Mysteries :  The Official GrahamHancock.com forums
For serious discussion of the controversies, approaches and enigmas surrounding the origins and development of the human species and of human civilization. (NB: for more ‘out there’ posts we point you in the direction of the ‘Paranormal & Supernatural’ Message Board). 
Welcome! Log InRegister
...for it's all they have in their locker.

Just stopping by to set a couple of things straight.

As far as I am concerned, Vyse intended a circle in the smaller disc. As you can see (image below) the centre mark in the top circle looks like the letter 'C' and that, to my eyes, appears to be an incomplete circle. The line above this appears to me to be Vyse (as he has done with many of his other graphics throughout his journal), placing a strike-through across this particular graphic. I should also point out that I am not the only researcher who considers that Vyse intended to draw a disc with circumpunct i.e. Ra.



Using Stower's cropped corner from Vyse's journal page, Frank Doernenburg writes this:

Quote

'"He couldn't get a sense out of the "Kh", therefore he philosophises on this page of his journal about the possibility to write a "Re" with lines in it instead of a dot... On the right side [sic]he notes, that this disc can also be written with a dot in the middle (the small circle on top) ..." From here:The Horus Name

I should add here, this is a small point. Even if this were a "misfire" attempt at drawing a circle with 3 lines, it doesn't affect at all what I am arguing but, actually, strengthens it because what Stower is, in fact, implying is that Vyse, when he knows he has to accomodate lines in the disc he would then make such space. So why didn't he do so in the disputed cartocuhe on that page with just the blank disc? (Thanks for the help, Stower).


Stower then alleges I did not see the caption "in Cambell's Chamber" in Vyse's journal entry. I suggest he did not properly read my 'Atlantis Rising' article, particularly page 70 where I write:

Quote

“...On June 16 (over 3 weeks later) he draws the plain blank disc again from the chamber (we know this because of the two dots under the snake and also because Vyse writes alongside 'in Campbell’s Chamber')."

So, far from missing the caption alongside the disputed cartouche as Stower alleges, the caption is there and is used by me in the article to demonstrate the contradiction Vyse presents on this page between the two cartouches i.e. how he has drawn a Khufu cartouche with blank disk from Cambell's Chamber and then draws a Khufu cartouche with hatched disc from Campbell's Chamber. Since there is only one clearly visible Khufu cartouche in this chamber, they cannot both be right. (Hint: easier to add than to take away).

As for the chronology--Stower typically goes off half-cocked. If he had properly read what I have actually written in the article, he would have found this (again p.70):

Quote

"Here's the chronology we learn from his diaries. On May 27 Vyse inserts into his notes a [Khufu cartouche] with plain blank disc. It's there we can see it. On June 16 (3 weeks later) he draws the [Khufu cartouche with the] plain blank disc again from the chamber...I suspect, however, Vyse placed the entire inscription there shortly after entering this chamber and later modified the [plain] disc by adding the three lines [around 16th June]..."

I have not said anywhere that Vyse faked the entire inscription, as Stower alleges, on 16/17th June--quite the opposite. I clearly say it was done earlier (i.e. around 27th May) but with a plain disc (i.e. a disc devoid of the 3 lines) and that Vyse added the 3 lines to his earlier entry 3 weeks later around 16/17th June and that is what he is deliberating on this page before the drawings would be sent off to London 3 days later (with neither the cartouche or crew name facsimiles verified by an independent witness, I might add).

On page 68 of my AR article, I write:

Quote

"The second cartouche (Figure 2), also found by Vyse, is presented only in his handwritten journal (he didn’t publish this)..."

I repeat (contrary to Stower's half-cocked slur), this cartouche as we observe it in Vyse's journal entry of 16/17th June with blank disc and two staff-like glyphs in the crew name was NOT published in Vyse's finished book. If Stower can show me that specific set of hieroglyphs in Vyse's book then I shall happily concede the point.

That is me for the moment. But I shall hopefully return to this when time permits. I am presently writing Part II of this article, which will present further evidence from Vyse's journal and other sources that clearly show that Vyse and his team faked these entries--and if he could fake these hieroglyphs in Campbell's Chamber he could have done so in the other chambers.

