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Hello again Ray,

Since celestial imagery seems to always have been there, I subtract the Astrotheological elements, as scholars have done for many centuries. I don't think that the historical Jesus Christ documentation or consensus has changed much.

Would you mind giving me a some examples of what you consider to be legitimate factual/historical events in the life of Jesus? Some specific examples as they appear in the gospels or any other sources that you accept will be good.

I checked out what Mathisen is saying and found this:

Virtually all of the world’s myths, scriptures, and sacred traditions can be conclusively shown to be based upon the motions of the stars. This includes all of the scriptures of the Old and New Testaments of the Bible, which for the past seventeen centuries have most commonly been interpreted and taught as though they were intended to describe literal and terrestrial events, when in fact the evidence that they are based upon celestial metaphor is overwhelming.

Do you have an example of Mathisen stating what he believes to be the facts in regards to a historical Jesus? So far all I am seeing about his work is how the Bible is all "based upon the motions of the stars," which doesn't leave much room for a literal historical record.

I also found Mathisen apparently responding to a criticism of his work, specifically criticizing his assumption that other figures such as Paul and even Josephus were historical figures when they may not have been, and this is what Mathisen says in response:

Lettre à David Warner Mathisen
I agree with you that much which was anciently written as « history » may also be celestial allegory, not least the works of Josephus.

I do not think that it is the position of most traditional scholars that even Josephus is a celestial allegory. So again, what specific facts from the NT would you consider historical rather than mythical or astrotheological?

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Subject Views Written By Posted
The Historical Jesus 6993 Pete Vanderzwet 25-May-15 05:54
Re: The Historical Jesus 1197 deeside1 26-May-15 20:09
Re: The Historical Jesus 962 Pete Vanderzwet 02-Jun-15 23:02
Re: The Historical Jesus 945 deeside1 03-Jun-15 17:58
Re: The Historical Jesus 961 Pete Vanderzwet 25-Jun-15 16:46
Re: The Historical Jesus 876 drrayeye 17-Jun-15 19:55
Re: The Historical Jesus 883 deeside1 19-Jun-15 09:31
Re: The Historical Jesus 836 drrayeye 26-Jun-15 00:12
Re: The Historical Jesus 962 Yourconscience 05-Mar-16 16:45
Re: The Historical Jesus 777 bsbray 06-Mar-16 07:49
Re: The Historical Jesus 691 Yourconscience 06-Mar-16 15:44
Re: The Historical Jesus 696 bsbray 06-Mar-16 18:59
Re: The Historical Jesus 792 Eddie Larry 07-Mar-16 00:10
Re: The Historical Jesus 763 Vanya 07-Mar-16 17:52
Re: The Historical Jesus 652 Vanya 07-Mar-16 19:32
Re: The Historical Jesus 856 Yourconscience 08-Mar-16 15:48
Re: The Historical Jesus 634 Vanya 08-Mar-16 18:08
An alternative analysis 736 drrayeye 09-Mar-16 21:13
Re: An alternative analysis 732 Yourconscience 10-Mar-16 19:13
Re: The Historical Jesus 807 grangram 02-Jul-15 16:14
Re: The Historical Jesus 698 deeside1 03-Jul-15 10:37
Re: The Historical Jesus 933 grangram 05-Jul-15 06:43
Re: The Historical Jesus 929 gulsbo 15-Feb-16 19:15
Re: The Historical Jesus 678 grangram 02-Mar-16 12:25
Re: The Historical Jesus 687 BRN4327 25-Mar-17 11:01
Astrotheology? 846 bsbray 02-Mar-16 19:34
Re: Astrotheology? 678 drrayeye 06-Mar-16 15:38
Re: Astrotheology? 727 bsbray 06-Mar-16 19:06
Re: Astrotheology? 669 drrayeye 10-Mar-16 03:28
Re: Astrotheology? 667 bsbray 10-Mar-16 05:13
Re: Astrotheology? 648 drrayeye 10-Mar-16 06:49
Re: Astrotheology? 635 bsbray 10-Mar-16 21:17
Re: Astrotheology? 704 drrayeye 10-Mar-16 21:52
Re: Astrotheology? 752 bsbray 10-Mar-16 23:57
Re: Astrotheology? 736 drrayeye 11-Mar-16 01:50
Re: Astrotheology? 710 OCaptain 30-Mar-16 01:43
Re: Astrotheology? 698 OCaptain 30-Mar-16 01:38
Re: Astrotheology? 862 bsbray 15-Apr-16 00:33
Re: Astrotheology? 692 BRN4327 22-Apr-17 09:52
Settled science IMO 873 David L 11-May-16 13:09
Re: Mithras and Jesus 394 muppedo 28-Jul-17 23:42
Re: Mithras and Jesus 498 Eddie Larry 29-Jul-17 00:12
Re: Mithras and Jesus 486 muppedo 29-Jul-17 23:26
Re: Mithras and Jesus 467 eyeofhorus33 11-Aug-17 16:17
Re: Mithras and Jesus 826 muppedo 13-Aug-17 23:19

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