Mysteries :  The Official GrahamHancock.com forums
For serious discussion of the controversies, approaches and enigmas surrounding the origins and development of the human species and of human civilization. (NB: for more ‘out there’ posts we point you in the direction of the ‘Paranormal & Supernatural’ Message Board). 
Welcome! Log InRegister
Thanos writes “These connections are nearly 2,000yrs or more after the fact and have no relevance to Egyptian history prior to these times. The relationship with Harran, for example, was established in the 7th century BC when the Assyrians invaded and conquered Egypt. Harran itself was not even founded until the end of the 3rd millennium. The poorly documented Sabians, mostly from less than credible Arab accounts, are from AD times and the connection they have with Egypt is only by way of their alleged belief in some form of Hermeticism. The connection between Hermes and Thoth was made in the Ptolemaic Period and one imposed by the Greeks with no historical relevance prior to its invention.”

The founding of Harran at the end of the 3rd millennium? Do you know of a text that establishes plainly that Harran did not exist earlier than that? Of course, there is the mention of Harran in Genesis, not that it helps with a timeframe. There is a town not too far away from Harran, ancient Edessa now called Sanliurfa, that has some rather lovely gardens and an ongoing tradition concerning Abraham. Apparently, it was on a par with Harran for its teachings at one time – Arabian source in AD, of course.

The Syrian Ebla tablets gave Harran as ‘a crossroads for trade in the Middle East’ at around 2300 BC. It would have been active well before that if it was already known far and wide as a crossroads. In fact, its very position along with this description would no doubt mean that Harran was in full contact with Egypt in the 3rd millennium, if not before.

The Sumerian name in full comprising three symbols, HAR-RA-AN, is attested from around 2500 BC and given as ‘route, passage, path’, a description that corresponds well. I have found meanings pertaining to commerce and financial operations connected to the name at around 3000 BC. It would be very interesting to know of a document that claims its founding. Otherwise, it will be a matter of opinion and mine will continue to lean towards ‘an age-old place’.

As for Greek Hermes becoming associated with Egyptian Thoth, perhaps it was a decision made by those pesky Greeks…or not? Plagiarism? They had an awful lot of similar/identical attributes, that’s for sure – apart from the ibis head, of course. Might they all have come from a third, perhaps older source?

And, of course, you’re quite right: Second hand accounts of ancient events given by Arabs in the 1st millennium AD leaning on older accounts given by Christians who wrote that, according to their 'source', pagans claimed the ‘new’ name of Sabians – by which we are made to understand that they had no right to it beforehand - are indeed to be handled with caution. That also begs the question of who they claimed the real Sabians were, the ones that had already been mentioned several times in the Qu’ran by then and were apparently untouchable. Perhaps they existed elsewhere but, in the meantime, I have found at least four occurrences of the epithet SHA-BI in a totally pagan setting in a text that I daresay you will prefer to continue to call The Instructions of Shuruppak. It dates to 2600 BC and it’s first hand – no Arabs, no Christians, only me. That name, composed of two symbols, has more to do with beer than with stars, but one doesn’t rule out the other. It’s the name of HAR-RA-AN that proves the people to be astronomers, but also brewers… References available on demand.

But I'm still interested in the origin of that Great Pyramid ship and would prefer to stay with that subject.

Madeleine



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03-Mar-19 16:23 by MDaines.

