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Hi Steve:
Wine symbolism is everywhere you look in the ancient world, particularly in the mediterranean regions and those just beyond it. It is much older than the cult of Dionysus/Bacchus with its roots reaching far back into Sumerian and Egyptian times. As you mention, even in Islam, which of course is later, and where alcohol is generally forbidden, the Sufis or mystical core use it to bring about the change of consciousness known to Plato as "the divine mania"--as a way of experiencing the divine. At the heart of the connection between wine and religion is the miracle of fermentation. This natural transformation through the action of yeasts on the skins of the grapes upon the sugars in the broken grapes spoke powerfully of inner
spiritual transformation. The similarity between grape juice and blood, plus the "lift" of mood made it a natural emblem of the entry of the divine into human life--hence its almost universal use as a sacramental meal long before the Christian era. The vine is the plant most often cited in the Bible for this very reason. Horus was a wine god, so too was dionysus; so too was the Jesus of the Gospels.

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Tom Harpur is now online 859 Tom Harpur 20-Jul-04 19:03
Wine symbolism 513 Jaimi2 20-Jul-04 19:28
Re: Wine symbolism 349 Tom Harpur 20-Jul-04 19:50
Re: Wine symbolism 366 wireloop 20-Jul-04 21:20
& bread 287 michael saunders 20-Jul-04 21:28
Re: & bread 305 wireloop 20-Jul-04 22:09
Re: & bread 347 Tom Harpur 20-Jul-04 22:44
Re: & bread 293 Tom Harpur 20-Jul-04 22:43
Re: Wine symbolism 294 Tom Harpur 20-Jul-04 22:38
Welcome Tom Harpur 381 Kees 20-Jul-04 19:40
Re: Welcome Tom Harpur 334 Graham Hancock 21-Jul-04 22:50
Re: Welcome Tom Harpur 397 Tom Harpur 24-Jul-04 02:01
A general template or not? 286 Kees 20-Jul-04 19:51
Re: A general template or not? 269 Tom Harpur 20-Jul-04 20:02
Re: A general template or not? 250 Kees 20-Jul-04 20:23
Re: A general template or not? 240 Tom Harpur 20-Jul-04 22:48
Re: A general template or not? 265 Milo 20-Jul-04 22:52
Re: A general template or not? 373 banah 24-Jul-04 11:51
Re: A general template or not? 392 Kees 20-Jul-04 23:06
Re: A general template or not? 270 wireloop 20-Jul-04 23:37
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 278 Cross 20-Jul-04 20:20
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Re: Tom Harpur is now online 269 Cross 21-Jul-04 02:48
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Re: Tom Harpur is now online 236 wireloop 20-Jul-04 20:24
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 274 Tom Harpur 20-Jul-04 21:01
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Re: Tom Harpur is now online 270 Milo 20-Jul-04 21:40
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Re: Tom Harpur is now online 264 Milo 20-Jul-04 23:08
Glitch in GHMB, do not reply here 257 Anonymous User 21-Jul-04 01:29
Rob.... 324 Jaimi2 21-Jul-04 02:32
Incarnation versus Re-incarnation 284 Kees 20-Jul-04 22:27
Re: Incarnation versus Re-incarnation 272 Tom Harpur 20-Jul-04 23:04
Re: Incarnation versus Re-incarnation 278 turnofthetide 21-Jul-04 20:53
Re: Incarnation versus Re-incarnation 267 Peter Novak 28-Jul-04 17:44
Re: Incarnation versus Re-incarnation 450 Peter Novak 28-Jul-04 17:52
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Massey and Orion 264 Jaimi2 21-Jul-04 03:06
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Re: Tom Harpur is now online 344 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 18:27
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 348 Jaimi2 21-Jul-04 18:36
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 278 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 18:46
