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Sorry, Manu, but can we go back a step. You wrote:

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Manu:...and that physical evidence in the chamber can be explained with an in situ job by pyramid workers.

And I responded:

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SC: Oh sure--the ancient Egyptians wrote sideways and upside-down all the time. If you can find examples of such upside-down in-situ writing outwith the GP, I'd be happy to look at it.

So I ask:

1) What evidence do you have that these marks were, as you now claim, "an in-stu job by the pyramid workers"? I only ask this because the view of mainstream has always been that the marks were painted by the quarry gangs either at the quarries or when their work (block) was being transported. Your proposition above seems to want to overturn that mainstream view.

2) If you believe the AEs wrote in-situ marks upside-down, sideways etc, can you explain why that would be easier than writing the marks the right way up?

3) As I asked in my original response, can you provide any other examples of in-situ, upside-down / sideways old hieratic writing?

You subseqently wrote:

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Manu: "He built his pyramid" means he built his pyramid.

You may be somewhat surprised to learn that I actually accept that 'Khufu' built the GP--well, kinda accept it. (For example, see my post here). The Arabic scholars state that the GP was built by Saurid. Lehner suggests Saurid may be a corruption of Suphis. And Suphis was later transliterated by Rosellini into Khufu. So yes--kinda accept it. What I have extreme trouble accepting is the chronology and I am much more in line with Schoch's thinking on this (even Bauval still insists on the relatively 'young' date of ca. 2500 BC). Those king's names we observe in the GP were written quite literally by the "FOLLOWERS of Khufu" - just like today, for example, many Christians are sometimes referred to as the "FOLLOWERS of Christ". The king's names we find in the GP all come from a much later time i.e. from those who continued to remember, respect and honour the builder, the "FOLLOWERS of Khufu". This is to say that Vyse found and copied into the GP marks from a much later period made by the "FOLLOWERS or 'FRIENDS' of Khufu" that were found somewhere outside the GP. At least, that is what the evidence suggests to me.

So, if the Sphinx and Gizamids are contemporary structures (and I have very good reason for believing that they are), then if a 4th dynasty King named Khufu repaired the Sphinx then this was not the same Khufu that built the GP but perhaps a "FOLLOWER of Khufu", a 4th dynasty king named in honour of the original. Perhaps.

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Manu: It weighs heavier than casting doubt on one mark (or three marks now) inside a chamber sealed until 200 years ago.

Trust me--there are many more than THREE painted marks being disputed here. And you know what, even if it could be proven conclusively, beyond ANY doubt whatsoever that Vyse DID forge just ONE mark (while the rest of the marks remained questionable), that ONE PROVEN FORGED MARK totally poisons the entire well. Even if it has not been proven that the other marks are fake, simply knowing that Vyse DID FAKE something in those chambers would - whether you like it or not, agree with it or not - cast doubt upon the other marks in the minds of most reasonable thinking people. For sure.

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Manu: But in any case, let's quit quibbling. Take it to the next level. That's really the message. If you had me sold by now, you should be worried.

I'd be more worried if I hadn't convinced anyone by now of my argument. And trust me--there are plenty that are convinced by it. And yet I know that there are many that are not, thus far, convinced. Such is the way of these things and I don't lose sleep over it. People are allowed to draw their own conclusions. All I ask, as I have said to you before, is that they consider and weigh ALL the evidence I present for the case for these marks having been faked is much, much greater than the sum of its parts.

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Manu: I am not going to put words into anyone's mouth only my own...

I wouldn't expect you to do otherwise.

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Manu: The best theory to explain all observations by all involved parties to date is that Khufu built his pyramid on a preexisting structure and what I have shown on my own is that the orientation, base, height, angle, indent, king chamber, and north shaft therefrom were all part of a design conceived by Hemiunu, Khufu's vizier. What that means is that substantially most of Khufu Akhet was built by him including the king chamber (courses 50-60) and relieving chambers with the quarry marks.

As I said--I kinda agree with this (except the quarry marks are, imo, fake). And I simply do not accept the mainstream chronology.

SC



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09-Jun-18 21:00 by Scott Creighton.

