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Re: Jason Colavito part Four - on Hancock re Rogan and Magicians of the Gods

Ray, today has been a writing day! I will conclude this riveting analysis with Colavito's remarks about Graham.
I strongly agree that Colavito is very hard on Hancock, but I would say that some of his criticisms are fair comment, and indicative of one who understands underlying issues light years better than Shermer and that other guy.

JC Hancock, on the other hand, was eloquent but idiotic, and painfully quick to anger at the least provocation. I was frankly surprised that he couldn’t hold his cool for more than a few minutes at a time.

A funny thing, since both names came up elsewhere on this thread, here's what Jason had to say about Krupp's view of the OCT: "Hancock is still fuming-red angry over criticisms made of the Orion Correlation Theory two decades ago. He spent an inordinate amount of time arguing about Ed Krupp’s (wrong) claim that the Orion correlation is “upside-down,” a mistake that he fought about for years in the 1990s."

JC of Krupp and the OCT: "Wrong."

That said, I will disagree with Jason on Graham's reaction. He had a total right to be pissed. In parts 2 and 3, we just saw two examples of how flagrantly unfair cadres of pseudo skeptics have been to Graham over the last two decades. Rarely do they put themselves in a position to be called out, as Shermer did by appearing live on Rogan. Grahams' reactions were quite inevitable reaction, based on decades of unfair treatment. I have no problem with Hancock's anger. Nor, given the past, should it be the least bit surprising.

Let me say what I liked about Magicians. Graham did some fine research, and he was smart to show that increasing numbers of academics are supporting the general idea that something major happened right around 12,800 BC. The amount of research is impressive, and it seemed clear to me that he had learned that he had best seek to align himself with large numbers of academics, rather than go solo, or relatively solo, as he has done in the past.

But Magicians turned out to be a tale of two subjects for me, and in Hancockian fashion this geology got intertwined with 'alternative' archaeology that points to Graham's Lost Civilization thesis.

Colavito shows good discernment in recognizing this distinction. He said he would have come after Hancock based on the Lost Civilization angle, rather than the geology stuff, I agree that would be the far better course in a debate, because the geology material looked pretty rock solid.

Others may be quick to ridicule, but I found Graham's suggestion that some 'ancients' possibly used the same 'handbag' to be fair comment. It wasn't particularly interesting, nor well developed, but it was straightforward and, reasonable comment because the recurrence of the handbag at least seemed quite improbable, (and when things appear to be non-random, it becomes reasonable to consider other explanations).

More importantly, as I recall - looking back years later - Graham did make clear that this was a possibility at best. That kind of clarity is important to me and so, by the same reasoning, I felt let down around the point Graham made regarding one of the Gobleki Tepi stones showing a Sun, which may pertain to a possible catastrophe that the Mayans may have predicted via the 2012 turning of their Long Count calendar.

The 'problem' I have, is that Graham was making this suggestion based on John Major Jenkins' Galactic Alignment Theory, whereby the Sun during this era will be in the range of the centre of the Milky Way for around 40 years. [Jenkins: "the Galactic Alignment "zone" is 1998 +/- 18 years = 1980 - 2016. This is "era-2012."[alignment2012.com] ]
I believe Graham referenced an expanded time zone, although not by much more than Jenkins, if he did. My problem is that Graham didn't go into any detail regarding how accurate his proposed Mayan Galactic Zone hit was. It had seemed to me that he ought to know that it wasn't a particularly good hit, in fact we would be leaving Jenkins' zone (20160 at the time of Magicians' publication.

I felt Graham failed in this example for the same reason that he had 'succeeded' in the handbag one: for being transparent. It was disappointing. Magicians seemed to fundamentally rely on this Mayan association - as that would legitimize the warning that the Gobleki stones are about something that may be urgent (while furthering the Lost Civilization thesis). I would imagine that a lot of readers would have failed to recognize this, because Graham had touched on it so lightly. To discuss the pros and cons of Graham's idea would have led to less sizzle.

