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Thanos5150 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Merrell Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------

> > I'm afraid I'm unable to read that inscription.
>
> Martin can. So can others. This drawing may be
> from Lepsius, but regardless of any past confusion
> Hawass has verified the existence of something of
> the same in G1.

The point is that the available evidence points to Hawass not being correct on this question - as Martin Stower (who, as you rightly pointed out, can read inscriptions) indicated here:

Quote

I have been puzzled by this ‘year 17’ story for years, as there is no sign of any such date in Vyse/Perring/Hill.

Goyon debunked it in Le secret des bâtisseurs des grandes pyramides: Khéops, first published in 1977.

This is what he wrote in an endnote:
Quote

156. On avait, par erreur, rapporté qu'on avait trouvé la date 17 du règne de Khéops dans la première chambre de décharge de la pyramide de ce roi (Petrie, Hist of Egypt, 1927, 60; Grinsell, Egyptian Pyramids, 1947, 105). En fait, cette date a été trouvée à Dahchour (Lepsius, Denk. II, p. 1).
Early editions of Petrie’s History of Egypt had this (on page 41 in the third edition, 1897):
Quote

The name of the king is found repeatedly written in red paint, among the quarry marks, on the blocks of masonry above the King's chamber; this establishes the traditional attribution of the pyramid. . . .
In the tenth edition (1923), this changed to the following (on page 60):
Quote

The name of the king is found repeatedly written in red paint, with the date of the 17th year on the blocks of masonry above the King's chamber; this establishes the traditional attribution of the pyramid. . . .
Grinsell merely cites Petrie.

Although the year specified in the Lepsius lithograph (at Dashur, not Giza!):

[edoc3.bibliothek.uni-halle.de]

—is 16 rather than 17, I remain persuaded that Goyon is right: Petrie has misattributed a date from elsewhere to Giza, probably through misreading (and misremembering?) the illustration in Lepsius. We may note that Petrie always cites Lepsius for these marks, rather than Vyse/Perring/Hill; this is a pity, as the Lepsius is (to a moral certainty) based on Hill and Perring and not on a new drawing. Close examination of Perring might have dispensed with the error at the outset.

It does not help that Hawass made this part of his routine: “year 17, it was—it’s fading.”

> > However, as pointed out in
this archive post
> > (NB, the first YouTube link is dead), neither
> > Perring nor Reisner/Rowe shows anything
> resembling a date.
> >
> > Nor could I find any mention of the supposed
> > "Khufu and Year 17" question in Gardiner,
> Regnal > > Years and Civil Calendar, JEA 31 (Dec., 1945),
> > 11-28.
>
> Which is all irrelevant though now isn't it if
> Hawass has in fact confirmed it's existence...?

Well: please see comments/discussion above ...

