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Hello again Ray,

Since celestial imagery seems to always have been there, I subtract the Astrotheological elements, as scholars have done for many centuries. I don't think that the historical Jesus Christ documentation or consensus has changed much.

Would you mind giving me a some examples of what you consider to be legitimate factual/historical events in the life of Jesus? Some specific examples as they appear in the gospels or any other sources that you accept will be good.

I checked out what Mathisen is saying and found this:

Virtually all of the world’s myths, scriptures, and sacred traditions can be conclusively shown to be based upon the motions of the stars. This includes all of the scriptures of the Old and New Testaments of the Bible, which for the past seventeen centuries have most commonly been interpreted and taught as though they were intended to describe literal and terrestrial events, when in fact the evidence that they are based upon celestial metaphor is overwhelming.

Do you have an example of Mathisen stating what he believes to be the facts in regards to a historical Jesus? So far all I am seeing about his work is how the Bible is all "based upon the motions of the stars," which doesn't leave much room for a literal historical record.

I also found Mathisen apparently responding to a criticism of his work, specifically criticizing his assumption that other figures such as Paul and even Josephus were historical figures when they may not have been, and this is what Mathisen says in response:

Lettre à David Warner Mathisen
I agree with you that much which was anciently written as « history » may also be celestial allegory, not least the works of Josephus.

I do not think that it is the position of most traditional scholars that even Josephus is a celestial allegory. So again, what specific facts from the NT would you consider historical rather than mythical or astrotheological?

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Subject Views Written By Posted
The Historical Jesus 7164 Pete Vanderzwet 25-May-15 05:54
Re: The Historical Jesus 1257 deeside1 26-May-15 20:09
Re: The Historical Jesus 1017 Pete Vanderzwet 02-Jun-15 23:02
Re: The Historical Jesus 1000 deeside1 03-Jun-15 17:58
Re: The Historical Jesus 1031 Pete Vanderzwet 25-Jun-15 16:46
Re: The Historical Jesus 939 drrayeye 17-Jun-15 19:55
Re: The Historical Jesus 939 deeside1 19-Jun-15 09:31
Re: The Historical Jesus 900 drrayeye 26-Jun-15 00:12
Re: The Historical Jesus 1039 Yourconscience 05-Mar-16 16:45
Re: The Historical Jesus 828 bsbray 06-Mar-16 07:49
Re: The Historical Jesus 756 Yourconscience 06-Mar-16 15:44
Re: The Historical Jesus 754 bsbray 06-Mar-16 18:59
Re: The Historical Jesus 841 Eddie Larry 07-Mar-16 00:10
Re: The Historical Jesus 829 Vanya 07-Mar-16 17:52
Re: The Historical Jesus 709 Vanya 07-Mar-16 19:32
Re: The Historical Jesus 923 Yourconscience 08-Mar-16 15:48
Re: The Historical Jesus 690 Vanya 08-Mar-16 18:08
An alternative analysis 790 drrayeye 09-Mar-16 21:13
Re: An alternative analysis 807 Yourconscience 10-Mar-16 19:13
Re: The Historical Jesus 870 grangram 02-Jul-15 16:14
Re: The Historical Jesus 744 deeside1 03-Jul-15 10:37
Re: The Historical Jesus 987 grangram 05-Jul-15 06:43
Re: The Historical Jesus 979 gulsbo 15-Feb-16 19:15
Re: The Historical Jesus 733 grangram 02-Mar-16 12:25
Re: The Historical Jesus 762 BRN4327 25-Mar-17 11:01
Astrotheology? 897 bsbray 02-Mar-16 19:34
Re: Astrotheology? 745 drrayeye 06-Mar-16 15:38
Re: Astrotheology? 786 bsbray 06-Mar-16 19:06
Re: Astrotheology? 726 drrayeye 10-Mar-16 03:28
Re: Astrotheology? 720 bsbray 10-Mar-16 05:13
Re: Astrotheology? 698 drrayeye 10-Mar-16 06:49
Re: Astrotheology? 701 bsbray 10-Mar-16 21:17
Re: Astrotheology? 767 drrayeye 10-Mar-16 21:52
Re: Astrotheology? 805 bsbray 10-Mar-16 23:57
Re: Astrotheology? 784 drrayeye 11-Mar-16 01:50
Re: Astrotheology? 765 OCaptain 30-Mar-16 01:43
Re: Astrotheology? 754 OCaptain 30-Mar-16 01:38
Re: Astrotheology? 924 bsbray 15-Apr-16 00:33
Re: Astrotheology? 752 BRN4327 22-Apr-17 09:52
Settled science IMO 946 David L 11-May-16 13:09
Re: Mithras and Jesus 462 muppedo 28-Jul-17 23:42
Re: Mithras and Jesus 571 Eddie Larry 29-Jul-17 00:12
Re: Mithras and Jesus 560 muppedo 29-Jul-17 23:26
Re: Mithras and Jesus 526 eyeofhorus33 11-Aug-17 16:17
Re: Mithras and Jesus 915 muppedo 13-Aug-17 23:19

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