Colavito writes - Hancock disingenuously denies being a “doom and gloom” prophet of destruction, which is silly since he twice made prophecies about the coming end of the world. He waves this away by saying that he is a reporter so he is only reporting the ideas of others.

And I would agree that this doesn't tell the whole picture, Ray. Graham must be more than a reporter. His books must provide something that will sell them, and here we move into the literary-entertainment realm. No longer is it enough to present a book that only involves revolutionary breakthroughs in geology. The publisher needs sizzle. Sometimes the actual content provides that, as with the Orion Correlation Theory. In this case it does not, and a reporter would offer greater disclosure.

Thing is, some will say that this isn't the first time Graham has done this sort of thing, and Colavito isn't alone. I suppose that it may come down to how one views catastrophic subject matter, and personally, I don't feel the least bit threatened by pending comet strikes or asteroid showers, etc. But others feel differently, and so it can be easily argued that one should take care when presenting radical 'alternative' theses, especially when mitigating information is so readily available.

I've grown tired of seeing this sort of thing over the years, which I have come to associate with the likes of Ancient Aliens and Coast to Coast.

So, let us disagree about Jason, Ray. He may not be perfect, but I think he's far better than Krupp, Shermer and what's-his-face. Then again, if you can show some reasons where Colavito is being egregiously unfair to Hancock, I'm open to new ideas. Mark



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 25-May-19 16:29 by Poster Boy.