Options: ReplyQuote


Subject Views Written By Posted
The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 3660 MDaines 22-Feb-19 09:52
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 576 Thanos5150 22-Feb-19 16:15
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 437 MDaines 23-Feb-19 18:01
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 431 Thanos5150 24-Feb-19 03:06
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 403 Eddie Larry 22-Feb-19 18:39
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 402 cladking 22-Feb-19 20:12
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 409 MDaines 23-Feb-19 07:40
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 356 cladking 23-Feb-19 14:28
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 366 MDaines 23-Feb-19 15:23
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 306 cladking 02-Mar-19 16:31
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 348 Eddie Larry 23-Feb-19 16:24
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 352 Spiros 25-Feb-19 00:41
On the subject of Zechariah Sitchin 410 MDaines 25-Feb-19 14:49
Re: On the subject of Zechariah Sitchin 323 Spiros 04-Mar-19 01:11
The Exalted Sumero-Greek EN 332 MDaines 04-Mar-19 18:24
A Big Ask 398 Dr. Troglodyte 26-Feb-19 01:27
Re: A Big Ask 320 MDaines 26-Feb-19 14:25
Re: A Big Ask 388 Dr. Troglodyte 26-Feb-19 17:14
Re: A Big Ask 296 MDaines 26-Feb-19 19:30
Re: A Big Ask 312 Barbelo 26-Feb-19 20:23
Re: A Big Ask 319 MDaines 27-Feb-19 12:13
Re: A Big Ask 268 Barbelo 27-Feb-19 20:28
Re: A Big Ask 271 MDaines 28-Feb-19 14:05
Re: A Big Ask 294 Barbelo 28-Feb-19 19:59
Re: A Big Ask 333 Thanos5150 01-Mar-19 00:46
Re: A Big Ask 316 Barbelo 01-Mar-19 01:19
Re: A Big Ask 349 Thanos5150 01-Mar-19 05:20
Re: A Weird Ask 335 Barbelo 01-Mar-19 11:13
Re: A Weird Ask 339 Thanos5150 02-Mar-19 05:12
Re: A Weird Ask 334 Barbelo 02-Mar-19 07:06
Re: A Big Ask 288 MDaines 01-Mar-19 18:35
Re: A Big Ask 288 Barbelo 01-Mar-19 21:42
Re: A Big Ask 318 Thanos5150 28-Feb-19 03:33
Re: A Big Ask 305 Thanos5150 28-Feb-19 17:11
Re: A Big Ask 291 MDaines 28-Feb-19 18:08
Heliopolis 307 Barbelo 28-Feb-19 20:18
Midpoint Sunrise-Sunset 382 Dr. Troglodyte 04-Mar-19 23:56
Re: Midpoint Sunrise-Sunset 330 MDaines 10-Mar-19 14:41
Re: Midpoint Sunrise-Sunset 322 Dr. Troglodyte 12-Mar-19 00:17
Re: Midpoint Sunrise-Sunset 284 MDaines 15-Mar-19 07:17
Re: Midpoint Sunrise-Sunset 372 Dr. Troglodyte 15-Mar-19 16:41
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 344 molder 26-Feb-19 21:23
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 330 MDaines 27-Feb-19 12:06
Three Wise Men 285 MDaines 02-Mar-19 15:31
Re: Three Wise Men 282 Thanos5150 02-Mar-19 17:05
Harran and the Sabians 347 MDaines 03-Mar-19 08:33
Re: Harran and the Sabians 360 Thanos5150 03-Mar-19 16:40
Re: Harran and the Sabians 325 MDaines 03-Mar-19 19:24
Re: Harran and the Sabians 274 Thanos5150 06-Mar-19 01:50
Re: Harran and the Sabians 277 MDaines 06-Mar-19 08:22
Re: Harran and the Sabians 261 Thanos5150 07-Mar-19 02:09
Re: Harran and the Sabians 296 MDaines 07-Mar-19 08:20
On the subject of Ebla and the Feather of Truth 289 MDaines 08-Mar-19 08:57
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 342 Broker 14-Mar-19 03:25
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 280 MDaines 17-Mar-19 09:11
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 296 SandyJesse 18-Apr-19 04:33
Celestial navigation and the ship 267 MDaines 23-Apr-19 07:21
Re: Celestial navigation and the ship 269 SandyJesse 25-Apr-19 01:50
Re: Celestial navigation and the ship 272 SandyJesse 30-Apr-19 05:16
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 240 seasmith 03-May-19 22:24
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 232 MDaines 04-May-19 08:28
