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Greg,

Quote

GR: Dots also appear in other drawings by Hill. On the North side of Lady Arbuthnot's Chamber Hill's drawing of the vertical Khnum-Khufu cartouche and surround shows at least 5 "dots". Scott your copy of this drawing is cropped so I don't know if other dots and random strokes are shown in Hill's original drawing. These dots show Hill was careful in noting spots he thought might be part of the design.

SC: Yes, I see those dots. But there is no photo of the original to assess whether these are actually just accidental paint drips on Hill's facsimile or if they do actually exist in the original. Until we can get a photo of the original, we will not know.

Quote

GR: This can also be seen in Hill's drawing of the very cartouche under question. Not only are the 2 dots shown on Hill's drawing of the Khufu cartouche in Campbell's Chamber but 2 other spots of paint are shown under the chick's tail indicating to me that Hill was simply unsure if these were random spots or part of the design.

SC: There is absolutely no reason why Hill should consider these two dots to be any more part of the cartouche than any of the other random dots of paint. I can see why he may have thought the markings at the end of the chick's tail might be relevant since they could conceivably be an extension of the tail. But these two dots are entirely isolated and as random as all the other dots. It simply makes no sense for Hill AND Vyse to both conclude that the same two dots were relevant to the cartouche but that all the others were just random spots of paint. If all the others are just random spots of paint, what is there about these two paint spots that made Vyse and Hill think they alone were part of the design?

Isn't the simpler answer that this drawing was copied INTO Campbell's Chamber (by Hill) having been found elsewhere with two markings under the snake glyph? Because there are no other dots on this 'master' Vyse and Hill assume the two dots are part of the king's name. However, as the weeks went by and having been exposed to further examples of the Khufu cartouche (from Tomb of the Trades), Vyse realises that the two dots are not, in fact, part of the king's name. He had two options--he could remove the two dots by chipping them away or he could 'mask' the mistake by placing additional random paint spots inside the cartouche. He opted to add further random spots of paint. The other option is that these random dots (with the exception of the two drawn by Vyse & Hill) were already on the block before they copied the cartouche (with the two dots under the snake glyph) onto the gabled trussing.

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GR: Look also at Hill's drawing of the West end of Wellington's Chamber where many red dots and strokes are included in the drawing.

SC: I don't see those a random spots of paint but rather the replication of a drawing where the lines are very 'sketchy' or 'broken up'. Again though, it would be ideal to have a photo of the original in order to compare.

SC



Post Edited (07-Sep-14 00:08)

