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The Vicarious Atonement is a con trick perpetuated by ignorant church leaders. The concept that Jesus died on the cross to save others from their sins is false and not what he himself preached about.

The Master taught that we "reap what we sow". We are either totally responsible for our sins or we are not - there can be no shades of grey in between.

What do other feel about this issue?

Cheers,
Fuzzy

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Subject Views Written By Posted
The Vicarious Atonement 703 Richard Fusniak 12-Feb-04 02:38
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 187 Dominick Ohrbeck 12-Feb-04 02:57
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 230 SunSword 17-Feb-04 01:18
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 164 Dominick Ohrbeck 18-Feb-04 21:08
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 144 Milo 12-Feb-04 03:27
Saviour concept a Jewish expectation 192 Richard Fusniak 12-Feb-04 11:17
Re: Saviour concept a Jewish expectation 233 Milo 12-Feb-04 15:25
Re: Saviour concept a Jewish expectation 173 Prue 12-Feb-04 17:17
Re: Saviour concept a Jewish expectation 168 Richard Fusniak 13-Feb-04 00:48
Re: Saviour concept a Jewish expectation 187 Dominick Ohrbeck 13-Feb-04 03:16
Re: Saviour concept a Jewish expectation 171 Prue 13-Feb-04 03:30
Re: Saviour concept a Jewish expectation 135 Mark Staab 13-Feb-04 04:20
Re: Saviour concept a Jewish expectation 169 Dominick Ohrbeck 13-Feb-04 07:08
Re: Saviour concept a Jewish expectation 179 Richard Fusniak 13-Feb-04 10:54
Re: Saviour concept a Jewish expectation 175 Prue 13-Feb-04 17:45
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 200 Zosimos 12-Feb-04 03:32
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 143 Milo 12-Feb-04 03:52
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 183 Prue 12-Feb-04 05:24
The Divine Comedy and the Harrowing of Hell 201 Milo 12-Feb-04 06:49
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 125 Saorsa 12-Feb-04 09:45
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 181 Milo 12-Feb-04 15:27
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 182 Saorsa 12-Feb-04 15:39
Riddles 179 Richard Fusniak 12-Feb-04 16:13
Re: Riddles 185 Milo 12-Feb-04 16:30
Re: Riddles 177 Ian MacFarlane 12-Feb-04 18:11
Re: Riddles 203 Milo 12-Feb-04 18:23
Re: Riddles 179 Ian MacFarlane 13-Feb-04 02:00
Re: Riddles 144 Milo 13-Feb-04 02:10
Re: Riddles 175 Ian MacFarlane 13-Feb-04 02:32
Re: Riddles 180 Milo 13-Feb-04 04:11
Key of life or the key of death 190 Richard Fusniak 12-Feb-04 18:52
Re: Key of life or the key of death 171 Milo 12-Feb-04 19:02
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 174 Mark Staab 12-Feb-04 23:45
I AM The Way, The Truth And The Life 186 Thirdwave 12-Feb-04 11:15
Paul and salvation 226 Richard Fusniak 12-Feb-04 11:21
Do As I Say 199 Thirdwave 12-Feb-04 11:25
Re: Do As I Say 163 Richard Fusniak 12-Feb-04 11:28
Re: Do As I Say 173 Thirdwave 12-Feb-04 11:31
Re: Do As I Say 177 Milo 12-Feb-04 16:10
Re: Do As I Say 153 Thirdwave 12-Feb-04 17:32
Re: Do As I Say 198 Milo 12-Feb-04 17:44
On Conscience ... 181 Thirdwave 13-Feb-04 18:49
Re: On Conscience ... 185 Milo 13-Feb-04 20:06
Re: On Conscience ... 177 Thirdwave 15-Feb-04 18:16
Re: On Conscience ... 137 Milo 15-Feb-04 18:37
Paul: Not a Bigot Afterall... 179 Cleopatra 17-Feb-04 17:42
Re: Paul: Not a Bigot Afterall... 207 David L 17-Feb-04 23:11
Re: The day of atonement 196 laughin 12-Feb-04 15:42
Re: The day of atonement 228 Milo 12-Feb-04 16:08
Day of Atonement/Yom Kippur 197 Cleopatra 18-Feb-04 14:19
Matthew 20:28 199 Cleopatra 18-Feb-04 15:37
Re: Matthew 20:28 179 Milo 18-Feb-04 16:30
Ah-Ha!!! "Ransom" had a different meaning back then... 163 Cleopatra 19-Feb-04 18:05
Whoops...meant to say she asked for them to sit as HIS rgt & lft. n/t. 150 Cleopatra 19-Feb-04 18:19
Re: Ah-Ha!!! "Ransom" had a different meaning back then... 201 Cleopatra 19-Feb-04 18:32
Re: Ah-Ha!!! "Ransom" had a different meaning back then... 204 Milo 19-Feb-04 19:15
Re: Ah-Ha!!! "Ransom" had a different meaning back then... 197 Milo 19-Feb-04 19:07
Re: Ah-Ha!!! "Ransom" had a different meaning back then... 191 SunSword 19-Feb-04 19:13
An apology...with plenty of clarification. 225 Cleopatra 20-Feb-04 11:32
Re: An apology...with plenty of clarification. 173 Milo 20-Feb-04 19:17
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 208 David L 12-Feb-04 19:26
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 216 Milo 12-Feb-04 19:40
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 173 David L 12-Feb-04 20:01