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 231 seasmith 05-May-19 01:39
BEFORE BABEL The Crystal Tongue 269 MDaines 09-May-19 09:46
Re: BEFORE BABEL The Crystal Tongue 265 SandyJesse 12-May-19 09:58
Re: BEFORE BABEL The Crystal Tongue 224 MDaines 12-May-19 10:22
Re: BEFORE BABEL The Crystal Tongue 230 SandyJesse 14-May-19 05:21
Re: BEFORE BABEL The Crystal Tongue 209 MDaines 14-May-19 07:46
Re: BEFORE BABEL The Crystal Tongue 238 SandyJesse 16-May-19 03:19
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 202 drew 15-May-19 01:21
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 191 Barbelo 15-May-19 10:48
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 235 drew 15-May-19 23:59
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 204 Barbelo 16-May-19 01:45
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 171 drew 18-Jun-19 02:15
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 171 Barbelo 18-Jun-19 02:43
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 218 hendrik dirker 18-Jun-19 06:59
movement of Sun along horizon 180 hendrik dirker 19-Jun-19 16:23
Solstice & the epoch1250 BC 345 hendrik dirker 20-Jun-19 07:02
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 202 MDaines 15-May-19 11:00
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 219 Horatech 15-May-19 12:10
To Easter Island? 216 MDaines 15-May-19 18:10
Re: To Easter Island? 211 Horatech 16-May-19 06:56
Re: To Easter Island? 203 Horatech 16-May-19 23:48
Re: To Easter Island? 240 Horatech 17-May-19 06:25
Re: To Easter Island? 186 Barbelo 17-May-19 10:53
Re: To Easter Island? 223 MDaines 17-May-19 11:41
What A Shame 205 Barbelo 17-May-19 21:14
Re: What A Shame 223 MDaines 18-May-19 07:57
Great Circles and Small Circles 229 Dr. Troglodyte 18-May-19 17:34
Re: Great Circles and Small Circles and Easter Island 234 MDaines 18-May-19 19:09
Re: Great Circles and Small Circles and Easter Island 205 Dr. Troglodyte 19-May-19 17:07
Going Round in Circles and then to Easter Island? 250 MDaines 19-May-19 18:10
Re: Going Round in Circles and then to Easter Island? 229 Horatech 25-May-19 10:53
Re: Great Circles and Small Circles and Easter Island 222 Horatech 20-May-19 07:33
Re: Great Circles and Small Circles and Easter Island 202 Horatech 21-May-19 09:52
Re: Great Circles and Small Circles and Easter Island 254 Dr. Troglodyte 21-May-19 18:30
Re: Great Circles, Small Circles, Easter Island 263 MDaines 23-May-19 07:51
Re: Great Circles, Small Circles, Easter Island 229 Horatech 23-May-19 10:48
Re: Great Circles, Small Circles, Easter Island 220 MDaines 23-May-19 17:07
Re: Great Circles, Small Circles, Easter Island 230 Horatech 24-May-19 08:12
Re: Great Circles, Small Circles, Easter Island 251 Dr. Troglodyte 23-May-19 16:05
Re: Great Circles, Small Circles, Easter Island 233 MDaines 23-May-19 17:05
Re: Great Circles, Small Circles, Easter Island 260 Dr. Troglodyte 23-May-19 17:31
Re: Great Circles and Small Circles and Easter Island 275 Horatech 27-May-19 10:30
Re: What A Shame 207 Barbelo 19-May-19 20:48
Re: To Easter Island? 199 Horatech 18-May-19 09:28
Re: To Easter Island? 189 Eddie Larry 17-May-19 15:11
Re: To Easter Island? 194 Horatech 18-May-19 14:58
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 218 drew 15-May-19 23:57
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 217 MDaines 16-May-19 06:14
Re: The Three Stone Ships from the East - of the Giza Plateau 203 drew 16-May-19 06:42
ps 189 drew 16-May-19 07:22
Re: ps 188 Barbelo 16-May-19 11:11
Re: ps 209 MDaines 16-May-19 12:10
Re: ps 233 Thanos5150 16-May-19 16:06
Re: ps 228 Barbelo 16-May-19 21:00
Sometimes I go the long way round… 248 drew 17-May-19 00:59


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.