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drrayeye Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When Descartes tried the
> tear-it-down/build-it-back "naturalistic" approach
> to consciousness, he came to the same conclusion:
> "cogito--ergo sum."
> How does it feel to be supporting Cartesian
> dualism?

Ah, but you're invoking Cartesian dualism as if that's the only metaphysical view of consciousness available. It isn't, and it's a pretty untenable one (remember our discussion about brain damage causing mind damage).

The way I see it, if consciousness is metaphysical, but it isn't a metaphysical object that inhabits a body, what view am I left with? What makes the most sense to me is to conceive of consciousness as an aperture or a lens. Think of the whole Universe as a field of consciousness-in-potential (a deliberately abstract term). That field comes into focus through creatures.

If you remember my bucket-with-holes analogy from earlier... The water in the bucket is the "field". The individuated streams falling through the holes are the "minds". But the minds are not independent entities. They are just the field finding focus. The death of an individual body is just the Universe losing one of its focus points. There's no entity that actually winks out of existence or lifts off the body. When you lose your physical brain, you (the Universe) lose your focusing mechanism in that location.

This is a big concept I'm describing, and I realise it requires much more explaining than these few paragraphs.

Darryl

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Parapsychology and wonderment 34584 Darryl Sloan 03-Jun-19 19:34
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 282 greengirl5 03-Jun-19 23:08
u-tube 263 greengirl5 04-Jun-19 03:54
Re: u-tube 259 greengirl5 04-Jun-19 06:17
Re: u-tube 259 Darryl Sloan 04-Jun-19 19:02
Re: u-tube 249 Darryl Sloan 04-Jun-19 18:58
Re: u-tube 231 greengirl5 04-Jun-19 22:29
Meaningful dreams 255 Darryl Sloan 04-Jun-19 18:47
Re: Meaningful dreams 238 greengirl5 04-Jun-19 22:46
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 249 Poster Boy 04-Jun-19 22:29
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 252 greengirl5 04-Jun-19 23:08
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 239 Eddie Larry 05-Jun-19 01:08
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 252 greengirl5 05-Jun-19 03:15
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 320 Eddie Larry 05-Jun-19 20:51
Who was Jesus? 276 Darryl Sloan 06-Jun-19 11:27
Re: Who was Jesus? 237 greengirl5 06-Jun-19 14:37
Re: Who was Jesus? 274 Poster Boy 06-Jun-19 15:49
Re: Who was Jesus? 246 greengirl5 06-Jun-19 22:21
Re: Who was Jesus? 243 Poster Boy 06-Jun-19 23:06
Re: Who was Jesus? And who were the Mayans? 240 greengirl5 06-Jun-19 23:40
And who were the Mayans? 251 Poster Boy 07-Jun-19 15:41
Winter solstice 2012 238 greengirl5 07-Jun-19 22:40
Re: Winter solstice 2012 252 Poster Boy 07-Jun-19 23:21
Re: Winter solstice 2012 229 greengirl5 07-Jun-19 23:51
Re: Who was Jesus? 239 Darryl Sloan 08-Jun-19 20:16
Questions 253 drrayeye 08-Jun-19 20:47
Re: Questions 269 Darryl Sloan 10-Jun-19 19:02
Re: Questions and maybe some answers? 231 greengirl5 11-Jun-19 00:03
Re: Questions and maybe some answers? 231 Darryl Sloan 14-Jun-19 09:28
Good and evil 226 greengirl5 14-Jun-19 22:59
Re: Good and evil 218 Darryl Sloan 17-Jun-19 11:19
Re: Questions 241 drrayeye 11-Jun-19 07:19
Re: Questions 228 Darryl Sloan 14-Jun-19 09:13
Scientists and Dualism 217 drrayeye 14-Jun-19 16:30
Re: Scientists and Dualism 228 Darryl Sloan 17-Jun-19 12:03
Re: Scientists and Dualism 237 drrayeye 17-Jun-19 16:10
Re: Scientists and Dualism 238 Susan Doris 17-Jun-19 17:25
Consciousness and the perceptual environment 232 drrayeye 18-Jun-19 04:10
Re: Who was Jesus? 245 Poster Boy 08-Jun-19 21:11
Re: Who was Jesus? 241 Darryl Sloan 10-Jun-19 19:20
A scholarly alternative 258 drrayeye 07-Jun-19 06:46
Re: A scholarly alternative 245 Darryl Sloan 10-Jun-19 19:09
Re: A scholarly alternative 265 Eddie Larry 11-Jun-19 21:19
Re: A scholarly alternative 245 greengirl5 11-Jun-19 22:11
Re: A scholarly alternative 266 Eddie Larry 11-Jun-19 22:21
Re: A scholarly alternative 248 SandyJesse 15-Jun-19 05:14
Re: A scholarly alternative 223 Darryl Sloan 17-Jun-19 11:23
Tiberius Julius Cotys Philocaesar Eusebes 234 Eddie Larry 17-Jun-19 22:32
Re: Tiberius Julius Cotys Philocaesar Eusebes 241 SandyJesse 18-Jun-19 02:56
Re: Tiberius Julius Cotys Philocaesar Eusebes 227 Eddie Larry 18-Jun-19 03:03
Re: A scholarly alternative 243 Darryl Sloan 13-Jun-19 11:58
Re: A scholarly alternative 241 Eddie Larry 13-Jun-19 14:04
Re: A scholarly alternative 225 Darryl Sloan 17-Jun-19 11:28
Re: A scholarly alternative 229 Eddie Larry 17-Jun-19 13:08
Follow me - on Facebook....... 221 greengirl5 17-Jun-19 23:10
Re: Follow me - on Facebook....... 229 Eddie Larry 18-Jun-19 01:42
After the resurrection...... 234 greengirl5 18-Jun-19 06:02
