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SC: Like I said - it comes down to Brewer's word against that of a known fraudster, Tricky Dicky Howard-Vyse. Who would you believe?

MS: Brewer’s word? You have an authenticated document, in his own hand?

Of course you don’t.

SC: Brewer's word/testimony as passed down by his family. There - better?


MS: What we have are claims made by his descendant, Walter Allen, claims he did not make before reading a summary of Sitchin...

SC: Stop making things up. The claims (based on a long-standing family oral tradition) were put down in written form by Walter Allen in 1954 - LONG BEFORE Sitchin ever appeared on the scene. Allen may not have made the claims of his great grandfather (Brewer) public before reading Sitchin but the claims of his great grandfather WERE there. Stop telling porkies.


MS: whose only evidential warrant is a problematic and questionable oral tradition.

SC: And you entirely miss the point. There is no reason for this charge to have been written down by the Allen family in 1954 - none. It served them no purpose - just a bit of family oral tradiiton that eventually found its way into written form in Walter Allen's notes. They had no reason to make such a charge and yet it has been made. THAT is the point. Are they telling the truth? Is the oral tradiiton wrong? It COULD be all bunk. But it COULD all be fact. The POINT is we will not know until we gather more evidence; until concensus Egyptology gets its finger out and scientifically tests those inscriptions. Are you getting this yet?


MS: There are no 19th-century documents: the material disclosed comprises notes written by Allen himself, with nothing (beyond Allen’s word) to establish when they were written.

SC: Certainly no letters from Brewer's family have been produced. Does that make Brewer's testimony (passed down to Allen) a lie? No, it doesn't. There was no reason for this family to make such a charge and yet the charge has been made in Allen's notes in 1954 and the charge will remain regardless of your blue-in-the-face protestations. If you want this charge to disappear then the only way that will happen is when you present hard, scientific proof that conclusively demonstrates the inscriptions 'discovered' by Tricky Dicky in those chambers are authentic. Let's see it. Present your scientific proof.


MS: Allow me to remind you that, until recently (when we goaded you into checking), you relied for Humphries Brewer’s very existence on the known liar Sitchin. Allow me to doubt that you’re much of a judge of what to believe.

SC: "Goaded into checking"? Pardon me while I roll about laughing at the man who has spent several decades being goaded with this debate.

Let me remind you that the basis of the Brewer/Allen claim has NOTHING to do with Sitchin. The Brewer/Allen claim existed (albeit unknown) LONG BEFORE Sitchin ever got to know about it or became involved with it--as you well know. Just because Sitchin's claim of forgery does not stand up to scrutiny (his wrongly claimed misspelling of Khufu) does not mean that the Brewer/Allen claim won't. They are separate claims made by different people at different times albeit Sitchin made the Brewer/Allen claim public. But just because Sitchin made the Brewer/Allen claim public does not mean that the basis of this particular fraud claim belongs to Sitchin - it absolutely doesn't. Period. But, of course, that doesn't suit your ends, does it? You like to drag Sitchin into the Brewer/Allen claim any chance you get because you know the forgery claim made by Sitchim himself turned out to be bogus and you like to tar the quite separate Brewer/Allen claim (made public by Sitchin) with the same poisoned brush of yours. You can fool yourself with your silly ploys but you won't pull the wool over the eyes of anyone with a brain. The Brewer/Allen claim stands entirely separate to what Sitchin alleged and, as such, should be dealt with separately. Period.


MS: And again we have the usual misdirection of claiming that this is a matter of “taking someone’s word” for something. It isn’t. The inscriptions are judged on their merits, by people who (I dare say) know more about ancient Egyptian script than you do.

SC: "Misdirection" my bahookie! That's the bottom line Stower. Brewer's word against Trcicky Dicky's. Might as well get used to it, dear boy.


