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banah wrote:
>
> Hi David
>
> >>....,"An ego that is doomed to nonexistance
> > when the spiritual path is followed to its ultimate
> > end--merging with God,"........
> >I base it on the teachings of the mystics--Jesus......
>
> Now I am not familiar with the other "mystics", but I am
> familiar with Jesus... This is not what He said.

You should read them. Expand your knowledge of mysticism.
>
> Jesus claimed to be God incarnate (the I AM , the existing
> one, the YHWH who spoke to Moses in the burning bush),
> something which you don't seem to have read or heard of.

He said he was one with the Father and would would make his followers one with the Father. That is tantamount to merging with God.

> From another post of yours:
>
> >>As for "Christ", there have been thousands of Christs--all
> real--and there
> will be thousands more. And yes, we do need them--they are
> "the way".
> But they must be alive in the physical world, not dead for
> 2000 years.
>
> Do you include Jesus as one of these Christs, and if so how
> do you explain the contradiction with your theory to these
> statements made by Jesus:
>
> John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only
> begotten Son, that whoever believeth in him should not
> perish, but have everlasting life.

That statement was made by the writer of the Gospel of John, not by Jesus, and yes I include Jesus. Of course...

> 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the
> world; but that the world through him may be saved.
> 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that
> believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not
> believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
> 19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the
> world, and men have loved darkness rather than light, because
> their deeds were evil.
> 20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither
> cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
> {reproved: or, discovered}
> 21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his
> deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
>
> Jesus states clearly that He is the only way to God, whoever
> does not believe this is condemned (only begotten son....)
>
> John 14:6 Jesus saith to him, I am the way, and the truth,
> and the life: no man cometh to the Father, but by me.
>
> John 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot
> receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but
> ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
>
> John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send
> to you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, who
> proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify concerning me:

The Comforter is the Shabd, and confirms the reality of Jesus to his initiates in their meditation--inside.
>
> John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient
> for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter
> will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send him to you.
>
> John 16:13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he
> will guide you into all the truth: for he shall not speak
> from himself; but whatever he shall hear, that shall he
> speak: and he will show you things to come.
>
> John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
>
> John 17:19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they
> also may be sanctified through the truth. {sanctified…: or,
> truly sanctified}
>
> John 18:37 Pilate therefore said to him, Art thou a king
> then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this
> end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world,
> that I should bear witness to the truth. Every one that is of
> the truth heareth my voice.
>
> John 18:38 Pilate saith to him, What is truth?
>
> Jesus said that He left so that we might have direct access
> to God through the Holy Spirit. We are sanctified through
> truth which is God's word (logos) and Jesus is the word(logos).


All of these statement are true as far as they go. But Jesus was speaking only to his initiates, not the world.
He also said:
John 9:5
"As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world."

In other words, when I'm gone I'm no longer the light of the world. He would always be the Light to his own initiates, but not others.

And again:
Matthew 15:24
"But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel."

John 10:14
"I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. "

John 10:26
"But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you
He had come only for his marked sheep."

He had not come for everyone. No adept does...

There were adepts/masters before Jesus and after. There has never been a moment on the physical plane where there no living adepts available to the humans on the planet. The initiation of fire and water, Sound and Light, of the Comforter/Holy Spirit/Logos/Shabd can only be given to a human by an adept in the human form. This is why John the Baptist initiated Jesus, and Jesus said of John:
Matthew 11:11
"Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he. "

This was his humble way of both praising the one who initiated him, and also telling his followers that they have the potential to be as God themselves. All mystics say the same--Rumi, Kabir, Nanak, etc. regardless of the culture or religion they come out of, whether east or west.

"In the Shabda Yoga tradition of India the methods of practice are communicated at the time of initiation by the Master. A Living Teacher, being fully acquainted with the 'landscape' of inner space, is able to impart to initiates valuable guidance on how to safely make the journey of ascension to the spiritual worlds during meditation practice inside. The details of Shabda Yoga practice are not found in books and aren't for sale, but are given to seekers by the Master at the time of initiation."


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I pulled these sites off the web--I have no connection to them, but what they say is essentially true.
David

