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Martin Stower wrote:

> You’ve offered a conjecture on the character of the lines. As
> stated, I do not find this conjecture plausible, in a context
> where Vyse clearly was deliberately drawing lines in circles —
> and I’m not seeing evidence which would make me think
> otherwise. Evidence of tendency would be such evidence. Do
> you see that I’m leaving a space for such evidence and not just
> dismissing the idea outright?

I have offered an analysis of what I can clearly see as common artifacts consistently produced by drawing these objects quickly in a certain manner. It is not a matter of opinion, but the physics of drawing certain objects in certain ways consistently reproducible by anyone with a pen and a piece of paper. As I said, I have been doing pen and ink line art for almost 40yrs-I know what I am seeing and am well versed in the unique subtle nuances of using the types of pen Vyse used. My conclusion, and why, is not only "plausible", but the most probable explanation which admittedly is based solely on the art itself regardless of the subject which includes the circle's innocuous placement on the page compared to the others. I suggest having it examined by a handwriting expert not because I have doubt, but rather to eliminate doubt by introducing an objective 3rd party accredited professional. I could spend the time to break down and diagram each of Vyse's drawings line by line and reproduce each of them and I have no doubt you would dismiss it just because it is me doing it.

The "context" and "evidence" are the lines themselves, not the face value abstract grouping of all the circles as one.

You obviously have a lot invested in the topic, including your running feud with Scott, which if you are being honest with yourself understandably limits your objectivity. For your own sake I would recommend reevaluating your rigidity regarding this circle and protect yourself by at least cautiously accepting it may in fact be as I have described.

But if it is a circle with a dot-so what? This does not disprove Khufu built G1 no more so than a circle with 3 lines proves he did. If Vyse did fake it-so what? The joke is on him. All this attention is given to this one cartouche yet the other nearly 2 dozens lines of writing in the relieving chambers are ignored, which is ridiculous to me regardless of which side of the argument one is on, but more importantly, regardless of the greater context this would provide, as a whole what they prove beyond a shadow of a doubt is that these chambers were assembled/repaired at a time when hieroglyphic writing existed in Egypt which ultimately indisputably gives a date range of at least the chambers. Coupled with the markings in the "air shafts" this even further dates construction up to the point of the use of red ochre paint.