Post Edited (15-May-13 13:43)

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Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 1091 Dr. Troglodyte 10-May-13 20:14
William Wilberforce, crook 510 Martin Stower 11-May-13 12:17
Re: William Wilberforce, crook 475 Nejc 11-May-13 16:15
Re: William Wilberforce, crook 488 Merrell 11-May-13 18:36
Re: William Wilberforce, crook 479 Scott Creighton 12-May-13 11:27
Re: William Wilberforce, crook 561 Merrell 12-May-13 22:37
Re: William Wilberforce, crook 521 Scott Creighton 13-May-13 11:03
Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, excavator 430 Merrell 13-May-13 13:11
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 479 Scott Creighton 13-May-13 13:21
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 492 Martin Stower 13-May-13 16:14
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 390 Scott Creighton 14-May-13 09:16
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 469 Merrell 14-May-13 09:41
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 474 Scott Creighton 14-May-13 09:47
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 479 Martin Stower 15-May-13 11:18
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 567 Scott Creighton 15-May-13 12:02
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 483 Martin Stower 15-May-13 14:26
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 427 Scott Creighton 15-May-13 15:00
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 530 Martin Stower 16-May-13 09:55
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 465 Scott Creighton 16-May-13 10:04
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 460 Martin Stower 16-May-13 10:34
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 408 Scott Creighton 16-May-13 10:43
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 481 Martin Stower 16-May-13 11:00
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 540 Scott Creighton 16-May-13 11:09
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 471 Martin Stower 16-May-13 11:31
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 439 Scott Creighton 16-May-13 11:36
Re: Wilberforce, abolitionist; Vyse, 441 cladking 16-May-13 15:14
Re: What are they so afraid of? 525 Thunderbird 16-May-13 15:55
Re: What are they so afraid of? 471 cladking 16-May-13 21:40
Calling Dr. Schoch 543 Dr. Troglodyte 16-May-13 16:04
Re: Calling Dr. Schoch 541 Scott Creighton 16-May-13 16:26
Logbook doubts 455 Merrell 16-May-13 21:38
Re: Logbook doubts 514 Scott Creighton 16-May-13 22:46
Re: Logbook doubts 408 Merrell 16-May-13 23:25
Re: Logbook doubts 475 Scott Creighton 17-May-13 08:00
Re: Logbook doubts 470 Merrell 17-May-13 14:30
Re: Logbook doubts 454 Scott Creighton 17-May-13 14:56
Re: Logbook doubts 464 Martin Stower 17-May-13 16:11
Re: Logbook doubts 450 Scott Creighton 17-May-13 20:53
Re: Logbook doubts 417 MJT 17-May-13 22:31
Re: Logbook doubts 506 Merrell 18-May-13 11:23
Re: Logbook doubts 559 Scott Creighton 18-May-13 12:10
Re: Logbook doubts 576 Martin Stower 20-May-13 17:54
Re: Logbook doubts 389 Scott Creighton 21-May-13 00:20
Re: Logbook doubts 469 Morten 21-May-13 09:03
Re: Logbook doubts 518 Scott Creighton 21-May-13 10:22
Re: Logbook doubts 517 Merrell 21-May-13 10:26
Re: Logbook doubts 444 Scott Creighton 21-May-13 10:35
Re: Logbook doubts 480 Merrell 21-May-13 13:46
Re: Logbook doubts 398 Morten 21-May-13 10:40
