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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Hi Milo: I take your point. It is indeed true that there is scarcely anything in the ritual or dogma of the Roman Catholic Church that can not be directly traced to Mithraic or other Pagan sources. My point, however, is that by wiping out Pagan places of education--closing, for example, the academies, and by abolishing all overt Pagan practices on the part of outsiders while all the while "
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Steve: I have not closely studied the specific translation of the texts bto which you refer and so can't comment on their authenticity or lack thereof. The Hermetic corpus largely took its shape in the first century CE although, of course, many of the texts dated far back into the Egyptian past. Re. the harsh attitude towards magic by early Christianity--and later too!--it was part and parcel of
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Hi Wireloop: yes, I've made a study of Philo and of Plato's dialogues. Their influence upon the making of the New Testament is enormous. Philo's thinking about the Logos lies behind the Prologue of the Fourth Gospel, although he would have been freaked out by the idea that this Logos, by which the spiralling galaxies were made, could have been contained in one historical human being of flesh an
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Clive: Clearly Methuselah was a mythological sun-god figure and his age reflects an astronomical cycle--exactly which one I don't know. Does it matter?
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Hi Kees: The astrological/astronomical template of which you speak is certainly behind all the great ancient religions of the world--from the Egyptian--through the Persian (Zoroastrianism) the Vedic (Hinduism) to Judaism, Christianity and indeed islam. To the extent that Islam is dependnent upon or related to both Judaism and Christianity, it shares in that common heritage. Sun-worship, of cours
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Hi Steve: Wine symbolism is everywhere you look in the ancient world, particularly in the mediterranean regions and those just beyond it. It is much older than the cult of Dionysus/Bacchus with its roots reaching far back into Sumerian and Egyptian times. As you mention, even in Islam, which of course is later, and where alcohol is generally forbidden, the Sufis or mystical core use it to bring a
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Greetings and a word of welcome to conversation about The Pagan Christ. Currently, the world is drowning in a sea of literalism where religion is concerned. TPC is a direct challenge to that kind of thinking. I'm here to try to respond to questions, comments, and insights into the book's arguments and the issues raised by them. Let's hear from you. Tom Harpur
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Hi Maria: Sorry about that. I usually get the name right! Tom
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
HI to all: Even though we've decided I should come back on some time later once the book (The Pagan Christ) has been published in the USA (spring, 05) and elsewhere, I can't resist chatting here for an hour or so this morning. The reason is the issue raised by Marie Anne and Kees re. an amazing upsurge in new thinking on the planet and the possibility of a paradigm-shift, evolutionary step ahead
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Hi Edmund: I want to thank you for that info re. both the exhibit and the catalogue. You've been an enormous help! Tom...
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Steve: I missed this thread before and want to thank you for these startling images. They're terrific. I'd like to hear from an accredited iconologist/Egyptologist on the "guild's" interpretation of them. The knowledge filter probably would work to thwart Kuhn's interpretation! Best, Tom...
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Dear Edmungd or Richard: Do either of you have an address where I can obtain a copy of the catalogue for the exhibit? We'll be doing a documentary TV version of The Pagan Christ and it would be a tremendous help. I wish I could get to Milwaukee to see it but perhaps it's on its way to a city closer to Toronto? I'm busy just now with the release of a new book, The Spirituality of Wine, by Northst
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
To you all: Love to continue this--and hope you will, but I have to go for now. My sincere thanks to all who have participated so far. Good night, Tom...
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Hi Anne-Marie and thanks. You are right about the great antiquity of the Horus/osiris myth. Massey cites Herodotus (C.2:43, I believe) where the father of history says that the priests told him of Iu (basis for the later name Jesus) who was one of the great gods in Egypt some 18,000 years previous. Conservative critics pounce on this reference in my book because writing in Egypt dates to roughly
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Dear NRS: You seem to understand the role of Gnostic thinking in all of this very well. Unfortunately for us the word Gnostic is a bit like "New Age" in that it is an umbrella word covering a lot of strains of religious thinking that at times are diametrically opposed. However, in the main it can be said with a fair degree of certainty that Gnostics--those who held to the hidden wisdom
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Brian: As you can see you were on target. twh
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Hi Kees: Thanks for your insightful summary of TPC's nature and central message. The vatican document on New Age is quite familiar to me and parts of it are very good--like the curate's egg. Parts, however, are not so helpful and fail to allow for the phenomenon--noted by Harold Bloom in Omens of Millennium (1996) where he writes that the pressures and cruelties of ultra-conservative forces in t
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
Hi Brian: The similarities are quite remarkable and to me give evidence that there is behind all of the svaviour god figures the same archetypal mythos. Best, Tom...
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15 years ago
Tom Harpur
The thesis of The Pagan Christ is that the roots of the Christian faith all eventually can be traced back to ancient Egypt and its star-based or astronomical religion. The precursor or model for Jesus Christ was Horus, the Egyptian saviour god. Gerald Massey, the British scholar who spent most of his adult life studying the British Museum's Egyptian collection and learning hieroglyphics, found
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