Anne-Marie 05-Mar-04 07:01
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 304 Melusine 05-Mar-04 19:41
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 324 Milo 06-Mar-04 02:07
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 360 ArmchairObserver 06-Mar-04 09:13
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 336 Milo 06-Mar-04 17:02
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 254 ArmchairObserver 06-Mar-04 18:33
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 251 Milo 06-Mar-04 19:40
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 343 Anne-Marie 07-Mar-04 00:09
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 276 Milo 07-Mar-04 01:14
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 307 Anne-Marie 07-Mar-04 07:22
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 341 Milo 07-Mar-04 09:02
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 318 Melusine 11-Mar-04 03:53
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 321 Milo 11-Mar-04 05:43
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 257 ArmchairObserver 07-Mar-04 03:19
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 312 Milo 07-Mar-04 04:07
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 277 ArmchairObserver 07-Mar-04 06:27
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 364 Milo 07-Mar-04 09:51
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 257 ArmchairObserver 07-Mar-04 21:10
The Grail Bloodline Drank Menstrual Blood 1076 Milo 07-Mar-04 22:30
Re: The Grail Bloodline Drank Menstrual Blood 286 ArmchairObserver 08-Mar-04 03:28
Re: The Grail Bloodline Drank Menstrual Blood 299 Milo 08-Mar-04 04:12
Re: The Grail Bloodline Drank Menstrual Blood 367 ArmchairObserver 08-Mar-04 05:10
Re: The Grail Bloodline Drank Menstrual Blood 296 Milo 08-Mar-04 05:29
Re: The Grail Bloodline Drank Menstrual Blood 273 Alatariel 08-Mar-04 12:40
Re: The Grail Bloodline Drank Menstrual Blood 314 Milo 08-Mar-04 16:21
Re: The Grail Bloodline Drank Menstrual Blood 330 ArmchairObserver 08-Mar-04 16:32
Re: The Grail Bloodline Drank Menstrual Blood 266 Mark Staab 08-Mar-04 20:31
PPS 277 Mark Staab 08-Mar-04 20:38
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 282 smetters 08-Mar-04 18:12
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 359 ArmchairObserver 08-Mar-04 20:04
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 272 smetters 09-Mar-04 12:23
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 312 ArmchairObserver 09-Mar-04 19:57
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 330 smetters 10-Mar-04 17:41
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 283 ArmchairObserver 10-Mar-04 18:36
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 292 smetters 11-Mar-04 13:03
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 333 ArmchairObserver 11-Mar-04 18:57
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 346 smetters 12-Mar-04 12:15
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 278 Melusine 09-Mar-04 22:54
Re: Left-Handed and Red Hair 353 Kboldt 09-Mar-04 23:00
Re: Left-Handed and Red Hair 419 ArmchairObserver 10-Mar-04 06:54
Re: Left-Handed and Red Hair 294 Briffits 10-Mar-04 08:21
Re: Left-Handed and Red Hair 257 ArmchairObserver 10-Mar-04 18:38
Re: Left-Handed and Red Hair 332 Artificer 10-Mar-04 23:35
Re: Left-Handed and Red Hair 260 smetters 11-Mar-04 12:50
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 319 ArmchairObserver 10-Mar-04 07:15
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 258 Melusine 11-Mar-04 02:36
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 271 ArmchairObserver 11-Mar-04 05:13
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 328 Milo 11-Mar-04 05:50
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 331 ArmchairObserver 11-Mar-04 21:43
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 305 Milo 12-Mar-04 01:13
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 304 ArmchairObserver 12-Mar-04 04:56
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 260 Melusine 06-Mar-04 14:45
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 346 Milo 06-Mar-04 17:04
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 301 Melusine 06-Mar-04 19:16
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 273 Milo 06-Mar-04 20:14
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 249 Melusine 06-Mar-04 20:32
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 263 Milo 06-Mar-04 21:01
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 323 smetters 05-Mar-04 13:25
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 382 Milo 05-Mar-04 18:18
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 244 smetters 08-Mar-04 17:54
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 262 Milo 08-Mar-04 22:35
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 290 smetters 09-Mar-04 12:28
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 298 Melusine 05-Mar-04 20:11
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 305 Alatariel 07-Mar-04 03:54
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 292 David L 07-Mar-04 04:59
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 325 Milo 07-Mar-04 05:07
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 238 David L 07-Mar-04 05:09
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 320 Milo 07-Mar-04 05:16
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 292 smetters 08-Mar-04 13:50
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 340 Milo 08-Mar-04 16:25
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 281 Milo 08-Mar-04 16:27
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 360 Kboldt 08-Mar-04 16:31
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 315 smetters 08-Mar-04 17:29
Re: Lucifer and the Great Work 335 smetters 08-Mar-04 17:56
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 295 David L 07-Mar-04 04:07
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 322 Milo 07-Mar-04 04:22
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 288 David L 07-Mar-04 04:52
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 326 Milo 07-Mar-04 05:03
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 333 David L 07-Mar-04 05:07
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 291 Milo 07-Mar-04 05:18
Mod comment 248 ArmchairObserver 07-Mar-04 06:57
Re: Mod comment 291 Milo 07-Mar-04 09:55
Re: Mod comment 364 ArmchairObserver 07-Mar-04 18:24
Re: Mod comment 384 Milo 07-Mar-04 18:44
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 278 smetters 08-Mar-04 13:31
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 286 David L 08-Mar-04 15:16
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 291 smetters 08-Mar-04 17:00
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 257 David L 07-Mar-04 04:34
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 327 Milo 07-Mar-04 04:58
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 277 David L 07-Mar-04 05:03
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 278 Milo 07-Mar-04 05:11
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 262 Melusine 11-Mar-04 03:57
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 267 Milo 11-Mar-04 06:08
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 318 Melusine 15-Mar-04 23:44
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 285 Milo 16-Mar-04 00:10
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 329 Milo 16-Mar-04 00:50
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 350 Melusine 17-Mar-04 03:00
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 348 Milo 17-Mar-04 06:25
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 315 Melusine 17-Mar-04 23:15
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 298 Milo 17-Mar-04 23:59
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 618 Joyeuse 18-Mar-04 00:38
Re: Mysticism and Knights Templars 304 Dominick Ohrbeck 12-Mar-04 07:38
Templar Cross at Temple of Karnak, Egypt 266 fisherman 15-Mar-04 23:50
fixed link 260 Dominick Ohrbeck 12-Mar-04 18:09
Re: fixed link 298 Melusine 15-Mar-04 23:31
Re: fixed link 289 Dominick Ohrbeck 16-Mar-04 01:47
Re: fixed link 316 Dominick Ohrbeck 17-Mar-04 18:00


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