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 131 Milo 12-Feb-04 20:48
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 172 Richard Fusniak 13-Feb-04 00:59
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 167 Milo 13-Feb-04 01:28
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 216 David L 13-Feb-04 03:02
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 176 wirelessguru1 25-Feb-04 01:08
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 173 David L 25-Feb-04 01:49
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 171 Alex S 13-Feb-04 00:09
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 151 Milo 13-Feb-04 00:23
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 204 Alex S 13-Feb-04 03:09
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 173 Lee McGiffen 14-Feb-04 12:08
Ding Dong Bel 157 Richard Fusniak 14-Feb-04 14:13
Re: Ding Dong Bel 167 Milo 14-Feb-04 15:47
Saviours are scapegoats 177 Richard Fusniak 14-Feb-04 18:37
Re: Saviours are scapegoats 192 Milo 14-Feb-04 19:20
Definition of saviour 166 Richard Fusniak 14-Feb-04 19:51
Re: Definition of saviour 166 Milo 14-Feb-04 20:07
Re: Definition of saviour 161 Richard Fusniak 15-Feb-04 00:00
Re: Definition of saviour 184 Milo 15-Feb-04 00:15
Re: Definition of saviour 213 Ian MacFarlane 15-Feb-04 03:23
Re: Definition of saviour 136 Milo 15-Feb-04 04:50
Re: Definition of saviour 172 Richard Fusniak 15-Feb-04 11:25
Re: Definition of saviour 224 Milo 15-Feb-04 13:21
Help and save 174 Richard Fusniak 15-Feb-04 11:33
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 177 SunSword 17-Feb-04 01:55
Theory falls flat on its face 173 Richard Fusniak 17-Feb-04 03:06
Re: Theory falls flat on its face 241 SunSword 17-Feb-04 14:36
Coming down to earth 154 Richard Fusniak 17-Feb-04 15:25
Re: Coming down to earth 159 SunSword 17-Feb-04 18:26
Is there a Holy Spirit? 176 Richard Fusniak 17-Feb-04 20:23
Re: Is there a Holy Spirit? 161 SunSword 18-Feb-04 14:25
Re: Is there a God/Holy Spirit? 194 Nebankh 18-Feb-04 15:52
Re: Coming down to earth 190 David L 18-Feb-04 19:10
Re: Coming down to earth 172 Milo 18-Feb-04 20:45
So who do you think inspired this stuff? 179 David L 19-Feb-04 01:26
What's New? 232 Milo 19-Feb-04 01:56
In context? 169 David L 19-Feb-04 05:08
You're Resorting to Abuse David 177 Milo 19-Feb-04 14:52
Beliefs 217 ArmchairObserver 19-Feb-04 16:32
Thanks! 165 Milo 19-Feb-04 17:21
Re: Thanks 160 Richard Fusniak 20-Feb-04 01:06
Re: Thanks 177 Milo 20-Feb-04 01:09
Re: You're Resorting to Abuse David 163 David L 19-Feb-04 18:07
Re: You're Resorting to Abuse David 180 Milo 19-Feb-04 18:18
Someone should've told Paul 223 David L 19-Feb-04 22:51
Paul was talking about temple prostitutes. n/t 170 Milo 19-Feb-04 23:14
Really? Read this again... 162 David L 20-Feb-04 02:39
Re: Really? Read this again... 181 Milo 20-Feb-04 14:29
Re: Really? Read this again... 163 SunSword 20-Feb-04 15:28
Re: Really? Read this again... 177 Milo 20-Feb-04 15:37
Re: Really? Read this again... 256 SunSword 20-Feb-04 16:35
Re: Really? Read this again... 174 Milo 20-Feb-04 16:56
Re: Really? Read this again... 164 ArmchairObserver 20-Feb-04 19:13
Re: Really? Read this again... 181 Milo 20-Feb-04 19:22
Re: Really? Read this again... 198 SunSword 21-Feb-04 02:15
Re: Really? Read this again... 178 Milo 21-Feb-04 02:44
Re: Really? Read this again... 179 Ian MacFarlane 24-Feb-04 16:04
Re: Really? Read this again... 147 Milo 24-Feb-04 16:19
Re: Really? Read this again... 202 Kboldt 24-Feb-04 17:01
Re: Really? Read this again... 135 Milo 24-Feb-04 17:44
Re: Really? Read this again... 146 Kboldt 24-Feb-04 17:47
Mod remark 195 Kees 24-Feb-04 23:07
Re: Mod remark 143 Milo 25-Feb-04 00:06
Re: Mod remark 185 ArmchairObserver 25-Feb-04 00:24
Re: Mod remark 179 Milo 25-Feb-04 00:48
Re: Mod remark 193 ArmchairObserver 25-Feb-04 07:07
Manners - moderator note 175 Richard Fusniak 25-Feb-04 00:29
Re: Manners - moderator note 179 Milo 25-Feb-04 00:46
Re: Manners - moderator note 176 Thirdwave 25-Feb-04 00:58
Re: Manners - moderator note 168 Milo 25-Feb-04 01:05
Re: Manners - moderator note 132 Kees 25-Feb-04 18:34
Re: Manners - moderator note 186 Milo 25-Feb-04 19:48
Re: Manners - moderator note 328 Kees 25-Feb-04 21:34
Re: Coming down to earth 137 Dominick Ohrbeck 19-Feb-04 07:49
Re: Coming down to earth 167 David L 19-Feb-04 17:53
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 143 Kboldt 23-Feb-04 22:40
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 150 wirelessguru1 25-Feb-04 01:24
Re: The Vicarious Atonement 171 Kboldt 25-Feb-04 15:31


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