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Eddie asked = " Let me know of the statements in the GoT that you find meaningful."

In going over this the last few days, with little or no understanding of the historical text and whatever translations I may be relying on AND in looking at the Thomas text with little understanding of whom the scribes may have been - the Gnostics, I presume - in light of my own direct experiences I would say that following:

Many of the sayings I can agree with, in part, but there's sufficient ambiguity to compel me to think that I may be filling in blanks. This is very unlike what I see in verses 3 and 1.

In my limited understanding, the verse 3 teaching is likely is among the most important teaching, which is why it was front-end loaded, rather than buried in some otherwise random position within the 114-verse text. The 3rd verse, for those who have experienced what it is like to see what I called "heaven on earth," this description validates the 1st verse, in a way that very articulates a clear and self-evident "eternal" truth, which is of such import to the author of Thomas that the same basic message was reinstalled at the back end, and essentially juxtaposed in a first-last manner that is intended to invite this reinforcing association...

(111) Jesus says:

(1) “The heavens will roll up before you, and the earth.
(2) And whoever is living from the living one will not see death.”
(3) Does not Jesus say: “Whoever has found himself, of him the world is not worthy”?
(112) Jesus says:

(1) “Woe to the flesh that depends on the soul.
(2) Woe to the soul that depends on the flesh.”
(113)

(1) His disciples said to him: “The kingdom — on what day will it come?”
(2) “It will not come by watching (and waiting for) it.
(3) They will not say: ‘Look, here!’ or ‘Look, there!’
(4) Rather, the kingdom of the Father is spread out upon the earth, and people do not see it.”


The only other passage that would seem to make nearly as clear sense, to me, is 13

(4) Thomas said to him: “Teacher, my mouth cannot bear at all to say whom you are like.”
(5) Jesus said: “I am not your teacher. For you have drunk, you have become intoxicated at the bubbling spring that I have measured out.”
(6) And he took him, (and) withdrew, (and) he said three words to him.
(7) But when Thomas came back to his companions, they asked him: “What did Jesus say to you?”
(8) Thomas said to them: “If I tell you one of the words he said to me, you will pick up stones and throw them at me, and fire will come out of the stones (and) burn you up.”


Keeping in mind that we have precedent, of Jesus taking certain followers aside for certain mystical purposes - the Transfiguration - I see no problem with Jesus doing a different thing with Thomas. If Thomas experienced what I experienced, then he may have had related experiences as well - ones which I believe were timed to occur in ways that command association with my mystical experience that recalls verse 3. In general, I would say that some of these lessons involve having the subject recognize aspects of his or her divinity which could/can be very hard for the general public to believe, including in Israel ca first century AD.