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Subject Views Written By Posted
About Those Two Dots.... 459 Scott Creighton 06-Sep-14 10:54
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 178 Jon Ellison 06-Sep-14 12:15
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 121 Skatha 06-Sep-14 17:24
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 184 Origyptian 06-Sep-14 18:12
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 194 Jon Ellison 06-Sep-14 18:36
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 160 sfbey 06-Sep-14 22:29
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 198 Scott Creighton 06-Sep-14 23:58
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 188 Origyptian 07-Sep-14 00:12
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 182 Jon Ellison 07-Sep-14 01:22
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 227 Origyptian 07-Sep-14 03:52
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 193 Jon Ellison 07-Sep-14 01:38
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 214 Audrey 07-Sep-14 06:21
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 251 Martin Stower 10-Sep-14 00:22
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 178 Jon Ellison 07-Sep-14 08:09
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 202 Scott Creighton 07-Sep-14 10:48
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 153 Audrey 07-Sep-14 17:44
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 193 Scott Creighton 07-Sep-14 18:59
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 240 sfbey 07-Sep-14 19:02
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 215 Scott Creighton 07-Sep-14 22:35
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 201 sfbey 08-Sep-14 00:35
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 218 Scott Creighton 08-Sep-14 10:09
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 183 Audrey 08-Sep-14 00:44
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 212 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 20:09
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 209 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 20:27
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 233 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 20:33
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 172 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 21:12
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 167 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 21:19
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 178 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 21:29
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 208 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 21:41
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 179 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 21:52
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 139 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 22:04
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 142 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 22:35
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 153 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 22:42
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 191 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 22:56
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 171 Audrey 09-Sep-14 01:01
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 181 Jon Ellison 09-Sep-14 01:37
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 226 eyeofhorus33 09-Sep-14 17:54
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 127 Origyptian 09-Sep-14 18:23
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 145 eyeofhorus33 09-Sep-14 19:02
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 184 Origyptian 09-Sep-14 19:32
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 205 eyeofhorus33 09-Sep-14 20:43
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 181 Jon Ellison 09-Sep-14 20:55
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 208 Morten 09-Sep-14 21:59
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 209 Jon Ellison 09-Sep-14 22:12
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 213 Origyptian 09-Sep-14 22:36
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 184 Jon Ellison 09-Sep-14 22:42
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 164 Origyptian 09-Sep-14 22:29
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 190 Jon Ellison 09-Sep-14 22:35
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 167 Origyptian 09-Sep-14 22:48
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 184 Jon Ellison 09-Sep-14 23:04
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 187 Jon Ellison 10-Sep-14 08:45
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 186 DUNE 10-Sep-14 09:52
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 228 Jon Ellison 10-Sep-14 11:47
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 200 DUNE 10-Sep-14 13:17
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 194 Jon Ellison 10-Sep-14 13:36
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 187 DUNE 10-Sep-14 14:14
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 189 Jon Ellison 10-Sep-14 16:49
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 126 DUNE 10-Sep-14 17:26
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 180 Origyptian 10-Sep-14 18:03
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 221 Scott Creighton 10-Sep-14 18:31
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 207 Jon Ellison 10-Sep-14 18:49
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 221 Scott Creighton 10-Sep-14 18:54
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 201 Jon Ellison 10-Sep-14 19:12
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 186 Origyptian 10-Sep-14 19:52
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 196 Jon Ellison 10-Sep-14 19:35
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 194 Origyptian 10-Sep-14 19:37
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 222 DUNE 10-Sep-14 19:54
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 206 Origyptian 10-Sep-14 20:06
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 238 Origyptian 10-Sep-14 19:34
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 220 Origyptian 10-Sep-14 15:57
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 191 DUNE 10-Sep-14 16:39
could be a result of overprocessing the image 193 Skatha 10-Sep-14 17:35
Re: could be a result of overprocessing the image 184 Jon Ellison 10-Sep-14 17:40
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 209 Origyptian 09-Sep-14 22:26
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 192 Morten 08-Sep-14 23:03
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 195 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 23:05
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 196 Morten 08-Sep-14 23:11
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 179 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 23:15
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 247 sfbey 08-Sep-14 23:18
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 178 Origyptian 09-Sep-14 00:03
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 174 Jon Ellison 09-Sep-14 00:30
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 229 Origyptian 09-Sep-14 00:03
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 212 Origyptian 09-Sep-14 00:01
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 187 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 23:13
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 170 Audrey 09-Sep-14 00:52
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 207 Origyptian 09-Sep-14 05:50
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 183 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 21:15