Now, where's my fountain pen?


SC



Post Edited (31-May-14 11:36)

Options: ReplyQuote


Subject Views Written By Posted
Further comments on Creighton’s article [Thread Closed] 850 Martin Stower 23-May-14 00:06
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 461 drew 23-May-14 04:09
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 549 Martin Stower 23-May-14 09:32
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 534 Skatha 23-May-14 04:46
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 483 Martin Stower 24-May-14 19:11
Desperate 451 LonelyAngel 23-May-14 13:11
Re: Desperate 538 Martin Stower 23-May-14 13:46
Mod Note > LonelyAngel – Reminder 564 Dr. Troglodyte 23-May-14 17:19
Re: Desperate 486 eyeofhorus33 23-May-14 17:56
Re: Desperate 522 Martin Stower 23-May-14 23:12
Re: Desperate 523 LonelyAngel 25-May-14 14:15
Re: Desperate 492 Brian Patterson 25-May-14 15:30
Re: Desperate 479 Martin Stower 25-May-14 15:48
Re: Desperate 480 Ahatmose 25-May-14 16:04
Re: Desperate 443 Martin Stower 25-May-14 16:56
Re: Desperate 576 Ahatmose 25-May-14 17:13
Re: Desperate 524 LonelyAngel 25-May-14 20:24
Re: Desperate 544 Martin Stower 26-May-14 00:19
Re: Desperate 478 cladking 25-May-14 22:30
Re: Desperate 424 eyeofhorus33 25-May-14 17:13
Re: Desperate 470 LonelyAngel 25-May-14 20:51
Re: Desperate 534 Martin Stower 25-May-14 22:47
Re: Desperate 450 eyeofhorus33 26-May-14 08:35
Further comments II 967 Martin Stower 24-May-14 18:20
Re: Further comments II 459 Thanos5150 24-May-14 19:31
Re: Further comments II 458 Martin Stower 24-May-14 19:51
Re: Further comments II 501 Thanos5150 25-May-14 01:35
Re: Further comments II 439 drew 25-May-14 03:47
Re: Further comments II 519 eyeofhorus33 25-May-14 10:01
Re: Further comments II 480 Martin Stower 25-May-14 12:05
Re: Further comments II 507 Martin Stower 25-May-14 12:01
Further comments III 891 Martin Stower 26-May-14 02:14
Re: Further comments III 503 Thanos5150 27-May-14 17:06
Re: Further comments III 511 Martin Stower 27-May-14 19:12
Re: Further comments III 485 Thanos5150 27-May-14 22:34
Re: Further comments III 452 Martin Stower 27-May-14 22:52
Re: Further comments III 513 Dr. Troglodyte 27-May-14 23:04
Re: Further comments III 492 Thanos5150 27-May-14 23:23
Re: Further comments III 463 Martin Stower 27-May-14 23:44
Re: Further comments III 463 Thanos5150 27-May-14 23:54
Re: Further comments III 494 Martin Stower 28-May-14 00:08
Re: Further comments III 468 Thanos5150 28-May-14 00:59
Re: Further comments III 493 Martin Stower 29-May-14 00:00
Re: Further comments III 530 Skatha 30-May-14 00:16
Re: Further comments III 470 Martin Stower 30-May-14 09:57
Re: Further comments III 482 Thanos5150 30-May-14 17:43
Re: Further comments III 521 randompHactor 30-May-14 18:17
Re: Further comments III 411 Martin Stower 30-May-14 19:25
Re: Further comments III 489 Thanos5150 30-May-14 20:21
Re: Further comments III 480 Martin Stower 30-May-14 20:43
Re: Further comments III 454 Thanos5150 30-May-14 20:56
Re: Further comments III 789 Martin Stower 30-May-14 21:15
Re: Further comments III 534 Thanos5150 31-May-14 00:28
Re: Further comments III 478 AmadeusD 31-May-14 02:42
Re: Further comments III 514 Martin Stower 31-May-14 07:56
Re: Further comments III 460 sfbey 30-May-14 21:16
Re: Further comments III 509 Dr. Troglodyte 30-May-14 20:12
Re: Further comments III 536 Audrey 30-May-14 05:34
Re: Further comments III 481 Martin Stower 30-May-14 09:25
Re: Further comments III 508 Martin Stower 27-May-14 22:35
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 544 D-Archer 27-May-14 19:15
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 529 Martin Stower 27-May-14 19:25
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 498 D-Archer 27-May-14 19:32
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 526 Martin Stower 27-May-14 22:29
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 543 D-Archer 28-May-14 10:25
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 597 Martin Stower 28-May-14 13:10
Drawn...and quartered : ) 482 Thunderbird 30-May-14 03:52
Re: Drawn...and quartered : ) 517 Martin Stower 30-May-14 12:49
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 517 k_mand 30-May-14 16:48
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 514 Martin Stower 30-May-14 19:31
What have you missed? 456 Thunderbird 30-May-14 22:49
Re: What have you missed? 547 Martin Stower 30-May-14 23:09
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 522 k_mand 31-May-14 04:14
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 465 Martin Stower 31-May-14 08:17
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 472 k_mand 01-Jun-14 02:21
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 421 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 10:38
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 478 Thanos5150 01-Jun-14 17:01
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 466 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 19:02
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 491 Thanos5150 02-Jun-14 02:26
The cult of Khufu 538 Thunderbird 02-Jun-14 03:40
I’d buy that for a dollar! 473 Martin Stower 30-May-14 21:53
Not worth it ... 600 Ahatmose 31-May-14 01:55
Re: Not worth it ... 501 Brian Patterson 31-May-14 04:04
The Mud Slinging Has Started 472 Scott Creighton 31-May-14 09:17
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 555 Ahatmose 31-May-14 11:47
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 473 Scott Creighton 31-May-14 12:00
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 487 Martin Stower 31-May-14 12:45
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 472 Ahatmose 31-May-14 23:14
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 446 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 00:54
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 529 Audrey 01-Jun-14 05:04
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 508 Thunderbird 01-Jun-14 06:06
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 407 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 10:35
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 515 Audrey 01-Jun-14 17:43
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 495 eyeofhorus33 01-Jun-14 19:35
Follow the cult follow the... 379 Thunderbird 01-Jun-14 21:11
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 502 Audrey 03-Jun-14 03:54
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 521 eyeofhorus33 03-Jun-14 22:33
