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R Avry Wilson Wrote:
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> I surmise it is common given the relative genus of
> the region. Is this commonality not suggested by
> yourself as regards ancient Egyptian royalty?

Not sure what you mean by "relative genus" as all humans are part of the genus "homo" regardless of what region they are from. I am not suggesting it, but noting the fact it exists which anyone can see for themselves. There is a commonality among AE royalty however it is not common amongst the population at large. You are comparing the Bolivian skull to modern skulls which obviously the Bolivian infants skull type is not "common" by comparison. To use these parameters as we can see it is quite unusual.

> Sorry Lee, it seemed like a general, calm
> question. Given in the spirit of making sure I
> stay on point. Still, the question is somewhat
> generalized, I can agree on that. I suppose I am
> merely curious why we are discussing natural
> occurrences of dolichocephaly as though there are
> geographical connections between South
> Amerindians, Korean peninsula Silla, and ancient
> Egyptians. If instead this a discussion about
> dolichocephaly itself, then fine, but otherwise I
> take exception to a argument of diaspora.

This is not the point, at least as it pertains to what I am saying. The point is that regardless of where they are found they are almost always immediately explained away as artificial deformation which is obviously not true in all cases. The reason of noting such examples of this natural phenomenon is to build an inventory of examples that prove this, not that they may or may not be connected culturally. When you read the sources you cite what do they both say:

#1:
Quote

"Scientists and archaeologists generally believe that the skulls’ strange appearance is the result of intentional deformation practiced by the Paracas culture."

#2:
Quote

Many of the high status burials of the Paracas Necropolis Culture have deformed skulls, which are usually believed to be deliberately induced using boards and weights.

You'd think these were written by Mrs Trump's speech writer. I wonder how many times we uncritically repeat what professionals often uncritically "believe" before it becomes "truth"?

> It is a fair question to have asked.

Fair, but you know my answer.

> Presumed skull of Akhenaten:
>
> Better to use an extant sculpture of his daughter.

Why? It is still an example of such skulls regardless.

> I am not denying the existence of the condition. I
> take issue with the context in which these finds
> in your OP (which are from years ago, not new?)
> suggest a relationship between cultures separated
> by oceans and millennia.


This was not my intent regardless of whether a case could be made or not. For me it is a matter of proving first they are in fact natural which from that point the diffusion of such can be addressed.

> I appreciate the continued examples. :) There are
> lots. Point of note, that is not Nefertiti.

Interesting. Apparently so. Another example of this skull type nonetheless and presumably more likely it belonged to one of her daughters. Regardless of the minutia of who is actually who, there are numerous physical and statuary examples of these cranial types during this period going back long before.

I just ran across this which claims her famous bust may be a modern fake:'Fake' claims over Nefertiti bust


> Perhaps better if we could track down her actual
> remains, or an extant sculpture without head gear.

This is the closest I could find:


> Regardless of the author's admission, Foerster's
> claims are fantastical nonsense.

As I said to Willie in this thread regarding Forester:
Quote

Not interested in his opinions, but he is the one with the pictures which speak for themselves. Whatever shortcomings he may have, the skeletons are still there.

It is easy to attack Forrester's credibility to cast doubt on these skulls but the skulls speak for themselves and there are so many examples of them, many right there in museums for all to see, that have nothing to do with him.

> But here you seem to be taking exception with a review of
> Foerster and his fringe claims.

Please quote me where I have taken exception to any review of Forrester's "fringe claims" or where I have even mentioned them? The only thing I mention are the notes of the age of the woman and child which I hardly see as "fringe".

I quoted this:
Quote

The above intact skeleton, according to Ken would have died between 10 and 12 years old, possibly 13 and though her skeleton appears normal, her head is clearly huge and elongated. The shape of the pelvis indicated a female, and the skull, Ken said, is way out of the range for cranial deformation.

And this:
Quote

As well, there was a fetus found in the tower which died, according to radiologist Ken, at between 7 and 9 months development. He believes it is quite possible that the fetus was from the young girl, and that both may likely have died during childbirth, or soon before that.

How are these "fringe claims" exactly? It doesn't necessarily mean they are 100% accurate, though they might be, but hardly "fringe".

[snip]


I posted these pics and links as a matter of general interest which people can read and make up their own minds. The skulls are still there around the world regardless of Forrester and the like.