Re: Logbook doubts 482 Scott Creighton 21-May-13 11:04
Re: Logbook doubts 491 Morten 21-May-13 11:29
Re: Logbook doubts 513 Scott Creighton 21-May-13 12:04
Re: Logbook doubts 481 Morten 21-May-13 13:19
Re: Logbook doubts 561 Scott Creighton 21-May-13 13:33
Re: Logbook doubts 478 Merrell 21-May-13 14:16
Re: Logbook doubts 478 Scott Creighton 21-May-13 14:27
Re: Logbook doubts 520 Merrell 21-May-13 23:48
Re: Logbook doubts 502 Morten 21-May-13 14:37
Re: Logbook doubts 472 Scott Creighton 21-May-13 14:54
Re: Logbook doubts 501 Morten 22-May-13 10:51
Re: Logbook doubts 532 Martin Stower 21-May-13 17:13
Re: Logbook doubts 408 Audrey 22-May-13 02:20
Re: Logbook doubts 470 Morten 22-May-13 08:18
Re: Logbook doubts 434 Martin Stower 22-May-13 15:02
Re: Logbook doubts 447 Audrey 24-May-13 01:32
Re: Logbook doubts 634 Martin Stower 24-May-13 13:43
Re: Logbook doubts 365 Audrey 24-May-13 01:10
Re: Logbook doubts 404 Scott Creighton 10-Jun-14 13:15
Re: Logbook doubts 507 eyeofhorus33 10-Jun-14 18:17
Re: Logbook doubts 497 Scott Creighton 10-Jun-14 22:01
Re: Logbook doubts 440 eyeofhorus33 10-Jun-14 22:15
Re:Khufu....Hyksos? 472 Thunderbird 11-Jun-14 01:36
Re: Logbook doubts 464 Audrey 11-Jun-14 20:47
Re: Logbook doubts 546 eyeofhorus33 11-Jun-14 22:18
Re: Logbook doubts 493 Audrey 12-Jun-14 21:22
Re: Logbook doubts 436 eyeofhorus33 12-Jun-14 22:20
Re: Logbook doubts 439 cladking 13-Jun-14 00:24
Re: Logbook doubts 421 eyeofhorus33 13-Jun-14 22:53
Re: Logbook doubts 429 cladking 13-Jun-14 23:23
Re: Logbook doubts 437 eyeofhorus33 13-Jun-14 23:48
Re: Logbook doubts 433 cladking 14-Jun-14 00:17
Re: Logbook doubts 457 Audrey 14-Jun-14 02:17
Re: Logbook doubts 508 eyeofhorus33 14-Jun-14 11:44
Re: Logbook doubts 456 cladking 14-Jun-14 15:25
context and customs 403 Audrey 14-Jun-14 19:25
Re: context and customs 395 cladking 14-Jun-14 21:23
Re: Logbook doubts 468 eyeofhorus33 14-Jun-14 21:29
Re: Logbook doubts 450 cladking 14-Jun-14 22:07
Re: Logbook doubts 440 eyeofhorus33 14-Jun-14 23:04
Re: Logbook doubts 470 cladking 15-Jun-14 00:29
Re: Logbook doubts 470 eyeofhorus33 15-Jun-14 18:35
Re: Logbook doubts 445 cladking 15-Jun-14 20:56
Re: Logbook doubts 457 eyeofhorus33 15-Jun-14 21:26
Language doubts 416 cladking 15-Jun-14 21:48
Re: Language doubts 422 eyeofhorus33 15-Jun-14 22:05
Re: Language doubts 435 cladking 15-Jun-14 22:51
Re: Language doubts 435 Audrey 16-Jun-14 04:17
Re: Language doubts 483 cladking 16-Jun-14 04:51
Re: Logbook doubts 352 cladking 12-Jun-14 22:57
Re:doubts 462 Thunderbird 11-Jun-14 23:36
Re:doubts 421 Audrey 12-Jun-14 19:54
Moderator Notice 403 Hoppy 22-May-13 01:32
Re: Logbook doubts 395 Audrey 22-May-13 02:52
Re: Logbook doubts 379 Martin Stower 18-May-13 13:37
Re: Logbook doubts 443 Scott Creighton 18-May-13 14:01
Re: Logbook doubts 428 Martin Stower 18-May-13 14:52
Re: Logbook doubts 425 Scott Creighton 18-May-13 17:16
Re: Logbook doubts 508 Martin Stower 20-May-13 16:57
Re: Logbook doubts 439 Scott Creighton 20-May-13 17:51
Re: Logbook doubts 410 Martin Stower 20-May-13 18:25
Re: Logbook doubts 289 Scott Creighton 20-May-13 18:49
Re: Logbook doubts 467 Martin Stower 21-May-13 15:42
Re: Logbook doubts 434 HungryHun 17-May-13 15:20
Re: Conspired.... 444 Thunderbird 17-May-13 15:47
Re: Conspired.... 440 HungryHun 17-May-13 16:04
Re: Conspired.... 411 Thunderbird 17-May-13 23:17
Re: Conspired....inspire d by money 441 Ratcho 03-Jun-13 05:57