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Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 253 grangram 28-Apr-19 15:27
The Women Behind Every Great Man. 245 Itatw70s 29-Apr-19 22:58
Re: The Women Behind Every Great Man. 217 Susan Doris 30-Apr-19 09:40
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 265 PB Bytes 28-Apr-19 14:44
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 245 PB Bytes 29-Apr-19 00:12
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Re: Further thoughts Female Saints 242 PB Bytes 29-Apr-19 14:29
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Re: The Mauling of the Magdalene 223 PB Bytes 02-May-19 18:40
Re: The Mauling of the Magdalene EDITED 250 eyeofhorus33 02-May-19 20:26
Re: The Mauling of the Magdalene EDITED 234 drrayeye 03-May-19 17:14
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Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 213 PB Bytes 05-May-19 15:17
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 213 Eddie Larry 05-May-19 17:53
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 206 PB Bytes 05-May-19 18:02
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Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 215 PB Bytes 05-May-19 18:26
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 208 Eddie Larry 05-May-19 19:10
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 231 PB Bytes 05-May-19 21:54
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 208 Eddie Larry 05-May-19 22:13
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 220 Itatw70s 05-May-19 22:50
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 230 PB Bytes 05-May-19 23:29
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 222 Itatw70s 05-May-19 23:56
Virgin birth? 246 eyeofhorus33 06-May-19 19:07
Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 220 PB Bytes 07-May-19 02:18
Re: Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 220 Susan Doris 07-May-19 05:25
Re: Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 228 PB Bytes 08-May-19 14:24
Re: Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 218 Susan Doris 08-May-19 15:21
Re: Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 208 PB Bytes 10-May-19 00:24
Re: Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 212 Susan Doris 10-May-19 05:18
Re: Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 212 PB Bytes 10-May-19 14:32
Re: Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 229 drrayeye 07-May-19 07:03
Re: Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 234 eyeofhorus33 07-May-19 19:39
Re: Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 221 drrayeye 07-May-19 21:27
Re: Regarding the MYTH of the 'Virgin birth myth' 223 eyeofhorus33 08-May-19 16:21
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Re: Micah: The formation of dogma in the Christian church 232 drrayeye 09-May-19 17:48
Re: Micah: The formation of dogma in the Christian church 214 PB Bytes 09-May-19 18:07
The Luminous Vision? 217 grangram 10-May-19 05:27
Re: The Luminous Vision? 221 PB Bytes 13-May-19 20:46
Re: The Luminous Vision? 247 PB Bytes 13-May-19 21:45
Re: The Luminous Vision? 215 grangram 22-May-19 06:11
IVF is not divinely created biblical 'virgin birth' 251 eyeofhorus33 07-May-19 19:48
Re: IVF is not divinely created biblical 'virgin birth' 236 PB Bytes 07-May-19 20:14
Re: IVF is not divinely created biblical 'virgin birth' 245 eyeofhorus33 07-May-19 21:10
Re: IVF is not divinely created biblical 'virgin birth' 222 PB Bytes 07-May-19 21:42
The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 221 Itatw70s 07-May-19 22:27
Re: The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 218 PB Bytes 07-May-19 22:54
Re: The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 234 Itatw70s 07-May-19 23:47
Re: The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 221 PB Bytes 08-May-19 00:30
Re: The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 208 Itatw70s 08-May-19 11:52
Re: The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 213 PB Bytes 08-May-19 14:27
Re: The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 215 Itatw70s 08-May-19 15:16
Re: The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 213 Eddie Larry 08-May-19 17:12
Re: The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 215 Itatw70s 08-May-19 18:51
Re: The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 227 Susan Doris 08-May-19 15:26
Re: The birth of Christianity. Based upon mythology and neccessity in the Roman Empire. 215 Itatw70s 08-May-19 18:53