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Questions about Truth 555 adequatedane 24-Jan-04 10:24
Re: Questions about Truth 106 Segestan 24-Jan-04 14:00
Re: Questions about Truth 99 adequatedane 25-Jan-04 08:38
Re: Questions about Truth 135 gene douglas 24-Jan-04 14:57
Re: Questions about Truth 102 Alex S 25-Jan-04 01:13
Re: Questions about Truth 99 gene douglas 25-Jan-04 04:04
Re: Questions about Truth 111 Alex S 26-Jan-04 01:18
Re: Questions about Truth 120 gene douglas 26-Jan-04 02:14
Re: Questions about Truth 109 Alex S 27-Jan-04 01:57
Re: Questions about Truth 100 gene douglas 27-Jan-04 09:44
Re: Questions about Truth 91 adequatedane 25-Jan-04 08:34
Re: Questions about Truth 115 adequatedane 25-Jan-04 08:42
Re: Questions about Truth 110 gene douglas 25-Jan-04 10:05
Re: Questions about Truth 112 adequatedane 25-Jan-04 11:21
Re: Questions about Truth 105 gene douglas 25-Jan-04 15:40
Re: Questions about Truth 114 gene douglas 25-Jan-04 16:14
Re: Questions about Truth 109 adequatedane 25-Jan-04 17:06
Re: Questions about Truth 97 gene douglas 25-Jan-04 21:51
Re: Questions about Truth 107 adequatedane 26-Jan-04 22:50
Re: Questions about Truth 95 David L 24-Jan-04 15:55
Re: Questions about Truth 89 newrisingsun 24-Jan-04 17:32
Re: Questions about Truth 110 RichardC 24-Jan-04 23:40
Re: Questions about Truth 128 David L 25-Jan-04 03:46
Re: Questions about Truth 100 RichardC 25-Jan-04 19:45
Re: Questions about Truth 109 David L 25-Jan-04 20:49
Re: Questions about Truth 125 adequatedane 25-Jan-04 09:37
Re: Questions about Truth 105 David L 25-Jan-04 17:31
Re: Questions about Truth 97 adequatedane 26-Jan-04 22:55
Re: Questions about Truth 117 adequatedane 28-Jan-04 23:04
Re: Questions about Truth 98 David L 28-Jan-04 23:28
Re: Questions about Truth 100 adequatedane 29-Jan-04 23:01
Re: Questions about Truth 108 wirelessguru1 29-Jan-04 23:26
Re: Questions about Truth 113 David L 30-Jan-04 03:24
Re: Questions about Truth 122 wirelessguru1 30-Jan-04 03:48
Re: Questions about Truth 119 David L 30-Jan-04 22:32
Re: Questions about Truth 98 wirelessguru1 31-Jan-04 00:30
Re: Questions about Truth 94 adequatedane 30-Jan-04 21:01
Re: Questions about Truth 113 David L 30-Jan-04 22:24
Re: Questions about Truth 99 banah 31-Jan-04 09:13
Re: Questions about Truth 101 David L 31-Jan-04 14:20
Re: Questions about Truth 125 banah 31-Jan-04 20:20
Re: Questions about Truth 110 David L 01-Feb-04 01:59
Jesus didn't say anything of the sort 99 Richard Fusniak 01-Feb-04 14:28
Re: Jesus didn't say anything of the sort 133 banah 01-Feb-04 17:21
Re: Questions about Truth 97 Zurg 03-Feb-04 08:12
Re: Questions about Truth 99 banah 04-Feb-04 10:58
Re: Questions about Truth 122 adequatedane 31-Jan-04 10:17
Re: Questions about Truth 108 banah 31-Jan-04 09:20
Re: Questions about Truth 107 David L 30-Jan-04 03:26
We don't live in a "true or false" world... 97 David L 30-Jan-04 03:30
Re: We don't live in a "true or false" world... 114 banah 31-Jan-04 09:27
Re: We don't live in a "true or false" world... 103 adequatedane 31-Jan-04 10:53
Re: We don't live in a "true or false" world... 98 David L 31-Jan-04 13:38
Re: We don't live in a "true or false" world... 103 banah 31-Jan-04 20:47
Re: Questions about Truth 85 RichardC 24-Jan-04 23:50
Re: Questions about Truth 115 adequatedane 25-Jan-04 09:48
Re: Questions about Truth 116 RichardC 25-Jan-04 19:49
Re: Questions about Truth 112 adequatedane 26-Jan-04 23:00
Re: Questions about Truth 122 RichardC 26-Jan-04 23:32
Re: Questions about Truth 127 banah 25-Jan-04 17:56
Re: Questions about Truth 101 adequatedane 26-Jan-04 23:24
No such thing 118 Nejc 25-Jan-04 23:13
Re: No such thing 118 adequatedane 26-Jan-04 23:40
Re: No such thing 102 Alex S 27-Jan-04 14:13
Re: No such thing 99 gene douglas 27-Jan-04 19:01
Re: Questions about Truth 115 Mark Staab 25-Jan-04 23:35
Re: Questions about Truth 106 adequatedane 27-Jan-04 00:15
Re: Questions about Truth 104 Mark Staab 27-Jan-04 02:00
Re: Questions about Truth 102 adequatedane 27-Jan-04 22:40
Re: Questions about Truth 118 banah 30-Jan-04 19:40
Re: Questions about Truth 97 Mark Staab 30-Jan-04 22:22
Re: Questions about Truth 106 banah 31-Jan-04 11:05
Re: Questions about Truth 134 Mark Staab 01-Feb-04 06:33
Re: Questions about Truth 134 banah 01-Feb-04 11:48
Re: Questions about Truth 106 adequatedane 01-Feb-04 16:06
Re: Questions about Truth 98 banah 01-Feb-04 17:25
Re: Questions about Truth 115 adequatedane 02-Feb-04 23:58
Re: Questions about Truth 118 banah 04-Feb-04 11:04
Re: Questions about Truth 107 adequatedane 05-Feb-04 22:26
Re: Questions about Truth 91 banah 07-Feb-04 13:19
Re: Questions about Truth 123 adequatedane 07-Feb-04 14:47
Re: ps 103 banah 01-Feb-04 17:29
Re: Questions about Truth 95 Mark Staab 01-Feb-04 23:42