Re: After the resurrection...... 223 Eddie Larry 18-Jun-19 13:32
Well said 234 drrayeye 18-Jun-19 04:38
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 251 Darryl Sloan 06-Jun-19 10:05
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 230 Darryl Sloan 05-Jun-19 14:48
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 236 Poster Boy 05-Jun-19 15:37
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 237 Darryl Sloan 06-Jun-19 10:55
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 235 Poster Boy 06-Jun-19 15:38
au contraire 261 drrayeye 04-Jun-19 23:15
Re: au contraire 234 Darryl Sloan 05-Jun-19 15:05
Re: au contraire 263 drrayeye 05-Jun-19 19:56
Re: au contraire 243 Darryl Sloan 06-Jun-19 10:08
Re: au contraire 241 greengirl5 06-Jun-19 13:48
Re: au contraire 828 Poster Boy 06-Jun-19 15:31
Re: au contraire 248 drrayeye 06-Jun-19 16:11
Re: au contraire 251 Poster Boy 06-Jun-19 16:16
Consciousness 237 greengirl5 06-Jun-19 23:27
Our brains 252 greengirl5 07-Jun-19 00:56
Re: Consciousness 239 Darryl Sloan 13-Jun-19 11:50
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 268 Susan Doris 07-Jun-19 06:03
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 295 greengirl5 07-Jun-19 07:47
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 264 Susan Doris 07-Jun-19 07:53
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 248 greengirl5 07-Jun-19 23:59
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 250 Darryl Sloan 08-Jun-19 19:22
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 241 greengirl5 08-Jun-19 22:44
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 244 Susan Doris 09-Jun-19 05:23
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 252 SandyJesse 09-Jun-19 06:24
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 255 Susan Doris 09-Jun-19 07:19
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 240 greengirl5 09-Jun-19 09:12
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 251 Susan Doris 09-Jun-19 10:03
There it is again 233 greengirl5 09-Jun-19 12:07
Re: There it is again 247 Susan Doris 09-Jun-19 14:49
You know? 256 greengirl5 10-Jun-19 00:36
Re: You know? 236 Susan Doris 10-Jun-19 10:49
Re: You know? 238 greengirl5 10-Jun-19 13:47
Re: You know? 245 Eddie Larry 11-Jun-19 00:09
Re: You know? 218 Eddie Larry 11-Jun-19 21:43
Re: You know? 235 greengirl5 11-Jun-19 21:58
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 263 SandyJesse 10-Jun-19 06:38
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 261 greengirl5 10-Jun-19 09:48
How to make gold 252 greengirl5 15-Jun-19 07:47
Re: How to make gold 225 Darryl Sloan 17-Jun-19 11:07
Re: How to make gold 258 Susan Doris 17-Jun-19 17:31
Re: How to make gold 218 Darryl Sloan 18-Jun-19 08:15
Re: How to make gold 231 Susan Doris 18-Jun-19 09:41
Re: How to make gold 240 greengirl5 18-Jun-19 13:10
Re: How to make gold 241 Susan Doris 18-Jun-19 13:37
Re: How to make gold 227 greengirl5 18-Jun-19 23:30
Re: How to make gold 225 drrayeye 18-Jun-19 18:09
Re: How to make gold 225 greengirl5 18-Jun-19 23:14
Re: How to make gold 213 Darryl Sloan 20-Jun-19 11:44
The "para" is not going away, it is getting stronger. 221 greengirl5 20-Jun-19 23:32
Re: The "para" is not going away, it is getting stronger. 227 Susan Doris 21-Jun-19 09:43
Re: The "para" is not going away, it is getting stronger. 211 greengirl5 21-Jun-19 12:18
Re: How to make gold 224 Susan Doris 21-Jun-19 06:18
Re: How to make gold 207 greengirl5 21-Jun-19 12:14
Re: How to make gold 224 Susan Doris 21-Jun-19 14:42
Re: How to make gold 230 greengirl5 21-Jun-19 23:30
Re: How to make gold 219 Susan Doris 22-Jun-19 05:14
Re: How to make gold 213 greengirl5 22-Jun-19 06:26
Re: How to make gold 210 Susan Doris 22-Jun-19 07:04
Re: How to make gold 222 greengirl5 22-Jun-19 23:49
Re: How to make gold 213 Darryl Sloan 24-Jun-19 18:25
defying naturalistic explanations 224 drrayeye 24-Jun-19 23:32
Re: defying naturalistic explanations 198 Darryl Sloan 26-Jun-19 21:09
Science vs. speculation 486 drrayeye 26-Jun-19 21:57
Re: How to make gold 210 Susan Doris 25-Jun-19 05:57
Great advice to scientists! 213 greengirl5 25-Jun-19 07:24
Re: Great advice to scientists! 206 Susan Doris 25-Jun-19 10:07
Re: Great advice to scientists! 225 greengirl5 26-Jun-19 00:25
a very creative scientist shares his insights 209 drrayeye 25-Jun-19 11:50
Re: a very creative scientist shares his insights 227 Susan Doris 25-Jun-19 14:00
Re: How to make gold 201 Darryl Sloan 24-Jun-19 18:09
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 236 rulebook54 24-Jun-19 22:35
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 225 greengirl5 25-Jun-19 00:31
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 205 Susan Doris 25-Jun-19 06:05
Re: Parapsychology and wonderment 211 greengirl5 25-Jun-19 07:11
Big consciousness, little consciousness. 207 greengirl5 25-Jun-19 02:37


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