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OK Gang, I am still waiting for further information on this but here is a preliminary report.

The Starry Night version I have (6.4) quotes the following proper motion for Vega (0.2008, 0.2872) (RA,Dec) arcsec/year. The current SIMBAD website quoted values are (0.20094, 0.28623) [same units]. In Black Genesis I used (0.20103, 0.28747) which was at the time the SIMBAD quoted value.
SIMBAD: [simbad.u-strasbg.fr]

So anyhow that is clearly not the issue because those differences in proper motion yield less than 0.002 degrees differences over 14,000 years. (Compared to the 1.36 degrees movement of the whole proper motion itself.)

My version of Starry Night Pro shows Vega culminating at a declination of 86.2407 degrees, 12008 BC, which is 0.299 degrees less than the culmination declination I gave in Black Genesis. The difference between my value and Starry Night's value (for the declination) is not due to our very slightly different proper motions. It is because I used a different method to calculate Earth's pole movement. I calculated it from scratch, using the published equations I referenced in BG and in Origin Map. I have a query out to Starry Night, asking them details on how they calculate Earth's pole for such ancient dates, so I can identify our differences. But I haven't heard back from Starry Night yet. FYI, the reason I calculated such extremely ancient dates myself is because when I started doing such calculations circa 2001, the available software either used a much worse approximation for such extremely ancient dates, or simply didn't do dates before Julian date 0 (circa 4700 BC). I am willing to consider that maybe, today, Starry Night Pro's values might be better than mine. But I can't tell until I find out exactly how Starry Night does their calculations. And, importantly, note that these Vega shaft calculations are the only ones where such a small difference (0.3 degrees over 14,000 years) makes any difference to the interpretations. It will be interesting to track this down.

And, given that, it is interesting to look at the shaft situation if we end up taking the Starry Night value as (possibly, don't know yet) better. The center of the shaft is declination 86.544, and the edges of the shaft if we consider the outer edges at the outside of today's Pyramid are 86.2825 and 86.8052 degrees. So if Vega culminated at 86.2407 degrees it just missed shining down the shaft by 0.04 degrees, IF the whole pyramid was there 12,000 BC (and if the shaft angle did not shift geophysically at all over 14KY, and that is another separate issue). BUT we are pretty sure the whole pyramid as it is today was not there 12,000 BC. As we indicate in Black Genesis, we think, possibly if anything was there it might have been the part of the shaft that goes through the bedrock. That part is shorter, and so has a wider angle to the sky. Its edges are at declinations 86.187 and 86.900 degrees. So if Starry Night's values are correct (again, not certain about this) Vega started shining to the bottom of the bedrock shaft circa 12,120 BC, and continued shining down the shaft through its culmination 12008 BC until 11,896 BC when Vega's declination descended too low to shine down for another 26,000 years.