Edited 6 time(s). Last edit at 21-Jul-16 16:06 by Thanos5150.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 4978 Thanos5150 11-Jul-16 17:41
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 1146 DScribr 11-Jul-16 18:28
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 1115 Thanos5150 11-Jul-16 18:39
Re: Stop cursing!! 1049 Thunderbird 11-Jul-16 20:10
Re: Stop Dreaming 1160 DScribr 11-Jul-16 22:44
Re: Stop Dreaming .. and cursing ... and don't dirty the well. 962 SallyA 29-Dec-16 02:26
Re: Stop cursing!! 533 Origyptian 05-Aug-17 15:07
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 986 Thanos5150 11-Jul-16 18:33
Re: David Flynn Giant Geogylphs of Tiwanaku 1031 Thunderbird 11-Jul-16 20:23
Human Fetus With Elongated Skull, Found In Bolivia 1119 warrenb 13-Jul-16 19:36
Mod Note > Duplicate Topic Merged 874 Dr. Troglodyte 13-Jul-16 21:57
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 934 Harte 14-Jul-16 21:06
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 1011 Ratcho 14-Jul-16 21:26
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 995 Harte 14-Jul-16 21:50
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 997 Ratcho 15-Jul-16 15:08
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 893 Harte 15-Jul-16 17:00
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 1042 Ratcho 15-Jul-16 19:31
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 952 Yourconscience 17-Jul-16 14:48
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 877 Harte 18-Jul-16 22:41
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 909 Audrey 19-Jul-16 01:32
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 937 Thanos5150 19-Jul-16 02:39
Re: Tiwanaku 1093 Thunderbird 19-Jul-16 05:34
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 965 Audrey 19-Jul-16 06:27
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 897 Harte 19-Jul-16 23:37
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 974 Audrey 20-Jul-16 00:24
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 907 Harte 20-Jul-16 18:32
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 896 Martin Stower 20-Jul-16 02:34
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 1009 Audrey 20-Jul-16 03:06
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 894 Martin Stower 20-Jul-16 03:27
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 852 Martin Stower 20-Jul-16 17:39
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 957 Harte 20-Jul-16 18:59
Re: Elongated Skulls ...Ancient ages evidence 867 Thunderbird 19-Jul-16 15:03
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 853 R Avry Wilson 20-Jul-16 03:43
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 813 Audrey 20-Jul-16 04:09
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 870 R Avry Wilson 20-Jul-16 04:26
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 940 Audrey 20-Jul-16 04:39
Mod Notice: Account suspended 1004 lukehancock 21-Jul-16 01:45
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 781 Thanos5150 20-Jul-16 04:25
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 859 R Avry Wilson 20-Jul-16 04:39
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 863 Thanos5150 20-Jul-16 05:14
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 861 Audrey 20-Jul-16 05:59
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 1022 R Avry Wilson 20-Jul-16 06:24
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 862 D-Archer 20-Jul-16 09:32
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 1926 Thanos5150 20-Jul-16 18:29