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 1888 Martin Stower 30-Oct-19 11:13
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 417 Barbelo 30-Oct-19 11:33
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 389 Martin Stower 30-Oct-19 13:36
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 248 Barbelo 30-Oct-19 20:28
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 335 Thanos5150 30-Oct-19 16:10
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 314 Warwick 30-Oct-19 20:07
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 360 Martin Stower 30-Oct-19 20:57
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 278 Corpuscles 31-Oct-19 01:07
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 325 Martin Stower 31-Oct-19 11:07
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 203 Merrell 22-Nov-19 16:09
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 308 Martin Stower 31-Oct-19 13:34
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 298 PB Bytes 19-Nov-19 00:24
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 241 Thanos5150 19-Nov-19 16:55
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 206 engbren 21-Nov-19 11:01
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 229 Martin Stower 21-Nov-19 14:45
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 191 engbren 22-Nov-19 11:05
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 214 Martin Stower 22-Nov-19 15:06
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 197 Hanslune 22-Nov-19 15:32
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 235 sfbey 22-Nov-19 18:51
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 194 Hanslune 23-Nov-19 01:19
2 responces . . 199 Warwick 22-Nov-19 19:32
Re: 2 responces . . 219 cladking 22-Nov-19 21:14
Re: 2 responces . . 224 Martin Stower 22-Nov-19 21:29
Re: 2 responces . . 296 cladking 23-Nov-19 02:14
Deleted the same attempts to get people to respond to him 203 Hanslune 23-Nov-19 04:04
Ah, how rare Cladking hijacking a thread 183 Hanslune 23-Nov-19 01:18
Re: 2 responces . . 193 Mayavitch 26-Nov-19 22:33
Re: 2 responces . . 160 Warwick 27-Nov-19 17:36
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 201 PB Bytes 23-Nov-19 17:50
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 203 Merrell 24-Nov-19 10:12
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 230 Lee McGiffen 24-Nov-19 13:18
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 217 Thanos5150 24-Nov-19 14:28
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 189 Warwick 24-Nov-19 19:54
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 198 Thanos5150 25-Nov-19 02:26
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 178 engbren 25-Nov-19 06:36
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 194 Thanos5150 25-Nov-19 16:11
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 203 cladking 25-Nov-19 17:53
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 273 cladking 26-Nov-19 20:02
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 190 Merrell 25-Nov-19 09:54
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 209 Thanos5150 25-Nov-19 16:50
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 190 Merrell 25-Nov-19 22:45
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 204 Merrell 26-Nov-19 17:51
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 218 Thanos5150 27-Nov-19 06:19
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 184 Corpuscles 28-Nov-19 05:47
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 174 Thanos5150 28-Nov-19 17:01
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 181 Merrell 28-Nov-19 10:25
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 174 Merrell 28-Nov-19 14:01
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 184 Thanos5150 28-Nov-19 17:11
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 176 Merrell 28-Nov-19 17:48
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 170 Thanos5150 28-Nov-19 18:53
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 177 Thanos5150 28-Nov-19 20:20
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 169 Corpuscles 28-Nov-19 21:31
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 184 Thanos5150 29-Nov-19 00:19
Petrie’s Confusion Problem 243 Dr. Troglodyte 01-Dec-19 19:54
Re: Petrie’s Confusion Problem 241 Corpuscles 01-Dec-19 23:51
Re: Petrie’s Confusion Problem 172 Merrell 02-Dec-19 10:03
Re: Petrie’s Confusion Problem 202 Martin Stower 02-Dec-19 14:38
Re: Petrie’s Confusion Problem 171 Thanos5150 03-Dec-19 16:54
as far as that goes..... 160 Warwick 03-Dec-19 18:20
Re: Petrie’s Confusion Problem 215 Martin Stower 03-Dec-19 19:32
Tunnel vision 723 Warwick 04-Dec-19 20:18
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 194 Martin Stower 28-Nov-19 21:05
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 170 Thanos5150 28-Nov-19 21:51
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 221 Martin Stower 28-Nov-19 22:28
“. . . lost until Zahi Hawass found it . . .” 265 Martin Stower 29-Nov-19 14:50
Re: “. . . lost until Zahi Hawass found it . . .” 178 Thanos5150 29-Nov-19 19:03
Re: “. . . lost until Zahi Hawass found it . . .” 168 Merrell 29-Nov-19 20:44
Re: “. . . lost until Zahi Hawass found it . . .” 174 Martin Stower 30-Nov-19 01:02
Re: “. . . lost until Zahi Hawass found it . . .” 174 Thanos5150 30-Nov-19 05:31
Re: “. . . lost until Zahi Hawass found it . . .” 184 Thanos5150 30-Nov-19 06:11
Re: “. . . lost until Zahi Hawass found it . . .” 190 Martin Stower 30-Nov-19 12:49