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Subject Views Written By Posted
Zep Tepi 362 loveritas 07-Mar-13 11:01
Re: Zep Tepi 210 Poster Boy 08-Mar-13 15:17
Re: Zep Tepi 220 loveritas 08-Mar-13 20:31
Mostly offline next couple of days 234 Thomas Brophy 08-Mar-13 23:57
Re: Mostly offline next couple of days 187 loveritas 09-Mar-13 00:34
Re:the waves of which dashed in powerless fury against its base. 223 Thunderbird 10-Mar-13 20:18
Nice To See You're Back 246 loveritas 12-Mar-13 04:22
Re: Nice To See You're Back 233 Thomas Brophy 16-Mar-13 04:52
GHMB 'Decorum' and Other Issues 207 Dr. Lew Graham 16-Mar-13 14:03
Re: GHMB 'Decorum' and Other Issues 227 Thomas Brophy 16-Mar-13 20:18
High on Ego 197 loveritas 16-Mar-13 21:59
and self righteous arrogance 234 Sirius7237 16-Mar-13 22:18
Re: GHMB 'Decorum' and Other Issues 245 Bobajot 17-Mar-13 02:15
Re: GHMB 'Decorum' and Other Issues 220 Aine 17-Mar-13 22:04
Relying Upon One's Discernment 268 Dr. Lew Graham 18-Mar-13 01:35
Re: Relying Upon One's Discernment 735 cladking 18-Mar-13 20:58
Atrophy of Discernment 246 Dr. Lew Graham 18-Mar-13 21:34
Re: Atrophy of Discernment 260 cladking 18-Mar-13 21:59
A Miracle? 242 Dr. Lew Graham 18-Mar-13 23:42
Accidently hit "quote" instead of post and failed to correct 245 cladking 19-Mar-13 00:20
Miracles? 212 Dr. Lew Graham 19-Mar-13 00:30
Re: A Miracle? 151 Poster Boy 19-Mar-13 00:47
Typo 240 Dr. Lew Graham 19-Mar-13 01:00
Sarcasm? 220 Sirius7237 19-Mar-13 03:04
More Hypocrisy 229 loveritas 19-Mar-13 05:32
Re: Typo 204 Poster Boy 19-Mar-13 03:26
yes, maybe thinking is not ultimate ground of being 199 Thomas Brophy 18-Mar-13 23:03
Re: yes, maybe thinking is not ultimate ground of being 232 cladking 19-Mar-13 02:16
I addressed your question on Zep Tepi, no? 206 Thomas Brophy 18-Mar-13 04:41
Re: I addressed your question on Zep Tepi, no? 229 loveritas 18-Mar-13 06:07
Re: I addressed your question on Zep Tepi, no? 287 Thomas Brophy 18-Mar-13 22:30
Re: I addressed your question on Zep Tepi, no? 265 loveritas 18-Mar-13 22:38
I'll Rephrase the Question 240 loveritas 19-Mar-13 20:42
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 233 Aine 19-Mar-13 21:37
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 227 loveritas 20-Mar-13 11:54
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 240 Thomas Brophy 20-Mar-13 17:47
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 243 Thunderbird 20-Mar-13 18:29
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 223 loveritas 20-Mar-13 21:33
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 224 Spiros 20-Mar-13 22:13
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 246 Laird Scranton 21-Mar-13 16:50
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 267 Spiros 21-Mar-13 19:16
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 258 Audrey 24-Mar-13 04:25
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 218 Thomas Brophy 24-Mar-13 06:10
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 190 loveritas 24-Mar-13 06:54
Starry Night Pro calculation still not clarified 264 Thomas Brophy 29-Mar-13 22:02
Re: Starry Night Pro calculation still not clarified 244 loveritas 30-Mar-13 02:05
Re: What if?...... 205 Thunderbird 30-Mar-13 20:56
Re: What if?...... 215 loveritas 30-Mar-13 23:55
Re: Zawiyet el-Aryan meridian observation shaft/Water clock 412 Thunderbird 31-Mar-13 03:37
Re: Zawiyet el-Aryan meridian observation shaft/Water clock 233 loveritas 31-Mar-13 07:56
Bond of Heaven and Earth 378 loveritas 01-Apr-13 01:25
Djed-raising ropes? 239 Thomas Brophy 01-Apr-13 01:40
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 240 loveritas 01-Apr-13 05:18
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 233 Thomas Brophy 01-Apr-13 06:47
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 255 loveritas 01-Apr-13 06:58
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 231 Thomas Brophy 01-Apr-13 07:05
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 216 loveritas 01-Apr-13 07:11
Re: Djed-raising ropes? 245 Thomas Brophy 01-Apr-13 07:24
Re: Ability....and transitions of time. 228 Thunderbird 01-Apr-13 23:19
Re: Ability....and transitions of time. 210 loveritas 01-Apr-13 23:53
Re: King and Queen Ascending/Descending 278 Thunderbird 02-Apr-13 20:07
Re: King and Queen Ascending/Descending 207 loveritas 02-Apr-13 22:37
Re: Bond of Heaven and Earth 254 Thunderbird 01-Apr-13 03:55
Some basics... 244 Thomas Brophy 31-Mar-13 00:16
Re: Starry Night Pro calculation still not clarified 246 Spiros 30-Mar-13 06:30
Help ask Starry Night 229 Thomas Brophy 31-Mar-13 00:58
Re: Help ask Starry Night 280 Spiros 31-Mar-13 17:58
Starry Night Pro 'fesses up to precession calculation errors 679 Thomas Brophy 02-Apr-13 19:29
Re: Starry Night Pro 'fesses up to precession calculation errors 290 Spiros 02-Apr-13 20:59
Re: Starry Night Pro 'fesses up to precession calculation errors 221 Thomas Brophy 02-Apr-13 21:22
Starry Night Pro precession calculation fix delayed 283 Thomas Brophy 10-May-13 22:39
Re: Starry Night Pro precession calculation fix delayed 244 loveritas 11-May-13 01:22
Re: Starry Night Pro precession calculation fix delayed 236 Spiros 13-May-13 22:10
What is your culminating declination? 228 Thomas Brophy 13-May-13 22:49
Re: What is your culminating declination? 222 Spiros 13-May-13 23:27
Re: What is your culminating declination? 242 Thomas Brophy 14-May-13 00:13
Re: What is your culminating declination? 188 Spiros 19-May-13 01:31
Re: I'll Rephrase the Question 309 Thomas Brophy 21-Mar-13 04:20
Einstein Not Necessary 214 loveritas 21-Mar-13 06:37
Memory & Einstein 219 loveritas 24-Mar-13 23:10
Re: Memory & Einstein 241 Thomas Brophy 24-Mar-13 23:43
Re: Zep Tepi 217 Eddie Larry 14-May-13 03:45
Re: Zep Tepi 221 Sirfiroth 15-May-13 02:15
Re: Zep Tepi 200 Eddie Larry 15-May-13 03:02


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