Considering how many times this subject has gone round and round, the same things repeated over and over again with the same players all the while ignoring the most basic common sense context which I note above, I can only conclude the allure of this subject isn't actually the truth but rather the pointless life draining ad nauseum arguing itself.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Further comments on Creighton’s article [Thread Closed] 927 Martin Stower 23-May-14 00:06
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 515 drew 23-May-14 04:09
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 618 Martin Stower 23-May-14 09:32
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 596 Skatha 23-May-14 04:46
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 555 Martin Stower 24-May-14 19:11
Desperate 516 LonelyAngel 23-May-14 13:11
Re: Desperate 595 Martin Stower 23-May-14 13:46
Mod Note > LonelyAngel – Reminder 620 Dr. Troglodyte 23-May-14 17:19
Re: Desperate 543 eyeofhorus33 23-May-14 17:56
Re: Desperate 582 Martin Stower 23-May-14 23:12
Re: Desperate 574 LonelyAngel 25-May-14 14:15
Re: Desperate 544 Brian Patterson 25-May-14 15:30
Re: Desperate 561 Martin Stower 25-May-14 15:48
Re: Desperate 537 Ahatmose 25-May-14 16:04
Re: Desperate 500 Martin Stower 25-May-14 16:56
Re: Desperate 634 Ahatmose 25-May-14 17:13
Re: Desperate 580 LonelyAngel 25-May-14 20:24
Re: Desperate 601 Martin Stower 26-May-14 00:19
Re: Desperate 532 cladking 25-May-14 22:30
Re: Desperate 479 eyeofhorus33 25-May-14 17:13
Re: Desperate 523 LonelyAngel 25-May-14 20:51
Re: Desperate 584 Martin Stower 25-May-14 22:47
Re: Desperate 507 eyeofhorus33 26-May-14 08:35
Further comments II 1072 Martin Stower 24-May-14 18:20
Re: Further comments II 515 Thanos5150 24-May-14 19:31
Re: Further comments II 526 Martin Stower 24-May-14 19:51
Re: Further comments II 555 Thanos5150 25-May-14 01:35
Re: Further comments II 490 drew 25-May-14 03:47
Re: Further comments II 582 eyeofhorus33 25-May-14 10:01
Re: Further comments II 536 Martin Stower 25-May-14 12:05
Re: Further comments II 582 Martin Stower 25-May-14 12:01
Further comments III 993 Martin Stower 26-May-14 02:14
Re: Further comments III 562 Thanos5150 27-May-14 17:06
Re: Further comments III 563 Martin Stower 27-May-14 19:12
Re: Further comments III 545 Thanos5150 27-May-14 22:34
Re: Further comments III 519 Martin Stower 27-May-14 22:52
Re: Further comments III 565 Dr. Troglodyte 27-May-14 23:04
Re: Further comments III 546 Thanos5150 27-May-14 23:23
Re: Further comments III 523 Martin Stower 27-May-14 23:44
Re: Further comments III 517 Thanos5150 27-May-14 23:54
Re: Further comments III 550 Martin Stower 28-May-14 00:08
Re: Further comments III 523 Thanos5150 28-May-14 00:59
Re: Further comments III 567 Martin Stower 29-May-14 00:00
Re: Further comments III 582 Skatha 30-May-14 00:16
Re: Further comments III 526 Martin Stower 30-May-14 09:57
Re: Further comments III 554 Thanos5150 30-May-14 17:43
Re: Further comments III 575 randompHactor 30-May-14 18:17
Re: Further comments III 465 Martin Stower 30-May-14 19:25
Re: Further comments III 544 Thanos5150 30-May-14 20:21
Re: Further comments III 536 Martin Stower 30-May-14 20:43
Re: Further comments III 512 Thanos5150 30-May-14 20:56
Re: Further comments III 869 Martin Stower 30-May-14 21:15
Re: Further comments III 590 Thanos5150 31-May-14 00:28
Re: Further comments III 536 AmadeusD 31-May-14 02:42
Re: Further comments III 567 Martin Stower 31-May-14 07:56
Re: Further comments III 515 sfbey 30-May-14 21:16
Re: Further comments III 561 Dr. Troglodyte 30-May-14 20:12
Re: Further comments III 591 Audrey 30-May-14 05:34
Re: Further comments III 537 Martin Stower 30-May-14 09:25
Re: Further comments III 562 Martin Stower 27-May-14 22:35
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 596 D-Archer 27-May-14 19:15
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 586 Martin Stower 27-May-14 19:25
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 557 D-Archer 27-May-14 19:32
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 586 Martin Stower 27-May-14 22:29
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 597 D-Archer 28-May-14 10:25
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 664 Martin Stower 28-May-14 13:10
Drawn...and quartered : ) 536 Thunderbird 30-May-14 03:52
Re: Drawn...and quartered : ) 572 Martin Stower 30-May-14 12:49
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 571 k_mand 30-May-14 16:48
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 569 Martin Stower 30-May-14 19:31
What have you missed? 509 Thunderbird 30-May-14 22:49
Re: What have you missed? 601 Martin Stower 30-May-14 23:09
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 579 k_mand 31-May-14 04:14
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 524 Martin Stower 31-May-14 08:17
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 530 k_mand 01-Jun-14 02:21
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 475 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 10:38
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 529 Thanos5150 01-Jun-14 17:01
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 520 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 19:02
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 556 Thanos5150 02-Jun-14 02:26
The cult of Khufu 592 Thunderbird 02-Jun-14 03:40
I’d buy that for a dollar! 538 Martin Stower 30-May-14 21:53
Not worth it ... 655 Ahatmose 31-May-14 01:55
Re: Not worth it ... 584 Brian Patterson 31-May-14 04:04
The Mud Slinging Has Started 531 Scott Creighton 31-May-14 09:17
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 626 Ahatmose 31-May-14 11:47
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 528 Scott Creighton 31-May-14 12:00
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 544 Martin Stower 31-May-14 12:45
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 528 Ahatmose 31-May-14 23:14
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 516 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 00:54
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 584 Audrey 01-Jun-14 05:04
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 565 Thunderbird 01-Jun-14 06:06
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 460 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 10:35
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 571 Audrey 01-Jun-14 17:43
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 549 eyeofhorus33 01-Jun-14 19:35
Follow the cult follow the... 429 Thunderbird 01-Jun-14 21:11
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 566 Audrey 03-Jun-14 03:54
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 576 eyeofhorus33 03-Jun-14 22:33
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 574 Audrey 05-Jun-14 02:07
Re: The Ring of the gods 583 Thunderbird 04-Jun-14 15:55
Re: The Ring of the gods 543 Audrey 05-Jun-14 05:36
Re: Mystery of the Gods 498 Thunderbird 02-Jun-14 01:39
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 581 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 10:33
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 529 Audrey 01-Jun-14 19:38
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 603 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 20:44
Arches and Chambers 484 loveritas 01-Jun-14 22:51
Re: Arches and Chambers 577 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 00:03
Definitely Puzzled 564 loveritas 02-Jun-14 11:30
Re: Definitely Puzzled 540 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 13:05
Re: Definitely Puzzled 490 Audrey 03-Jun-14 01:38
Re: Definitely Puzzled 547 Scott Creighton 03-Jun-14 01:56
Re: Definitely Puzzled 584 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 10:40
Re: Definitely Puzzled 572 Scott Creighton 03-Jun-14 11:21
Re: Definitely Puzzled 629 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 13:02
Re: Definitely Puzzled 568 Scott Creighton 03-Jun-14 13:34
Re: Definitely Puzzled 524 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 13:56
Re: Definitely Puzzled 534 Scott Creighton 03-Jun-14 14:03
How it really happened 1315 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 16:15
Re: How it really happened 626 Scott Creighton 03-Jun-14 17:25
Re: How it really happened 736 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 20:18
Re: Definitely Puzzled 552 Audrey 05-Jun-14 01:54
Re: Definitely Puzzled 556 Merrell 03-Jun-14 07:41
Re: Definitely Puzzled 527 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 10:32
Re: Definitely Puzzled 574 loveritas 03-Jun-14 11:12
Re: Definitely Puzzled 574 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 13:05
Re: Definitely Puzzled 545 loveritas 03-Jun-14 23:48
Re: Arches and Chambers 527 Merrell 02-Jun-14 11:36
Re: Arches and Chambers 557 Dr. Troglodyte 02-Jun-14 16:40
Re: Arches and Chambers 517 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 18:02
Re: Arches and Chambers 580 Dr. Troglodyte 02-Jun-14 18:29
Re: Arches and Chambers 534 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 20:46
Re: Forced entry 533 Thunderbird 02-Jun-14 06:31
Going Inside The Pyramid 574 loveritas 02-Jun-14 12:07
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 539 Audrey 01-Jun-14 23:08
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 552 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 00:02
Medjedu 587 loveritas 04-Jun-14 11:39
Wilkinson? 547 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 00:25
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 665 Martin Stower 31-May-14 12:44
Perring and Vyse 881 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 00:33
Reference marks 599 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 14:01
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 557 Brian Patterson 03-Jun-14 04:06
Mod Warning > Messrs. Creighton and Stower 518 Dr. Troglodyte 03-Jun-14 16:51
How it really happened 518 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 16:54