With those considerations in mind I find this passage quite 'real', but I see certain difficulties. For one, was Jesus speaking literally when he said the part about flame throwing? Perhaps that's unlikely, if Jesus never "sinned" because wouldn't that be a lie - maybe, maybe not... Maybe the last line here is literally true, in which case I have nothing to relate to. But if it is figurative, I certainly can, contextually. If my interpretation of what the 3rd verse means is correct, then I would further say that such an experience is very rare.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 1917 PB Bytes 29-Mar-19 17:07
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 334 Eddie Larry 29-Mar-19 17:53
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 314 PB Bytes 29-Mar-19 22:12
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 301 Eddie Larry 29-Mar-19 22:54
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 335 PB Bytes 30-Mar-19 05:23
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 308 drrayeye 30-Mar-19 17:01
Making progress 318 drrayeye 30-Mar-19 18:20
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 298 Gnostic Bishop 31-Mar-19 20:51
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 221 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 16:30
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 215 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 17:14
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 216 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 17:47
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 223 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 18:00
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 216 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 18:28
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 212 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 18:58
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 209 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 19:05
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 200 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 19:15
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 218 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 20:44
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 205 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 15:17
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 202 PB Bytes 02-Apr-19 15:43
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 206 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 15:57
Manichaeism 224 Eddie Larry 02-Apr-19 17:49
Re: Manichaeism 218 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 18:10
Re: Manichaeism 216 Eddie Larry 02-Apr-19 20:16
Re: Manichaeism 199 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 14:45
Re: Manichaeism 205 Eddie Larry 03-Apr-19 16:05
Re: Manichaeism 207 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 16:58
Re: Manichaeism 207 Eddie Larry 03-Apr-19 17:22
Re: Manichaeism 210 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 17:31
Re: Manichaeism 196 Eddie Larry 03-Apr-19 18:26
Re: Manichaeism 200 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 20:19
Re: Manichaeism 200 Eddie Larry 03-Apr-19 20:36
Re: Manichaeism 201 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 20:42
Re: Manichaeism 224 Eddie Larry 03-Apr-19 22:25
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 206 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 15:25
Before we go any further 218 PB Bytes 02-Apr-19 15:45
Re: Before we go any further 209 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 16:05
Re: Before we go any further 217 PB Bytes 02-Apr-19 17:02
Re: Before we go any further 209 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 18:04
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 216 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 15:28
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 218 PB Bytes 02-Apr-19 15:46
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 212 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 16:17
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 211 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 15:38
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 208 PB Bytes 02-Apr-19 15:47
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 217 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 16:19
Thanks 205 drrayeye 01-Apr-19 18:54
Re: Thanks 209 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 19:04
Some alternatives 208 drrayeye 01-Apr-19 21:05
Re: Some alternatives 199 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 15:46
Re: Some alternatives 214 drrayeye 02-Apr-19 20:49
Re: Some alternatives 206 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 14:51
Re: Thanks 229 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 19:14
Re: Thanks 213 drrayeye 01-Apr-19 19:55
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 210 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 15:31
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 206 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 15:46
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 204 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 16:52
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 216 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 17:04
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 217 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 17:49
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 202 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 17:54
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 204 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 18:38
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 198 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 18:53
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 193 PB Bytes 02-Apr-19 02:49
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 211 Eddie Larry 02-Apr-19 04:07
Thomas in India 223 PB Bytes 02-Apr-19 04:31