Welcome back Tom Harpur 287 Kees 21-Jul-04 18:37
Re: Welcome back Tom Harpur 257 Jaimi2 21-Jul-04 18:43
Re: Welcome back Tom Harpur 262 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 18:49
Re: Welcome back Tom Harpur 355 Jaimi2 21-Jul-04 19:01
Re: Welcome back Tom Harpur 307 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 19:11
Re: Welcome back Tom Harpur 226 Jaimi2 21-Jul-04 19:29
Re: Welcome back Tom Harpur 387 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 19:40
Re: Welcome back Tom Harpur 223 wireloop 21-Jul-04 19:52
KRST and anti KRST 415 Kees 21-Jul-04 19:20
Re: KRST and anti KRST 377 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 19:28
Re: KRST and anti KRST 318 Kees 21-Jul-04 19:33
Re: KRST and anti KRST 281 Jaimi2 21-Jul-04 19:46
Re: KRST and anti KRST 280 Kees 21-Jul-04 19:58
Re: KRST and anti KRST 269 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 19:52
Re: KRST and anti KRST 282 Kees 21-Jul-04 20:05
Re: KRST and anti KRST 249 turnofthetide 21-Jul-04 21:06
Re: KRST and anti KRST 291 Kees 21-Jul-04 21:15
Re: KRST and anti KRST 237 wireloop 21-Jul-04 20:43
any opinion/knowledge re: Alan Alford's symbolism 271 JimLewandowski 21-Jul-04 18:57
Re: any opinion/knowledge re: Alan Alford's symbolism 290 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 19:14
Where are all our regular literalists?? 263 Kees 21-Jul-04 19:29
I'd love to debate..... 270 michael saunders 21-Jul-04 19:33
Re: I'd love to debate..... 296 Kees 21-Jul-04 19:38
Re: I'd love to debate..... 268 wireloop 21-Jul-04 20:12
Re: I'd love to debate..... 359 Kees 21-Jul-04 20:18
Re: I'd love to debate..... 225 wireloop 21-Jul-04 20:45
Re: I'd love to debate..... 275 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 19:56
Re: I'd love to debate..... 272 michael saunders 21-Jul-04 20:09
Re: I'd love to debate..... 259 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 20:26
Re: I'd love to debate..... 283 michael saunders 22-Jul-04 10:19
Re: I'd love to debate..... 238 Broker 22-Jul-04 22:20
Re: I'd love to debate..... 304 Anne-Marie 23-Jul-04 12:50
Re: I'd love to debate..... 353 michael saunders 23-Jul-04 18:23
Re: I'd love to debate..... 240 Anne-Marie 23-Jul-04 23:17
Re: I'd love to debate..... 248 Tom Harpur 24-Jul-04 01:50
Re: Where are all our regular literalists?? 268 Anne-Marie 21-Jul-04 22:21
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 221 Maria KA 21-Jul-04 19:45
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 279 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 20:04
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 305 Maria KA 21-Jul-04 20:25
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 277 Tom Harpur 21-Jul-04 20:29
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 311 Maria KA 21-Jul-04 21:02
Helios 370 Jaimi2 22-Jul-04 03:15
Re: Helios 243 wireloop 22-Jul-04 22:05
Re: Helios 305 Tom Harpur 24-Jul-04 02:06
Re: Helios 390 Anne-Marie 24-Jul-04 14:58
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 281 wireloop 24-Jul-04 04:24
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 305 Tom Harpur 24-Jul-04 19:11
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 267 wireloop 24-Jul-04 19:34
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 347 Tom Harpur 24-Jul-04 21:36
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 279 banah 24-Jul-04 12:15
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 263 Tom Harpur 24-Jul-04 19:21
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 277 banah 24-Jul-04 21:25
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 259 Tom Harpur 24-Jul-04 21:32
Re: Tom Harpur is now online 274 banah 24-Jul-04 21:41
And Genesis 6:4 will supply your answer 328 JimLewandowski 24-Jul-04 21:40


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