From caption to self-contradiction 542 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 22:38
Why the drawings? 978 Martin Stower 04-Jun-14 22:14
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 579 DUNE 04-Jun-14 22:46
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 515 sfbey 04-Jun-14 23:02
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 637 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 08:50
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 542 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 09:42
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 626 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 10:08
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 567 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 10:59
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 563 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 11:04
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 505 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 11:42
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 568 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 11:48
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 550 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 12:04
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 498 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 12:16
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 582 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 12:27
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 514 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 12:30
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 573 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 12:48
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 561 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 12:56
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 542 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 13:49
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 497 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 14:05
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 588 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:12
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 563 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 15:22
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 507 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:32
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 521 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 15:45
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 514 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:50
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 517 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 15:52
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 584 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 16:02
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 584 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 16:04
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 447 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 16:38
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 532 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 16:48
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 583 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 16:56
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 506 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 17:02
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 568 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 17:18
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 516 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 17:23
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 525 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 17:27
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 561 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 17:29
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 560 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 17:51
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 529 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 17:55
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 584 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 18:16
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 522 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 18:21
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 466 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 18:23
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 560 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 18:29
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 569 eyeofhorus33 05-Jun-14 17:45
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 524 cladking 05-Jun-14 16:11
Re: Ping for Audrey and Loveritas 508 Thunderbird 05-Jun-14 19:11
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 512 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 14:20
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 507 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 14:32
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 478 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:30
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 503 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 15:40
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 422 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:45
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 423 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 16:01
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 553 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 16:33
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 507 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:42
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 510 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 16:04
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 534 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 16:45
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 573 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 16:53
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 553 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 17:14
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 552 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 17:44
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 461 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 18:03
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 605 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 18:18
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 588 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 18:21
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 516 Audrey 05-Jun-14 21:22
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 598 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 21:37
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 478 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 22:05
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 604 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 23:04
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 709 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 23:25
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 653 Martin Stower 06-Jun-14 11:44
Mod Warning #2 > Scott Creighton 541 lukehancock 06-Jun-14 14:51
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 508 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 20:22
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 485 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 18:10
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 476 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 18:19
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 547 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 21:10
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 526 Audrey 05-Jun-14 21:29
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 571 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 21:47
Mod Warning #3 > Ahatmose 540 lukehancock 06-Jun-14 14:50
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 539 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 16:06
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 488 Martin Stower 04-Jun-14 23:20
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 631 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 10:01
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 599 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 11:14
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 565 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 11:25
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 755 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 11:39
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 462 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 11:48
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 556 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 12:00
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 550 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 12:14
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 534 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 14:34
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 460 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 14:58
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 543 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 16:10
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 489 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 16:13
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 537 eyeofhorus33 05-Jun-14 18:25
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 548 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 21:17


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