Re: Logbook doubts 381 Martin Stower 17-May-13 16:23
Re: Logbook doubts 440 HungryHun 17-May-13 16:28
Re: Logbook doubts 439 Thunderbird 17-May-13 22:25
Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 419 LonelyAngel 29-May-13 14:41
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 396 Nejc 29-May-13 23:23
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 409 Merrell 30-May-13 09:25
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 462 Martin Stower 30-May-13 12:48
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 445 WINDINWATERS 30-May-13 14:40
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 345 Martin Stower 31-May-13 18:00
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 404 WINDINWATERS 31-May-13 21:47
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 389 LonelyAngel 30-May-13 17:43
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 392 Martin Stower 31-May-13 18:24
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 453 cladking 01-Jun-13 03:28
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 435 Merrell 01-Jun-13 11:02
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 378 LonelyAngel 03-Jun-13 20:59
Re: Would you buy a used cartouche from this man? 396 LonelyAngel 03-Jun-13 20:47
Re: Logbook doubts 607 Martin Stower 17-May-13 15:51
Re: Logbook doubts 436 Scott Creighton 17-May-13 20:27
Re: Logbook doubts 457 Nejc 17-May-13 22:28
Re: Logbook doubts 835 Martin Stower 18-May-13 14:43
Re: Logbook doubts 690 Scott Creighton 18-May-13 17:12
Re: Logbook doubts 514 Merrell 19-May-13 16:43
Re: Logbook doubts 446 Scott Creighton 20-May-13 09:38
Re: Logbook doubts 407 Merrell 20-May-13 13:29
Re: Logbook doubts 533 Scott Creighton 20-May-13 13:58
Re: Logbook doubts 416 Merrell 20-May-13 14:55
Re: Logbook doubts 437 Scott Creighton 20-May-13 18:46
Re: Logbook doubts 475 HungryHun 20-May-13 22:02
Re: Logbook doubts 438 Thanos5150 20-May-13 23:05
Re: Logbook doubts 451 sfbey 20-May-13 23:23
Re: Logbook doubts 445 Thanos5150 20-May-13 23:35
Re: Logbook doubts 454 sfbey 21-May-13 15:41
Moghrah 461 Merrell 21-May-13 18:09
Re: Logbook doubts 338 Scott Creighton 20-May-13 23:38
Re: Logbook doubts 364 Merrell 21-May-13 21:34
Re: Logbook doubts 372 Audrey 22-May-13 02:34
Re: Logbook doubts 417 Merrell 21-May-13 21:58
Re: Logbook doubts 435 Sirfiroth 22-May-13 10:42
Re: Logbook doubts 392 Merrell 22-May-13 11:43
Re: Logbook doubts 375 Sirfiroth 22-May-13 17:44
Re: Logbook doubts 318 Nejc 22-May-13 23:18
Re: Logbook doubts 314 cladking 23-May-13 00:51
Re: Logbook doubts 323 Merrell 23-May-13 08:41
Re: Logbook doubts 354 Martin Stower 20-May-13 19:19
Re: Logbook doubts 267 Scott Creighton 20-May-13 19:35
Re: Logbook doubts 395 Martin Stower 21-May-13 17:59
Moderator Warning 465 JonnyMcA 21-May-13 20:12
Moderator Warning 381 JonnyMcA 21-May-13 20:11
Re: exercise elementary caution about sources 344 Thunderbird 20-May-13 19:36
Re: Logbook doubts 387 Audrey 22-May-13 02:50
Re: Logbook doubts 332 Merrell 22-May-13 12:53
Re: Logbook doubts 309 Audrey 24-May-13 01:48
Moderator Caution 258 Hoppy 22-May-13 12:55
Re: Logbook doubts 229 Martin Stower 22-May-13 16:06
Re: Logbook doubts 224 Audrey 24-May-13 01:41
Re: Logbook doubts 226 Martin Stower 24-May-13 13:56
Re: Logbook doubts 207 Thunderbird 17-May-13 22:40
Re: Calling Dr. Schoch 292 Thanos5150 16-May-13 19:41
Re: Calling Dr. Schoch 259 Dr. Troglodyte 16-May-13 21:56
Re: Calling Dr. Schoch 244 Thanos5150 16-May-13 23:11