Re: Thomas in India 211 eyeofhorus33 03-Apr-19 18:11
Re: Thomas in India 205 PB Bytes 03-Apr-19 18:13
Re: Thomas in India 207 eyeofhorus33 03-Apr-19 18:20
Re: Thomas in India 218 PB Bytes 03-Apr-19 18:32
Re: Thomas in India 207 eyeofhorus33 03-Apr-19 18:40
Re: Thomas in India 203 PB Bytes 03-Apr-19 19:06
Re: Thomas in India 212 eyeofhorus33 03-Apr-19 20:42
Re: Thomas in India 208 PB Bytes 03-Apr-19 21:23
Re: Thomas in India 212 eyeofhorus33 04-Apr-19 06:35
Re: Thomas in India 204 PB Bytes 04-Apr-19 15:41
Inspiration 203 drrayeye 04-Apr-19 18:13
Re: Inspiration 241 PB Bytes 04-Apr-19 21:30
Re: Inspiration 207 Gnostic Bishop 06-Apr-19 11:53
Re: Inspiration 213 Eddie Larry 06-Apr-19 17:03
Re: Inspiration 200 PB Bytes 06-Apr-19 17:20
Re: Inspiration 197 Gnostic Bishop 06-Apr-19 18:23
Re: Inspiration 207 Gnostic Bishop 06-Apr-19 18:21
Re: Inspiration 245 Eddie Larry 06-Apr-19 18:29
James the Just 228 grangram 05-Apr-19 08:25
I agree completely 206 drrayeye 05-Apr-19 16:50
Re: I agree completely 207 grangram 05-Apr-19 17:56
Re: I agree completely 211 drrayeye 05-Apr-19 23:00
Re: James the Just 209 PB Bytes 05-Apr-19 23:27
Socrates? of course. 216 grangram 06-Apr-19 06:50
Re: Inspiration 201 Gnostic Bishop 06-Apr-19 00:47
Re: Inspiration 215 drrayeye 06-Apr-19 03:07
Re: Inspiration 203 Gnostic Bishop 06-Apr-19 12:27
Re: Thomas in India 210 eyeofhorus33 04-Apr-19 20:18
Re: Thomas in India 224 Eddie Larry 04-Apr-19 21:24
Re: Thomas in India 228 PB Bytes 04-Apr-19 21:39
Re: Thomas in India 205 Eddie Larry 05-Apr-19 01:39
Re: Thomas in India 234 eyeofhorus33 04-Apr-19 21:42
Re: Thomas in India 207 drrayeye 05-Apr-19 00:40
Re: Thomas in India 202 Eddie Larry 05-Apr-19 00:49
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 302 drrayeye 30-Mar-19 03:47
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 278 PB Bytes 30-Mar-19 05:28
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 291 drrayeye 30-Mar-19 06:14
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 289 PB Bytes 30-Mar-19 14:20
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 285 Eddie Larry 30-Mar-19 17:56
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 280 PB Bytes 31-Mar-19 23:20
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 223 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 15:28
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 211 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 15:41
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 206 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 15:50
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 200 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 16:18
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 207 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 17:02
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 202 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 17:27
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 206 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 17:53
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 192 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 17:57
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 199 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 16:55
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 200 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 17:01
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 189 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 17:25
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 201 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 17:32
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 199 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 18:32
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 198 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 18:58
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 204 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 19:11
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 206 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 19:35
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 191 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 19:41
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 190 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 19:45
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 202 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 19:51
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 200 Eddie Larry 01-Apr-19 20:11
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 194 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 20:31
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 208 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 17:01
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 204 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 17:44
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 298 Susan Doris 30-Mar-19 06:16
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 259 PB Bytes 30-Mar-19 14:13
Youtube is very helpful 275 drrayeye 30-Mar-19 18:52
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 266 Gnostic Bishop 31-Mar-19 20:46
Some interesting comments 276 drrayeye 30-Mar-19 20:39
Re: Some interesting comments 305 Eddie Larry 30-Mar-19 22:45
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 404 Gnostic Bishop 31-Mar-19 20:29
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 243 PB Bytes 31-Mar-19 23:17
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 205 Itatw70s 01-Apr-19 11:58
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 200 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 13:11
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 211 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 13:19
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 208 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 15:11
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 208 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 15:53