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 219 sfbey 08-Sep-14 21:23
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 212 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 21:26
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 196 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 21:30
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 189 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 21:47
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 200 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 22:06
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 190 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 22:21
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 221 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 22:44
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 164 sfbey 08-Sep-14 22:04
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 182 Audrey 08-Sep-14 21:59
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 205 sfbey 08-Sep-14 22:11
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 109 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 21:25
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 165 Audrey 08-Sep-14 21:24
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 194 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 21:28
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 167 Audrey 08-Sep-14 22:02
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 151 eyeofhorus33 08-Sep-14 22:13
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 135 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 22:40
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 147 Thanos5150 11-Sep-14 05:11
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 158 Origyptian 11-Sep-14 13:51
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 182 Thanos5150 11-Sep-14 16:47
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 178 Origyptian 11-Sep-14 20:27
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 275 Thanos5150 11-Sep-14 21:28
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 183 Origyptian 11-Sep-14 22:46
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 190 Jon Ellison 11-Sep-14 22:55
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 157 Origyptian 11-Sep-14 23:34
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 197 Jon Ellison 11-Sep-14 23:54
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 170 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 00:07
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 178 Jon Ellison 12-Sep-14 00:17
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 178 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 00:27
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 191 Jon Ellison 12-Sep-14 00:39
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 193 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 01:12
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 163 Jon Ellison 12-Sep-14 06:26
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 179 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 15:49
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 173 Jon Ellison 12-Sep-14 07:22
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 151 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 15:58
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 132 DUNE 12-Sep-14 16:07
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 172 Jon Ellison 12-Sep-14 16:13
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 176 Jon Ellison 12-Sep-14 16:19
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 96 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 16:48
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 206 DUNE 12-Sep-14 17:07
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 195 DUNE 12-Sep-14 17:45
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 193 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 18:01
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 169 DUNE 12-Sep-14 18:16
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 188 Jon Ellison 12-Sep-14 18:25
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 190 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 18:53
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 241 Jon Ellison 12-Sep-14 19:15
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 181 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 19:58
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 167 Jon Ellison 12-Sep-14 20:27
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 196 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 20:58
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 191 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 16:35
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 187 Jon Ellison 12-Sep-14 18:05
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 200 Thanos5150 11-Sep-14 23:59
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 172 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 00:16
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 162 Thanos5150 12-Sep-14 00:27
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 164 Origyptian 12-Sep-14 00:31
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 211 Audrey 09-Sep-14 02:04
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 170 Jon Ellison 09-Sep-14 10:56
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 171 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 22:13
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 198 Jon Ellison 07-Sep-14 11:53
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 169 Origyptian 07-Sep-14 17:21
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 198 Jon Ellison 07-Sep-14 18:15
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 153 Origyptian 07-Sep-14 18:24
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 180 Jon Ellison 07-Sep-14 18:27
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 206 Jon Ellison 07-Sep-14 18:52
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 181 Origyptian 07-Sep-14 19:08
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 150 Jon Ellison 07-Sep-14 19:12
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 181 DScribr 07-Sep-14 22:10
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 192 Origyptian 07-Sep-14 22:53
Could you link to some? 196 Skatha 08-Sep-14 06:17
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 183 DScribr 08-Sep-14 08:41
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 207 Jon Ellison 08-Sep-14 09:26
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 153 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 15:00
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 176 DScribr 08-Sep-14 15:13
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 239 Jon Ellison 08-Sep-14 15:45
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 148 DScribr 08-Sep-14 15:58
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 139 Jon Ellison 08-Sep-14 16:11
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 79 Origyptian 08-Sep-14 16:19
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 173 Audrey 08-Sep-14 21:15
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 182 Martin Stower 10-Sep-14 00:27
Re: About Those Two Dots.... 190 Scott Creighton 10-Sep-14 10:19
...Vyse is showing THREE dots... 185 Skatha 10-Sep-14 15:31
Re: ...Vyse is showing THREE dots... 165 Origyptian 10-Sep-14 15:39
Re: ...Vyse is showing THREE dots... 232 Scott Creighton 10-Sep-14 15:55
Re: ...Vyse is showing THREE dots... 166 Skatha 10-Sep-14 17:33
Re: ...Vyse is showing THREE dots... 182 Scott Creighton 10-Sep-14 18:09
Re: ...Vyse is showing THREE dots... 155 Skatha 10-Sep-14 23:54
Re: ...Vyse is showing THREE dots... 196 Scott Creighton 11-Sep-14 08:49
Re: ...Vyse is showing THREE dots... 164 Skatha 11-Sep-14 15:06


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