The spirit is not born of woman. But it is the life force in both men and women? 245 grangram 08-May-19 08:47
Re: The spirit is not born of woman. But it is the life force in both men and women? 221 Susan Doris 08-May-19 11:43
Re: The spirit is not born of woman. But it is the life force in both men and women? 223 PB Bytes 08-May-19 14:21
Re: The spirit is not born of woman. But it is the life force in both men and women? 221 Susan Doris 08-May-19 15:33
No 213 drrayeye 08-May-19 18:37
Re: No 217 Itatw70s 08-May-19 22:20
Re: No 206 Susan Doris 09-May-19 05:41
Re: No 219 Itatw70s 09-May-19 11:33
Re: No 213 Susan Doris 09-May-19 05:32
Re: No 234 drrayeye 09-May-19 06:30
Re: No 220 Susan Doris 09-May-19 12:35
Re: No 205 Eddie Larry 09-May-19 14:17
Re: No 204 Susan Doris 09-May-19 15:30
Re: No 209 Eddie Larry 09-May-19 20:43
Re: Nowhere near the final exegesis of the mind. 222 Itatw70s 09-May-19 23:06
Going around in circles 220 drrayeye 09-May-19 16:00
Re: Going around in circles 211 Itatw70s 09-May-19 16:24
Re: The spirit is not born of woman. But it is the life force in both men and women? 221 PB Bytes 10-May-19 00:15
Re: The spirit is not born of woman. But it is the life force in both men and women? 227 PB Bytes 08-May-19 14:29
As above, so below.... 302 PB Bytes 08-May-19 20:56
thanks 205 grangram 09-May-19 08:14
Re: thanks 210 PB Bytes 09-May-19 14:02
yeah 212 grangram 09-May-19 15:49
Catholic-universal? 209 PB Bytes 13-May-19 20:07
Re: IVF is not divinely created biblical 'virgin birth' 223 PB Bytes 07-May-19 22:47
Re: IVF is not divinely created biblical 'virgin birth' 213 Susan Doris 08-May-19 07:32
Re: IVF is not divinely created biblical 'virgin birth' 204 Susan Doris 08-May-19 05:39
Re: IVF is not divinely created biblical 'virgin birth' 221 eyeofhorus33 08-May-19 22:04
Problem is 209 drrayeye 09-May-19 07:55
"Bible worthless as history" 219 eyeofhorus33 09-May-19 10:50
Re: "Bible worthless as history" 206 drrayeye 09-May-19 13:18
Re: "Bible worthless as history" 216 Susan Doris 09-May-19 14:09
Re: "Bible worthless as history" 195 Eddie Larry 09-May-19 14:23
Re: "Bible worthless as history" 197 Susan Doris 09-May-19 16:05
Re: "Bible worthless as history" 204 Eddie Larry 09-May-19 20:53
a little strong 212 drrayeye 09-May-19 17:00
Jesus' Female Disciples. 199 grangram 10-May-19 05:14
Here we go again... 210 PB Bytes 09-May-19 16:31
Re: Here we go again... 210 Susan Doris 09-May-19 17:12
First, 214 drrayeye 09-May-19 18:26
Re: First, 210 Susan Doris 10-May-19 05:39
Academic thinking 217 drrayeye 09-May-19 18:14
Re: Academic thinking 204 PB Bytes 09-May-19 19:12
Tolstoy thinking 212 PB Bytes 12-May-19 13:12
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Rohl's Revised Chronology 226 eyeofhorus33 18-May-19 17:42
Re: Rohl's Revised Chronology 203 grangram 19-May-19 04:43
Re: Rohl's Revised Chronology 210 eyeofhorus33 19-May-19 14:36
Re: Rohl's Revised Chronology 212 grangram 21-May-19 07:26
Thank you 230 eyeofhorus33 21-May-19 21:02
Re: Thank you 214 PB Bytes 22-May-19 02:02
Indeed 218 eyeofhorus33 22-May-19 17:19
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Re: Psuedo intellectual dishonesty 211 eyeofhorus33 22-May-19 18:53
Re: Psuedo intellectual dishonesty 197 PB Bytes 22-May-19 19:12
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Re: Speechless (with an edited to add comment--ooh, I'm sooo scared) 211 PB Bytes 22-May-19 20:10
Re: Speechless (with an edited to add comment--ooh, I'm sooo scared) 243 eyeofhorus33 22-May-19 20:33
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Re: Thornborough, Giza & Orion Shining Above-Below 203 PB Bytes 23-May-19 14:27
Jason Colavito 202 drrayeye 23-May-19 17:59
Re: Jason Calovito 194 PB Bytes 23-May-19 18:09
Re: Jason Colavito 198 drrayeye 23-May-19 23:58
Can't even spell his name correctly (n/t) 224 eyeofhorus33 24-May-19 14:00
corrected 194 drrayeye 24-May-19 15:37
Re: Jason Colavito part One 201 PB Bytes 24-May-19 15:37
Re: Jason Colavito part One 202 drrayeye 24-May-19 16:18
Re: Jason Colavito part Four - on Hancock re Rogan and Magicians of the Gods 222 PB Bytes 24-May-19 22:46
It's Jason's debunkatron POV 207 drrayeye 25-May-19 18:53
Re: It's Jason's debunkatron POV 198 PB Bytes 25-May-19 19:26
Re: It's Jason's debunkatron POV 204 PB Bytes 26-May-19 00:57
Re: It's Jason's debunkatron POV 196 Susan Doris 26-May-19 07:47
Re: It's Jason's debunkatron POV 195 PB Bytes 26-May-19 15:49
Re: It's Jason's debunkatron POV 202 drrayeye 26-May-19 10:56
One's path... 195 PB Bytes 26-May-19 16:52