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 514 Audrey 05-Jun-14 02:07
Re: The Ring of the gods 497 Thunderbird 04-Jun-14 15:55
Re: The Ring of the gods 473 Audrey 05-Jun-14 05:36
Re: Mystery of the Gods 438 Thunderbird 02-Jun-14 01:39
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 525 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 10:33
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 477 Audrey 01-Jun-14 19:38
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 550 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 20:44
Arches and Chambers 421 loveritas 01-Jun-14 22:51
Re: Arches and Chambers 524 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 00:03
Definitely Puzzled 510 loveritas 02-Jun-14 11:30
Re: Definitely Puzzled 462 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 13:05
Re: Definitely Puzzled 437 Audrey 03-Jun-14 01:38
Re: Definitely Puzzled 482 Scott Creighton 03-Jun-14 01:56
Re: Definitely Puzzled 514 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 10:40
Re: Definitely Puzzled 506 Scott Creighton 03-Jun-14 11:21
Re: Definitely Puzzled 573 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 13:02
Re: Definitely Puzzled 509 Scott Creighton 03-Jun-14 13:34
Re: Definitely Puzzled 467 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 13:56
Re: Definitely Puzzled 483 Scott Creighton 03-Jun-14 14:03
How it really happened 1168 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 16:15
Re: How it really happened 570 Scott Creighton 03-Jun-14 17:25
Re: How it really happened 629 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 20:18
Re: Definitely Puzzled 489 Audrey 05-Jun-14 01:54
Re: Definitely Puzzled 497 Merrell 03-Jun-14 07:41
Re: Definitely Puzzled 458 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 10:32
Re: Definitely Puzzled 508 loveritas 03-Jun-14 11:12
Re: Definitely Puzzled 517 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 13:05
Re: Definitely Puzzled 464 loveritas 03-Jun-14 23:48
Re: Arches and Chambers 464 Merrell 02-Jun-14 11:36
Re: Arches and Chambers 499 Dr. Troglodyte 02-Jun-14 16:40
Re: Arches and Chambers 452 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 18:02
Re: Arches and Chambers 500 Dr. Troglodyte 02-Jun-14 18:29
Re: Arches and Chambers 477 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 20:46
Re: Forced entry 479 Thunderbird 02-Jun-14 06:31
Going Inside The Pyramid 521 loveritas 02-Jun-14 12:07
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 487 Audrey 01-Jun-14 23:08
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 497 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 00:02
Medjedu 498 loveritas 04-Jun-14 11:39
Wilkinson? 494 Martin Stower 02-Jun-14 00:25
Re: The Mud Slinging Has Started 602 Martin Stower 31-May-14 12:44
Perring and Vyse 793 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 00:33
Reference marks 546 Martin Stower 01-Jun-14 14:01
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 495 Brian Patterson 03-Jun-14 04:06
Mod Warning > Messrs. Creighton and Stower 464 Dr. Troglodyte 03-Jun-14 16:51
How it really happened 465 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 16:54
From caption to self-contradiction 485 Martin Stower 03-Jun-14 22:38
Why the drawings? 896 Martin Stower 04-Jun-14 22:14
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 525 DUNE 04-Jun-14 22:46
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 460 sfbey 04-Jun-14 23:02
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 578 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 08:50
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 447 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 09:42
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 529 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 10:08
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 506 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 10:59
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 509 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 11:04
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 452 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 11:42
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 516 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 11:48
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 488 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 12:04
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 447 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 12:16
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 525 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 12:27
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 454 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 12:30
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 522 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 12:48
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 509 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 12:56
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 492 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 13:49
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 442 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 14:05
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 526 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:12
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 507 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 15:22
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 453 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:32
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 460 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 15:45
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 459 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:50
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 465 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 15:52
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 528 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 16:02
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 518 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 16:04
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 396 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 16:38
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 478 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 16:48
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 523 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 16:56