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Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 613 Scott Creighton 08-Jun-18 13:43
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 517 Merrell 08-Jun-18 14:00
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 485 Scott Creighton 08-Jun-18 14:07
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 444 Martin Stower 08-Jun-18 14:13
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 474 Scott Creighton 08-Jun-18 14:17
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 458 Thunderbird 08-Jun-18 14:35
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 428 Martin Stower 08-Jun-18 14:43
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 425 Scott Creighton 08-Jun-18 14:23
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 436 Martin Stower 08-Jun-18 14:08
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 443 Scott Creighton 08-Jun-18 14:15
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 401 Martin Stower 08-Jun-18 14:30
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 371 Scott Creighton 08-Jun-18 14:32
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 373 Origyptian 08-Jun-18 15:55
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 418 Scott Creighton 08-Jun-18 14:20
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 388 Martin Stower 08-Jun-18 14:34
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 395 Manu 08-Jun-18 20:12
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 358 Corpuscles 08-Jun-18 22:16
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 385 Manu 08-Jun-18 22:52
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 348 Origyptian 08-Jun-18 23:08
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 396 Scott Creighton 09-Jun-18 09:31
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 381 Martin Stower 09-Jun-18 10:55
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 355 Jon Ellison 09-Jun-18 11:00
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 356 Scott Creighton 09-Jun-18 11:23
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 367 Jon Ellison 09-Jun-18 11:28
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 374 Manu 09-Jun-18 14:23
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 369 Scott Creighton 09-Jun-18 14:36
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 348 Manu 09-Jun-18 15:25
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 356 Scott Creighton 09-Jun-18 15:47
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 322 Manu 09-Jun-18 16:07
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 355 Scott Creighton 09-Jun-18 16:20
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 368 Manu 09-Jun-18 16:57
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 364 Scott Creighton 09-Jun-18 19:09
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 374 Martin Stower 09-Jun-18 19:46
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 378 Merrell 09-Jun-18 19:58
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 370 Scott Creighton 09-Jun-18 20:53
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 399 Martin Stower 09-Jun-18 21:11
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 371 Merrell 09-Jun-18 22:41
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 342 Scott Creighton 09-Jun-18 22:56
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Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 354 Manu 09-Jun-18 15:43
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 354 Corpuscles 10-Jun-18 07:52
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 374 Martin Stower 10-Jun-18 09:56
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 358 Manu 10-Jun-18 14:11
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 329 Scott Creighton 10-Jun-18 14:39
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 443 Martin Stower 08-Jun-18 23:25
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Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 313 Morten 12-Jun-18 01:50
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 330 Scott Creighton 12-Jun-18 07:53
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Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 331 Martin Stower 12-Jun-18 10:14
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 328 Morten 12-Jun-18 10:24
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 341 Scott Creighton 12-Jun-18 10:34
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 335 Martin Stower 12-Jun-18 10:59
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 362 Corpuscles 12-Jun-18 11:15
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 339 Martin Stower 12-Jun-18 10:50
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 371 Martin Stower 12-Jun-18 10:06
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 328 Corpuscles 12-Jun-18 08:23
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 328 Morten 12-Jun-18 09:35
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Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 313 Corpuscles 13-Jun-18 02:46
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 335 Martin Stower 13-Jun-18 08:45
Thank you n/t 301 Morten 13-Jun-18 10:51
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 324 Scott Creighton 13-Jun-18 07:34
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 341 Martin Stower 13-Jun-18 08:37
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 357 Morten 13-Jun-18 11:55
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 326 Scott Creighton 13-Jun-18 13:32
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Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 326 Scott Creighton 13-Jun-18 20:17
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Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 328 Scott Creighton 13-Jun-18 21:17
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 325 sfbey 13-Jun-18 21:47
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 352 Scott Creighton 14-Jun-18 07:30