Re: It's Jason's debunkatron POV 216 Susan Doris 26-May-19 07:33
As long as we suppose 331 drrayeye 26-May-19 21:47
Re: Jason Colavito part Two - on Shermer re Rogan and Magicians of the Gods 195 PB Bytes 24-May-19 16:43
You had me at hello 189 drrayeye 24-May-19 16:57
Re: Jason Colavito part Three - on Shermer re Rogan and Magicians of the Gods 194 PB Bytes 24-May-19 17:41
Links 217 eyeofhorus33 23-May-19 17:01
Egyptian Genesis 212 grangram 22-May-19 06:49
Bayesian carbon 14 dating video--comments 202 drrayeye 22-May-19 21:54
Patterns of evidence 210 drrayeye 20-May-19 13:48
Not yet Ray 236 eyeofhorus33 20-May-19 19:52
Re: Here we go again... 230 eyeofhorus33 09-May-19 21:19
Re: Here we go again... 232 PB Bytes 09-May-19 22:48
Re: Here we go again... 219 Susan Doris 10-May-19 05:50
Re: Here we go again... 203 PB Bytes 10-May-19 16:56
You are mistaken.. 220 eyeofhorus33 10-May-19 08:46
Re: You are mistaken.. 221 PB Bytes 10-May-19 14:14
Re: You are mistaken.. 219 eyeofhorus33 10-May-19 16:50
Re: You are mistaken.. 211 PB Bytes 10-May-19 16:53
Know thyself, 232 eyeofhorus33 10-May-19 22:15
Affirming the Greater Reality 226 PB Bytes 10-May-19 23:03
Wrong again! 232 eyeofhorus33 11-May-19 05:37
Mea Culpa for Matt 216 PB Bytes 11-May-19 18:57
Re: Virgin birth? 206 Eddie Larry 08-May-19 17:27
Cosmic Consciousness 231 Itatw70s 06-May-19 23:05
Re: Cosmic Consciousness 196 PB Bytes 07-May-19 02:38
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 214 Eddie Larry 06-May-19 00:36
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 201 PB Bytes 05-May-19 22:50
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 204 Eddie Larry 05-May-19 22:53
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 223 PB Bytes 05-May-19 23:20
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 215 Eddie Larry 06-May-19 00:02
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 213 PB Bytes 06-May-19 00:19
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 202 Eddie Larry 06-May-19 00:31
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 206 PB Bytes 06-May-19 00:45
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 223 Eddie Larry 06-May-19 00:58
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 223 PB Bytes 06-May-19 01:03
Re: Amending the Apostles Creed... 227 Eddie Larry 06-May-19 02:38
Passive-aggressive noise. 210 PB Bytes 06-May-19 03:05
Re: Passive-aggressive noise. 213 Eddie Larry 06-May-19 04:02
Re: Passive-aggressive noise. 207 PB Bytes 06-May-19 04:33
Re: Passive-aggressive noise. 209 Eddie Larry 06-May-19 05:18
Re: Passive-aggressive noise. 207 Itatw70s 06-May-19 11:30
Re: Passive-aggressive noise. 205 Eddie Larry 06-May-19 13:28
The Age of Pisces.... 234 Itatw70s 07-May-19 11:52
Re: The Mauling of the Magdalene 228 drrayeye 03-May-19 17:27
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 211 Eddie Larry 29-Apr-19 16:42
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 227 PB Bytes 29-Apr-19 17:02
Taking Action: Jesus' Female Disciples. 228 PB Bytes 29-Apr-19 17:09
Fantastic! 213 drrayeye 29-Apr-19 17:15
Re: Fantastic! 212 PB Bytes 29-Apr-19 17:24
Re: Fantastic! 220 grangram 29-Apr-19 19:22
Re: Fantastic! 215 PB Bytes 30-Apr-19 03:51
Helen Bond and Joan Taylor (2018) St Pauls cathedral 219 grangram 30-Apr-19 06:38
Re: Helen Bond and Joan Taylor (2018) St Pauls cathedral 229 PB Bytes 30-Apr-19 15:15
Re: Helen Bond and Joan Taylor (2018) St Pauls cathedral 206 grangram 01-May-19 16:06
Re: Taking Action: Jesus' Female Disciples. 217 Susan Doris 30-Apr-19 09:51
Re: Taking Action: Jesus' Female Disciples. 218 PB Bytes 30-Apr-19 15:39
Re: Taking Action: Jesus' Female Disciples. 240 eyeofhorus33 02-May-19 08:22
Re: Taking Action: Jesus' Female Disciples. 217 PB Bytes 02-May-19 19:25
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 215 Eddie Larry 29-Apr-19 17:18
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 215 PB Bytes 29-Apr-19 17:22
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 222 grangram 29-Apr-19 19:26
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 214 Itatw70s 30-Apr-19 11:46
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 230 Susan Doris 30-Apr-19 13:35
The Mother Goddess.... 231 Itatw70s 30-Apr-19 13:51
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 258 grangram 30-Apr-19 17:10
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 271 Itatw70s 30-Apr-19 17:49
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 294 Enigcom 01-May-19 16:14
Re: Jesus' Female Disciples. 289 Itatw70s 01-May-19 23:22


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