Re: Questions about Truth 97 banah 04-Feb-04 11:07
Tree of knowledge is the kundalini shakti 125 David L 01-Feb-04 21:33
Re: Tree of knowledge is the kundalini shakti 119 Mark Staab 02-Feb-04 02:09
Re: Tree of knowledge is the kundalini shakti 138 David L 02-Feb-04 23:50
Re: Tree of knowledge is the kundalini shakti 104 Mark Staab 03-Feb-04 05:57
Re: Tree of knowledge is the kundalini shakti 139 David L 03-Feb-04 16:11
Regarding the Old Testament... 96 David L 03-Feb-04 16:19
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 112 banah 04-Feb-04 10:45
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 93 David L 04-Feb-04 13:49
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 110 Mark Staab 05-Feb-04 00:38
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 90 David L 05-Feb-04 01:07
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 122 banah 05-Feb-04 16:48
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 107 David L 05-Feb-04 19:51
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 107 wirelessguru1 06-Feb-04 00:50
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 127 David L 06-Feb-04 01:49
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 118 wirelessguru1 06-Feb-04 02:24
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 91 Anne-Marie 06-Feb-04 07:36
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 105 adequatedane 06-Feb-04 14:09
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 105 David L 06-Feb-04 18:37
Who speaks the truth... 119 wirelessguru1 07-Feb-04 01:37
Re: Who speaks the truth... 112 David L 07-Feb-04 06:12
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 109 banah 07-Feb-04 13:05
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 132 David L 07-Feb-04 15:49
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 109 Anne-Marie 06-Feb-04 07:22
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 97 wirelessguru1 07-Feb-04 02:28
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 107 Anne-Marie 07-Feb-04 08:19
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 94 banah 07-Feb-04 13:13
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 111 David L 07-Feb-04 16:17
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 108 Cesar 07-Feb-04 17:22
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 152 David L 07-Feb-04 17:48
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 105 Anne-Marie 07-Feb-04 19:59
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 108 David L 07-Feb-04 22:01
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 112 wirelessguru1 08-Feb-04 19:23
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 112 Anne-Marie 08-Feb-04 20:18
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 393 wirelessguru1 08-Feb-04 21:08
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 104 Cesar 08-Feb-04 18:31
Re: Regarding the Old Testament... 97 David L 08-Feb-04 19:15
Re: Questions about Truth 115 Caduceus 27-Jan-04 01:32
Re: Questions about Truth 120 adequatedane 27-Jan-04 22:49
Re: Questions about Truth 101 Caduceus 29-Jan-04 04:12
Re: Questions about Truth 112 xiang 27-Jan-04 03:16
Re: Questions about Truth 104 Caduceus 27-Jan-04 10:53
Re: Questions about Truth 104 wirelessguru1 27-Jan-04 17:49
Re: Questions about Truth 97 adequatedane 27-Jan-04 22:13
Re: Questions about Truth 108 wirelessguru1 27-Jan-04 22:28
Re: Questions about Truth 102 adequatedane 27-Jan-04 23:16
Re: Questions about Truth 126 wirelessguru1 28-Jan-04 00:04
Re: Questions about Truth 113 adequatedane 28-Jan-04 21:32
Re: Questions about Truth 118 xiang 28-Jan-04 01:50
Re: Questions about Truth 119 adequatedane 28-Jan-04 21:55
Re: Questions about Truth 115 wirelessguru1 27-Jan-04 07:57
Re: Questions about Truth 103 adequatedane 27-Jan-04 23:24
Re: Questions about Truth 94 wirelessguru1 28-Jan-04 00:24
Re: Questions about Truth 102 adequatedane 28-Jan-04 22:22
Re: Questions about Truth 91 wirelessguru1 29-Jan-04 01:03
Re: Questions about Truth 89 adequatedane 29-Jan-04 23:35
Re: Questions about Truth 105 wirelessguru1 29-Jan-04 23:56
Re: Questions about Truth 129 adequatedane 30-Jan-04 02:19
Re: Questions about Truth 109 wirelessguru1 30-Jan-04 03:15
Re: Questions about Truth 102 adequatedane 30-Jan-04 21:32
Re: Questions about Truth 119 wirelessguru1 31-Jan-04 01:04
Re: Questions about Truth 122 adequatedane 31-Jan-04 09:23
Re: Questions about Truth 103 wirelessguru1 31-Jan-04 19:33
Re: Questions about Truth 117 Zurg 30-Jan-04 13:19
Re: Questions about Truth 107 adequatedane 30-Jan-04 22:07
Re: Questions about Truth 111 Dominick Ohrbeck 30-Jan-04 21:39
Re: Questions about Truth 105 adequatedane 31-Jan-04 10:47
Re: Questions about Truth 104 Cesar 08-Feb-04 11:51


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