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 215 Itatw70s 01-Apr-19 15:13
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 198 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 16:13
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 222 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 15:53
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 207 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 16:21
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 210 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 16:51
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 203 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 17:18
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 217 PB Bytes 01-Apr-19 17:50
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 205 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 18:27
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 192 drrayeye 01-Apr-19 19:11
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 195 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 19:20
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 202 drrayeye 01-Apr-19 19:47
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 202 Gnostic Bishop 01-Apr-19 20:25
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 218 drrayeye 01-Apr-19 21:48
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 210 Itatw70s 01-Apr-19 23:31
Re: Exploring the Gospel of Thomas 245 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 16:09
Our differences are our similarities.... 219 Itatw70s 02-Apr-19 18:17
Re: Our differences are our similarities.... 202 Gnostic Bishop 02-Apr-19 19:44
Re: Our differences are our similarities.... 207 Itatw70s 02-Apr-19 23:39
Re: Our differences are our similarities.... 195 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 15:02
Re: Our differences are our similarities.... 198 Itatw70s 03-Apr-19 16:34
Re: Our differences are our similarities.... 200 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 17:03
Re: Our differences are our similarities.... 199 Itatw70s 04-Apr-19 18:21
Re: Our differences are our similarities.... 198 Gnostic Bishop 06-Apr-19 00:53
IMO 225 drrayeye 02-Apr-19 23:12
About that short trip I had mentioned... 223 PB Bytes 03-Apr-19 04:04
Re: IMO 202 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 14:56
Re: IMO - My take after these few days 206 PB Bytes 03-Apr-19 15:45
Re: IMO - My take after these few days 206 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 16:51
Re: IMO - My take after these few days 205 PB Bytes 03-Apr-19 17:04
Re: IMO - My take after these few days 202 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 17:29
Re: IMO - My take after these few days 211 PB Bytes 03-Apr-19 17:39
Re: IMO - My take after these few days 209 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 19:57
Re: IMO - My take after these few days 200 Itatw70s 04-Apr-19 19:40
Re: IMO - My take after these few days 201 Gnostic Bishop 06-Apr-19 01:01
Spirituality 212 drrayeye 03-Apr-19 17:57
Re: Spirituality 206 PB Bytes 03-Apr-19 18:07
Re: Spirituality 204 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 20:13
Regarding Bishop Spong: 203 PB Bytes 03-Apr-19 20:28
Re: Regarding Bishop Spong: 203 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 20:36
Re: Spirituality 202 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 20:07
If you need help 196 drrayeye 04-Apr-19 03:52
Re: If you need help 202 Gnostic Bishop 04-Apr-19 14:04
Re: IMO 188 drrayeye 03-Apr-19 17:35
Re: IMO 196 Eddie Larry 03-Apr-19 18:31
Re: IMO 189 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 20:23
Re: IMO 200 Eddie Larry 03-Apr-19 20:28
Re: IMO 200 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 20:39
Re: IMO 193 Eddie Larry 03-Apr-19 21:13
Re: IMO 202 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 21:44
Re: IMO 197 Eddie Larry 03-Apr-19 22:21
Re: IMO 182 Gnostic Bishop 04-Apr-19 13:58
Re: IMO 198 Eddie Larry 04-Apr-19 17:38
Re: IMO 199 Gnostic Bishop 05-Apr-19 20:28
You've posted this already 200 drrayeye 05-Apr-19 22:57
Re: You've posted this already 203 Gnostic Bishop 06-Apr-19 12:24
God--in song 206 drrayeye 06-Apr-19 20:39
Richard Dawkins 207 drrayeye 04-Apr-19 04:31
Rupert is great! 205 grangram 05-Apr-19 11:49
Rediscovering God 242 drrayeye 05-Apr-19 16:44
Oh Please 200 drrayeye 04-Apr-19 04:14
Re: Oh Please 195 Gnostic Bishop 04-Apr-19 14:10
TV Popularizers 202 drrayeye 04-Apr-19 17:18
Re: IMO 220 Gnostic Bishop 03-Apr-19 19:56
Re: IMO 215 drrayeye 04-Apr-19 04:01
Re: IMO 211 Gnostic Bishop 04-Apr-19 14:07
I think I get it 215 drrayeye 04-Apr-19 18:04
Ascetic Christianity documentary 239 grangram 05-Apr-19 09:20
Re: Ascetic Christianity documentary 209 PB Bytes 06-Apr-19 04:32
Re: Ascetic Christianity documentary 209 grangram 06-Apr-19 07:19
Thomas 78 "Why have you come out into the desert? 249 grangram 06-Apr-19 06:03
Re: Thomas 78 "Why have you come out into the desert? 222 PB Bytes 06-Apr-19 15:16
Re: Thomas 78 "Why have you come out into the desert? 211 Eddie Larry 06-Apr-19 16:38
Re: Thomas 78 "Why have you come out into the desert? 206 PB Bytes 06-Apr-19 16:49
Re: Thomas 78 "Why have you come out into the desert? 202 Eddie Larry 06-Apr-19 16:59
Some more thoughts on Jesus' influence through James' work 245 grangram 08-Apr-19 09:04
Re: Some more thoughts on Jesus' influence through James' work 261 PB Bytes 08-Apr-19 18:05
Re: Some more thoughts on Jesus' influence through James' work 234 grangram 08-Apr-19 19:28
Re: Some more thoughts on Jesus' influence through James' work 240 PB Bytes 08-Apr-19 20:34
Re: Thomas 78 "Why have you come out into the desert? 247 PB Bytes 06-Apr-19 16:17
Re: Thomas 78 "Why have you come out into the desert? 214 grangram 09-Apr-19 13:11
Re: Thomas 78 "Why have you come out into the desert? 219 PB Bytes 09-Apr-19 17:33
The auto biography of a Yogi? 259 grangram 10-Apr-19 08:39
Re: The auto biography of a Yogi? 222 PB Bytes 10-Apr-19 23:15
Re: Rennes le Chateau tour guide 373 Edmond 23-May-19 08:32


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