From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 209 Martin Stower 30-Nov-19 14:38
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 168 Thanos5150 30-Nov-19 16:34
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 179 Martin Stower 30-Nov-19 16:57
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 173 Martin Stower 30-Nov-19 17:43
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 166 Corpuscles 30-Nov-19 18:31
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 189 Martin Stower 30-Nov-19 18:46
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 173 Corpuscles 30-Nov-19 18:55
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 189 Martin Stower 30-Nov-19 19:18
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 154 Corpuscles 30-Nov-19 23:04
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 172 Merrell 30-Nov-19 21:22
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 156 Corpuscles 30-Nov-19 23:12
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 163 Thanos5150 01-Dec-19 00:25
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 184 Martin Stower 01-Dec-19 00:54
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 207 Corpuscles 01-Dec-19 01:37
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 187 Martin Stower 01-Dec-19 14:18
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 188 Martin Stower 01-Dec-19 14:55
Hawass: other possible slips 179 Merrell 01-Dec-19 15:28
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 179 Martin Stower 01-Dec-19 19:16
Re: From the site of Andrew Bayuk (“Guardian”) 156 Corpuscles 01-Dec-19 23:32
Re: “. . . lost until Zahi Hawass found it . . .” 181 Thanos5150 30-Nov-19 16:38
Re: “. . . lost until Zahi Hawass found it . . .” 150 Merrell 30-Nov-19 18:14
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 223 Merrell 25-Nov-19 23:57
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 188 Thanos5150 26-Nov-19 16:38
Infrastructure . 195 Warwick 26-Nov-19 17:29
What Irony? n/t 184 cladking 26-Nov-19 20:05
do TRY being objective 165 Warwick 26-Nov-19 20:14
Re: do TRY being objective 190 cladking 26-Nov-19 20:25
so you choose subjective 180 Warwick 26-Nov-19 20:49
Re: so you choose subjective 178 cladking 26-Nov-19 23:17
Re: so you choose subjective 194 Warwick 27-Nov-19 02:51
So You Evade the Subject Again. 254 cladking 27-Nov-19 03:43
Re: So You Evade the Subject Again. 154 Warwick 27-Nov-19 17:29
Egyptologists Couldn't Find a Ramp with Both Hands. 156 cladking 27-Nov-19 18:11
Re: Egyptologists Couldn't Find a Ramp with Both Hands. 171 Warwick 27-Nov-19 18:21
Cladking hijacks another thread and makes it about ramps - again 142 Hanslune 27-Nov-19 23:39
Cladking logic: If you disagree with me you are an Egyptologist! 189 Hanslune 27-Nov-19 12:58
Re: Cladking logic: If you disagree with me you are an Egyptologist! 152 Warwick 27-Nov-19 17:41
A better idea 160 Hanslune 27-Nov-19 18:12
New from K-tel 173 Warwick 27-Nov-19 18:16
Re: New from K-tel 159 Hanslune 28-Nov-19 00:08
Re: New from K-tel 187 Lee McGiffen 28-Nov-19 01:46
Re: New from K-tel 291 cladking 28-Nov-19 01:57
Re: New from K-tel 162 Hanslune 28-Nov-19 16:40
Putting this to bed 156 Warwick 28-Nov-19 18:11
Re: so you choose subjective 155 Thanos5150 28-Nov-19 19:11
Re: so you choose subjective 152 Warwick 28-Nov-19 20:44
Classic unintended comedy! 211 Hanslune 27-Nov-19 13:04
Re: Infrastructure . 173 Thanos5150 27-Nov-19 00:15
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 186 Merrell 26-Nov-19 18:56
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 160 Merrell 28-Nov-19 22:48
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 181 Thanos5150 29-Nov-19 03:37
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 145 Merrell 29-Nov-19 20:26
Ahket . 191 Warwick 25-Nov-19 17:56
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 229 Hanslune 24-Nov-19 16:27
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 181 Thanos5150 25-Nov-19 00:31
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 178 Hanslune 25-Nov-19 00:53
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 185 Thanos5150 25-Nov-19 02:08
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 184 Hanslune 25-Nov-19 05:49
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 187 Merrell 25-Nov-19 10:12
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 152 seasmith 25-Nov-19 22:09
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 153 Warwick 25-Nov-19 22:31
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 162 Merrell 25-Nov-19 22:35
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 157 seasmith 25-Nov-19 23:11
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 148 Warwick 26-Nov-19 20:23
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 174 Martin Stower 26-Nov-19 14:35
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 167 seasmith 27-Nov-19 02:48
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 169 PB Bytes 24-Nov-19 16:59
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 187 Thanos5150 24-Nov-19 14:07
Re: Mainstream endorsement of Creighton’s HOAX . . . 185 PB Bytes 24-Nov-19 17:21
not Graffiti 187 Warwick 24-Nov-19 19:47
Re: not Graffiti 195 Hanslune 24-Nov-19 21:51
Monkey see.. 201 Warwick 24-Nov-19 23:40
Re: not Graffiti 214 PB Bytes 24-Nov-19 21:58
Please, for God’s sake, . . . 847 Martin Stower 27-Nov-19 19:52
Mods can you stop Cladking from hijacking this thread? 197 Hanslune 27-Nov-19 23:41
Mod Warning > General OP Hijacking 237 Dr. Troglodyte 28-Nov-19 17:21


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