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Manu Wrote:
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> I need you to clarify something. You propose the
> Meso-Elite came to Egypt within a time-span of
> about 500 years prior to let's say
> Narmer...co-inciding with what is known as the
> Uruk-expansion.

Something to that effect.

> During those 500 years, the script evolved from
> pictograms (what you show there dates to 3500
> B.C., right?)

Yes, I believe it does. Not the "oldest" example, just an example.

> to cuneiform in Uruk and from
> pictograms to hieroglyphs in Egypt even though you
> propose that there was an administrative presence
> which would have maintained the script of the
> homeland, don't you think?

No. I do not think this was "government sponsored" administration, but rather a group of Mesopotamians who came there of their own volition probably first drawn their by trade. They brought the early system of pictograph writing with them, still in its infancy itself, and largely adapted it to incorporate local symbolism and sensibilities. As I said before, when the Hyksos, Greeks, Romans et al ruled Egypt they did not force the infinitely largely local population to speak and write their language, they learned Egyptian.

> Let me ask you
> straight up...do you think there was a
> Mesopotamian ruling class which commanded Lower
> Egypt and was in constant communication with Uruk
> and took orders from there?

No.

> That's what I call
> administrative presence.

I fail to see how it is required this administration be "state sponsored".

> So one alternative explanation is that the
> prevailing medium to record script was not
> conducive to cuneiform writing for example and so
> papyrus won over clay eventually which couldn't be
> etched and imprinted.

This is a very practical explanation.

> Another explanation is that, which is what I
> suspect happened, is that the Meso-Elite was never
> an elite. They were immigrants who brought with
> them some of their know-how and mingled with the
> local population. Out came the White Walls. This
> is a better model to explain partial cultural
> imports as opposed to an all inclusive cultural
> invasion which I still don't see.

I am not suggesting an "invasion" either though there would appear to have been definitely some conflict. Regardless, the burials themselves are representative of this very "elitism" which is the corner stone of the rise of the pharaonic state. By definition they were "elites" who by all reckoning were the rulers and the line that eventually became the 1st pharaohs.

> In any case, if you want to prove/falsify the
> Elite theory I think you won't get around showing
> that specific Uruki genetic traits can be found
> in pre-dynastic royal human remnants. This is
> predicted by your theory.

The inhabitants of Uruk are not a "race" of people and represent an amalgam of Near East, Levantine, and Caucasus peoples, essentially a melting pot of regional ethnicity. The only prediction this theory expects to have is that the Dynastic Elite of this period would not be Nubian, i.e. not from Africa.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 8506 Thanos5150 01-Aug-15 02:50
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1140 Notinham 01-Aug-15 14:23
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1296 Graham Chase 02-Aug-15 19:59
Re: Ubaid onward 1180 Thunderbird 01-Aug-15 20:40
Re: Ubaid onward 1350 Thanos5150 02-Aug-15 04:37
Re: Ubaid onward 1259 Notinham 02-Aug-15 17:31
Re: Ubaid onward 1308 Thanos5150 02-Aug-15 18:18
Re: Ubaid onward 1044 Notinham 02-Aug-15 19:15
Re: Vinca/Copper/Caucuses 1055 Thunderbird 02-Aug-15 20:06
Re: Vinca/Copper/Caucuses 1118 Thanos5150 03-Aug-15 16:12
Re: Vinca/Copper/Caucuses 1126 Thunderbird 03-Aug-15 19:51
Re: Vinca/Copper/Caucuses 1210 Thanos5150 03-Aug-15 22:14
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 888 Manu 19-Nov-16 17:53
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 990 Thanos5150 19-Nov-16 18:35
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1061 Thanos5150 20-Nov-16 05:55
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1069 Manu 20-Nov-16 07:45
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1063 Thanos5150 20-Nov-16 22:27
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 952 Manu 21-Nov-16 00:06
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1042 Thanos5150 21-Nov-16 02:28
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1202 Manu 21-Nov-16 06:18
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1385 Thanos5150 22-Nov-16 18:49
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 980 Manu 22-Nov-16 19:07
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 838 Thanos5150 23-Nov-16 22:59
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 954 Manu 22-Nov-16 19:28
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1120 DScribr 23-Nov-16 02:24
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 877 Manu 22-Nov-16 19:40
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 893 Thanos5150 22-Nov-16 21:21
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 950 Manu 22-Nov-16 22:49
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1198 Thanos5150 23-Nov-16 02:31
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 942 Manu 23-Nov-16 04:25
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1146 Thanos5150 24-Nov-16 20:01
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1056 Warwick 24-Nov-16 20:18
Mesopotamia link to Optics 514 engbren 15-May-19 15:01
Re: Mesopotamia link to Optics 501 Thanos5150 15-May-19 19:40
Re: Mesopotamia link to Optics 498 engbren 16-May-19 07:52
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 874 DScribr 23-Nov-16 02:17
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 1044 Thanos5150 23-Nov-16 03:49
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 903 DScribr 23-Nov-16 14:52
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 905 DScribr 23-Nov-16 02:11
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 930 DScribr 23-Nov-16 02:04
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 969 Thanos5150 23-Nov-16 04:29
Re: Mesopotamian Origins of Writing 837 DScribr 23-Nov-16 15:08
Re: Mesopotamian Origins of Writing 997 Thanos5150 24-Nov-16 05:32
Re: Mesopotamian Origins of Writing 1077 Thanos5150 25-Nov-16 06:12
Re: Mesopotamian Origins of Writing 930 DScribr 25-Nov-16 17:40
Re: Mesopotamian Origins of Writing 786 DScribr 25-Nov-16 17:34
Re: Mesopotamian Origins of Writing 923 Thanos5150 25-Nov-16 21:17
The Ankh 863 DScribr 26-Nov-16 16:16
Re: The Ankh 1171 Thanos5150 26-Nov-16 18:15
Re: The Ankh 934 DScribr 26-Nov-16 18:42
Re: Mesopotamian Origins of Writing 881 SandyJesse 14-Dec-16 00:24
Re: Mesopotamian Origins of Writing 1171 Thanos5150 15-Dec-16 18:16
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 896 Thanos5150 20-Mar-19 06:30
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 501 engbren 20-Mar-19 08:53
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 544 Corpuscles 20-Mar-19 11:55
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 510 Thanos5150 22-Mar-19 03:22
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 516 jamesglory 22-Mar-19 03:47
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 706 Thanos5150 22-Mar-19 05:27
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 556 jamesglory 25-Mar-19 01:34
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 515 eyeofhorus33 25-Mar-19 18:00
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 595 eyeofhorus33 25-Mar-19 18:16
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 496 Dr. Troglodyte 25-Mar-19 20:18
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 543 Thanos5150 25-Mar-19 20:35
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 573 Thanos5150 26-Mar-19 01:58
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 348 Thanos5150 21-Feb-20 16:12
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 360 waggy 21-Feb-20 18:43
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 355 Manu 21-Feb-20 19:29
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 362 waggy 21-Feb-20 21:16
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 409 Thanos5150 22-Feb-20 02:58
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 282 Thanos5150 10-Nov-20 23:40
Re: Mesopotamian Origin of the Egyptian Serekh Palace Facade Building 254 Tony S. 25-Mar-21 16:24


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