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 1199 R Avry Wilson 20-Jul-16 22:00
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 823 Thanos5150 20-Jul-16 22:28
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 966 R Avry Wilson 21-Jul-16 05:14
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 822 Warwick 21-Jul-16 16:00
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 875 Thanos5150 21-Jul-16 03:14
Re: DNA results Paracas Skulls ...world migrations 870 Thunderbird 21-Jul-16 01:31
Re: DNA results Paracas Skulls ...world migrations 875 Martin Stower 21-Jul-16 01:46
Re: Calm down...Paracas are not Aliens... 1031 Thunderbird 21-Jul-16 04:07
Re: Calm down...Paracas are not Aliens... 905 Martin Stower 21-Jul-16 17:47
Re: Calm down...Paracas are not Aliens... 935 Martin Stower 21-Jul-16 22:50
Re: Calm down...Paracas are not Aliens... 885 Jon Ellison 21-Jul-16 19:38
Re: Calm down...Paracas are not Aliens... 805 eyeofhorus33 21-Jul-16 20:00
Re: Calm down...Paracas are not Aliens... 899 Origyptian 21-Jul-16 20:11
Re: Calm down...Paracas are not Aliens... 885 Jon Ellison 21-Jul-16 20:38
Re: Calm down...Paracas are not Aliens... 866 Origyptian 21-Jul-16 22:40
Re: Calm down...It's a Polyploid : ) 970 Thunderbird 22-Jul-16 16:07
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 1307 loveritas 23-Jul-16 22:30
Re: Possible Discovery Of Ancient Mother And Baby With Elongated Heads In Bolivia 849 Thanos5150 24-Jul-16 01:02
BREAKING: New DNA Testing on 2,000-Year-Old Elongated Paracas Skulls Changes Known History 1240 D-Archer 25-Jul-16 11:06
Re: Iran 1219 Thanos5150 25-Dec-16 22:07
Re: Iran 951 Thunderbird 26-Dec-16 01:18
Re: Iran 964 Thanos5150 16-Jan-17 21:21
Re: Iran 1385 Thanos5150 26-Apr-17 18:10
Re: Iran 783 Origyptian 26-Apr-17 19:38
Re: Iran 737 Thanos5150 26-Apr-17 20:28
Re: Iran 881 Origyptian 26-Apr-17 21:34
Interesting story line--maybe even a hypothesis 851 drrayeye 26-Apr-17 21:08
Re: Interesting story line--maybe even a hypothesis 803 Thanos5150 27-Apr-17 04:16
Re: Interesting story line--maybe even a hypothesis 784 drrayeye 27-Apr-17 12:25
Re: Iran 707 Thanos5150 30-Apr-17 20:32
Re: Iran 712 Origyptian 01-May-17 11:13
Re: Iran 1059 Thanos5150 01-May-17 17:16
Re: Iran 874 Origyptian 01-May-17 17:27
Re: Iran 877 Thanos5150 01-May-17 20:21
Re: Iran 1011 Thanos5150 02-May-17 00:11
Re: Iran 784 SallyA 02-May-17 17:05
Re: Iran 633 Thanos5150 02-May-17 18:34
Re: Pineal Gland /3rd Eye 586 Thunderbird 25-Jun-17 15:33
Re: Pineal Gland /3rd Eye 596 SallyA 25-Jun-17 16:34
Re:Ygg drasil 556 Thunderbird 26-Jun-17 01:31
Re: Re: Odin - One Eye 568 Thunderbird 26-Jun-17 19:02
Re: Re:Ygg drasil ... the eye as beholder and presenter of the seeker ... 768 SallyA 26-Jun-17 23:17
Re: Re:Ygg drasil ... Tree of life in all places in the common Universe? 667 SallyA 28-Jun-17 19:58
Re: Re:Ygg drasil ... Tree of life in all places in the common Universe? 730 Thunderbird 29-Jun-17 05:01
Re: Re:Ygg drasil ... Tree of life in all places in the common Universe? 653 SallyA 29-Jun-17 05:46
Re: Re:Yggdrasil ... Dan Winter gives the explain in words or math 807 SallyA 30-Jun-17 20:48
Re: Iran 842 Warwick 02-May-17 17:24
Re: Iran 658 Warwick 02-May-17 17:25
Re: Iran 787 Thanos5150 02-May-17 18:40
Re: Iran 809 Warwick 03-May-17 16:40
Re: Iran 832 SallyA 02-May-17 17:59
Re: Iran 771 Thanos5150 02-May-17 18:22
Re: Iran 792 SallyA 02-May-17 19:24
Re: Iran 730 Thanos5150 25-Jun-17 15:09
Re: Crimea 762 Thanos5150 28-Jul-17 16:03
Re: Crimea 645 Thunderbird 30-Jul-17 04:05
Re: Crimea 681 Thanos5150 30-Jul-17 15:29