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 455 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 17:02
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 517 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 17:18
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 455 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 17:23
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 473 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 17:27
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 509 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 17:29
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 493 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 17:51
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 475 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 17:55
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 530 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 18:16
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 470 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 18:21
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 412 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 18:23
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 509 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 18:29
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 516 eyeofhorus33 05-Jun-14 17:45
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 472 cladking 05-Jun-14 16:11
Re: Ping for Audrey and Loveritas 438 Thunderbird 05-Jun-14 19:11
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 458 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 14:20
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 454 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 14:32
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 426 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:30
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 452 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 15:40
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 371 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:45
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 367 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 16:01
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 504 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 16:33
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 457 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 15:42
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 454 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 16:04
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 483 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 16:45
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 522 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 16:53
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 500 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 17:14
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 482 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 17:44
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 408 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 18:03
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 525 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 18:18
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 527 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 18:21
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 455 Audrey 05-Jun-14 21:22
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 523 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 21:37
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 416 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 22:05
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 533 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 23:04
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 652 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 23:25
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 591 Martin Stower 06-Jun-14 11:44
Mod Warning #2 > Scott Creighton 490 lukehancock 06-Jun-14 14:51
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 435 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 20:22
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 434 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 18:10
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 424 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 18:19
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 476 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 21:10
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 474 Audrey 05-Jun-14 21:29
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 519 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 21:47
Mod Warning #3 > Ahatmose 458 lukehancock 06-Jun-14 14:50
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 479 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 16:06
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 435 Martin Stower 04-Jun-14 23:20
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 572 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 10:01
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 539 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 11:14
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 502 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 11:25
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 696 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 11:39
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 408 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 11:48
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 502 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 12:00
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 492 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 12:14
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 481 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 14:34
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 409 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 14:58
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 476 Ahatmose 05-Jun-14 16:10
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 407 Scott Creighton 05-Jun-14 16:13
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 488 eyeofhorus33 05-Jun-14 18:25
Re: Further comments on Creighton’s article 496 Martin Stower 05-Jun-14 21:17


Sorry, you can't reply to this topic. It has been closed.