Re: Calling Dr. Schoch 226 Dr. Troglodyte 17-May-13 00:01
Re: Calling Dr. Schoch 263 Thanos5150 17-May-13 00:30
Re: Calling Dr. Schoch 231 cladking 16-May-13 21:50
Moderator Caution 282 Hoppy 15-May-13 14:09
Re: William Wilberforce, crook 199 Martin Stower 13-May-13 16:53
Re: William Wilberforce, crook 235 Scott Creighton 13-May-13 17:40
Re: William Wilberforce, crook 229 Martin Stower 13-May-13 18:32
Re: William Wilberforce, crook 162 Scott Creighton 13-May-13 19:23
Moderator Caution #2 154 Hoppy 15-May-13 14:18
Re: William Wilberforce, crook 187 Martin Stower 15-May-13 14:52
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 223 Nejc 11-May-13 13:47
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 212 JonnyMcA 11-May-13 18:41
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 215 Audrey 12-May-13 07:59
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 196 JonnyMcA 12-May-13 09:58
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 248 HungryHun 12-May-13 13:00
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 189 HungryHun 13-May-13 12:46
Re: Caviglia's complaint.... 201 Thunderbird 13-May-13 16:20
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 196 HungryHun 13-May-13 19:36
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 185 Martin Stower 15-May-13 15:04
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 188 HungryHun 16-May-13 10:03
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 194 Martin Stower 16-May-13 10:47
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 172 Merrell 16-May-13 16:33
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 195 Martin Stower 18-May-13 15:02
Re: If fake, then... what? 224 MJT 16-May-13 12:45
More Vyse wickedness 210 Martin Stower 18-May-13 15:14
Re: More Vyse wickedness 295 Scott Creighton 19-May-13 09:01
Re: More Vyse wickedness 306 Martin Stower 20-May-13 16:44
Re: More Vyse wickedness 307 Scott Creighton 20-May-13 17:56
Re: More Vyse wickedness 342 jamesglory 21-May-13 10:26
Re: More Vyse wickedness 317 Audrey 22-May-13 02:42
Moderator Caution 246 Hoppy 20-May-13 17:57
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 232 Audrey 14-Jun-14 21:11
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 198 cladking 14-Jun-14 21:49
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 211 Scott Creighton 15-Jun-14 00:13
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 235 eyeofhorus33 15-Jun-14 00:58
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 203 cladking 15-Jun-14 01:12
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 201 Sirfiroth 15-Jun-14 19:09
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 233 cladking 15-Jun-14 20:40
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 224 Audrey 16-Jun-14 03:32
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 304 eyeofhorus33 16-Jun-14 18:38
Re: Audrey - How to photoshop a cartouche a la Vyse 220 Audrey 23-Jun-14 03:15
Australian Funeral 256 molder 15-Jun-14 05:03
Re: Australian Funeral 367 Audrey 16-Jun-14 03:56
Re: Australian Funeral 193 molder 16-Jun-14 12:06
Re: Australian Funeral 201 cladking 16-Jun-14 16:50
Re: Australian Funeral 179 Audrey 23-Jun-14 01:58
Re: Australian Funeral 224 molder 19-Jun-14 07:25
Re: Australian Funeral 198 molder 20-Jun-14 10:28
Re: Australian Funeral/North American Funeral 178 molder 22-Jun-14 06:53

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