Re: Crimea 757 Origyptian 30-Jul-17 22:33
Re: Crimea 631 Jon Ellison 31-Jul-17 11:54
Re: Crimea 529 Origyptian 31-Jul-17 13:56
Re: Crimea 592 Thanos5150 31-Jul-17 15:20
Re: Crimea 592 Origyptian 31-Jul-17 17:04
Re: Crimea 604 Thanos5150 01-Aug-17 02:06
Re: Crimea 662 Origyptian 01-Aug-17 02:41
Re: Crimea 521 Jon Ellison 01-Aug-17 11:20
Elongated heads... and giants, aliens, intelligence, & Natural cycles 705 Origyptian 01-Aug-17 13:41
Re: Crimea 493 Jon Ellison 01-Aug-17 12:28
Re: Crimea 626 Origyptian 01-Aug-17 15:00
Re: Crimea 586 Jon Ellison 01-Aug-17 17:02
Re: Crimea 567 Thanos5150 01-Aug-17 16:30
Re: Crimea 517 Jon Ellison 01-Aug-17 16:55
Re: Crimea 538 Thanos5150 01-Aug-17 17:12
Re: Crimea 632 Jon Ellison 01-Aug-17 18:19
Re: Crimea 566 Thanos5150 01-Aug-17 20:55
Re: Crimea 569 Jon Ellison 01-Aug-17 22:03
Re: Crimea 531 Origyptian 01-Aug-17 22:03
Re: Crimea 539 Jon Ellison 01-Aug-17 22:21
Re: Adaption ....in plain sight. 746 Thunderbird 02-Aug-17 04:53
Re: Adaption ....in plain sight. 539 Origyptian 02-Aug-17 12:07
Re: Adaption ....in plain sight. 522 Thunderbird 02-Aug-17 19:59
Re: Adaption ....in plain sight. 543 Jon Ellison 02-Aug-17 12:30
Re: Crimea 556 Thanos5150 01-Aug-17 22:26
Re: Crimea 515 Jon Ellison 01-Aug-17 22:41
Re: Crimea 598 Thanos5150 02-Aug-17 00:56
Re: Crimea 530 Jon Ellison 02-Aug-17 04:37
Re: Crimea 497 Origyptian 02-Aug-17 11:47
Re: Crimea 567 Thanos5150 02-Aug-17 20:54
Re: Crimea 530 Thanos5150 02-Aug-17 20:38
Re: Crimea 531 Origyptian 02-Aug-17 20:40
Re: Crimea 521 Thanos5150 02-Aug-17 22:09
Re: Crimea 495 Jon Ellison 02-Aug-17 22:36
Re: Crimea 574 Origyptian 03-Aug-17 01:22
Re: Crimea 493 Jon Ellison 03-Aug-17 02:18
Re: Crimea 580 Origyptian 03-Aug-17 11:55
Re: Crimea 571 Jon Ellison 03-Aug-17 12:02
Re: Crimea 451 Thanos5150 03-Aug-17 15:26
Re: Crimea 456 Origyptian 04-Aug-17 02:16
Re: Crimea 437 Thanos5150 04-Aug-17 03:53
Wood v Stone 397 R Avry Wilson 04-Aug-17 08:11
Re: Wood v Stone 450 Thanos5150 04-Aug-17 21:59
Re: Crimea 439 Thanos5150 03-Aug-17 05:21
Re: Crimea 433 Jon Ellison 02-Aug-17 22:09
Re: Crimea 424 Thanos5150 03-Aug-17 05:14
Re: Crimea 514 Jon Ellison 03-Aug-17 09:39
Re: Crimea 415 Thanos5150 03-Aug-17 17:53
Re: Crimea 513 Jon Ellison 03-Aug-17 18:35
Re: Crimea 423 eyeofhorus33 03-Aug-17 19:46
Re: Crimea 462 Jon Ellison 03-Aug-17 19:54
Re: Crimea 481 eyeofhorus33 04-Aug-17 09:10
Re: Crimea 429 Origyptian 04-Aug-17 13:34
Re: Crimea 440 Jon Ellison 04-Aug-17 15:17
Re: Crimea 434 Jon Ellison 04-Aug-17 15:34
Re: Crimea 413 eyeofhorus33 04-Aug-17 16:15
Re: Crimea 372 Jon Ellison 04-Aug-17 16:37
Re: Crimea 379 eyeofhorus33 04-Aug-17 17:43
Re: Crimea 505 Thanos5150 04-Aug-17 15:29
Re: Crimea 514 Origyptian 04-Aug-17 17:49
Re: Crimea 434 Thanos5150 04-Aug-17 21:47
Re: Crimea 477 Origyptian 04-Aug-17 22:24
Re: Crimea 392 eyeofhorus33 05-Aug-17 14:34
Re: Crimea 406 Origyptian 05-Aug-17 15:00
Re: Crimea 680 Thanos5150 05-Aug-17 16:21
Re: Crimea 452 Thanos5150 03-Aug-17 21:34
Re: Crimea 416 Origyptian 04-Aug-17 02:49
Re: Crimea 418 Origyptian 01-Aug-17 22:54
Re: Crimea 450 Thanos5150 02-Aug-17 01:00
Re: Crimea 409 Origyptian 02-Aug-17 11:42
Re: Crimea 488 Thanos5150 31-Jul-17 14:53
Re: Giants/Elongated skulls 536 Thunderbird 31-Jul-17 15:28
Re: Giants/Elongated skulls 578 Thanos5150 31-Jul-17 16:43
Re: Crimea 587 Origyptian 31-Jul-17 16:45
Re: Crimea 541 Thanos5150 01-Aug-17 01:34
Re: Crimea 570 Thunderbird 01-Aug-17 02:10
Re: Crimea 624 Thanos5150 01-Aug-17 15:39
Re: Naqada II 736 Thanos5150 30-Aug-17 18:21


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