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Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 318 Martin Stower 14-Jun-18 14:11
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 331 sfbey 14-Jun-18 14:33
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 317 Scott Creighton 14-Jun-18 14:43
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 362 sfbey 14-Jun-18 15:06
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 338 Merrell 14-Jun-18 15:36
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 342 Martin Stower 14-Jun-18 15:49
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 307 Martin Stower 16-Jul-18 08:48
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 279 Corpuscles 17-Jul-18 06:08
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 346 Martin Stower 17-Jul-18 10:44
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 318 DavidK 14-Jun-18 11:40
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 315 Martin Stower 13-Jun-18 21:37
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 340 Corpuscles 13-Jun-18 23:13
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 347 Morten 14-Jun-18 01:38
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 342 sfbey 13-Jun-18 17:01
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 355 Martin Stower 13-Jun-18 17:51
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 321 Morten 14-Jun-18 09:44
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 342 Scott Creighton 14-Jun-18 10:05
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 306 Morten 14-Jun-18 11:22
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 322 Scott Creighton 14-Jun-18 11:49
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 332 Morten 14-Jun-18 12:01
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 314 Scott Creighton 14-Jun-18 12:05
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 317 Martin Stower 14-Jun-18 12:37
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 293 Martin Stower 14-Jun-18 12:24
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 316 Martin Stower 14-Jul-18 23:02
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 331 Martin Stower 14-Jun-18 12:20
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 296 DavidK 14-Jun-18 17:34
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 307 DavidK 14-Jun-18 17:47
Re: Straw man.....In situ 329 Thunderbird 14-Jun-18 18:14
Re: Straw man.....In situ 318 Martin Stower 14-Jun-18 20:10
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 346 Martin Stower 14-Jun-18 21:57
Hieratic Numbers 355 Manu 15-Jun-18 06:45
Re: Hieratic Numbers 354 Martin Stower 15-Jun-18 08:37
Re: Hieratic Numbers 326 Manu 15-Jun-18 14:11
Re: Hieratic Numbers 293 Morten 16-Jun-18 01:18
Re: Hieratic Numbers 300 Manu 16-Jun-18 01:33
Re: Hieratic Numbers 282 Morten 16-Jun-18 13:14
Re: Hieratic Numbers 329 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 13:20
Re: Hieratic Numbers 292 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 13:32
Re: Hieratic Numbers 308 Morten 16-Jun-18 13:41
Re: Hieratic Numbers 313 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 14:08
Re: Hieratic Numbers 284 Morten 16-Jun-18 14:18
Re: Hieratic Numbers 322 Corpuscles 16-Jun-18 14:43
Re: Hieratic Numbers 255 Morten 16-Jun-18 14:53
Re: Hieratic Numbers 316 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 14:45
Re: Hieratic Numbers 274 Corpuscles 16-Jun-18 15:09
Re: Hieratic Numbers 287 Morten 16-Jun-18 15:11
Re: Hieratic Numbers 298 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 15:32
Re: Hieratic Numbers 275 Morten 16-Jun-18 15:45
Re: Hieratic Numbers 325 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 16:06
Re: Hieratic Numbers 305 Morten 16-Jun-18 16:15
Re: Hieratic Numbers 285 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 16:17
Re: Hieratic Numbers 310 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 16:51
Re: Hieratic Numbers 330 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 17:32
Re: Hieratic Numbers 298 Morten 16-Jun-18 18:13
Re: Hieratic Numbers 319 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 18:43
Re: Hieratic Numbers 301 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 19:06
Re: Hieratic Numbers 323 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 18:33
Re: Hieratic Numbers 303 R Avry Wilson 16-Jun-18 17:22
Re: Hieratic Numbers 296 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 15:58
Motive Means and Opportunity= suspicion only 281 Corpuscles 16-Jun-18 16:06
Re: Motive Means and Opportunity= suspicion only 306 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 17:40
Re: Motive Means and Opportunity= suspicion only 321 Corpuscles 18-Jun-18 23:51
Re: Motive Means and Opportunity= suspicion only 396 Martin Stower 19-Jun-18 10:52
Re: Hieratic Numbers 275 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 15:27
Re: Hieratic Numbers 283 Thanos5150 16-Jun-18 14:33
Re: Hieratic Numbers 312 Morten 16-Jun-18 14:42
Re: Hieratic Numbers 298 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 14:35
Re: Hieratic Numbers 306 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 13:30
Re: Hieratic Numbers 303 Morten 16-Jun-18 13:58
Re: Hieratic Numbers 325 sfbey 15-Jun-18 14:36
Re: Hieratic Numbers 344 Manu 15-Jun-18 15:03
Re: Hieratic Numbers 256 sfbey 15-Jun-18 15:14
Re: Hieratic Numbers 322 Manu 15-Jun-18 15:45
Re: Hieratic Numbers 335 Scott Creighton 15-Jun-18 15:28
Re: Hieratic Numbers 308 sfbey 15-Jun-18 15:36
Re: Hieratic Numbers 301 Scott Creighton 15-Jun-18 15:44
Re: Hieratic Numbers 329 Martin Stower 15-Jun-18 16:50
Re: Hieratic Numbers 316 Martin Stower 15-Jun-18 21:45
Re: Hieratic Numbers 324 Manu 15-Jun-18 15:52
Re: Hieratic Numbers 310 Scott Creighton 15-Jun-18 16:07
Re: Hieratic Numbers 290 cladking 15-Jun-18 16:26
Re: Hieratic Numbers 324 Manu 15-Jun-18 17:01
Re: Hieratic Numbers 309 Scott Creighton 15-Jun-18 17:36
Re: Hieratic Numbers 327 Manu 15-Jun-18 18:01
Re: Hieratic Numbers 308 Scott Creighton 15-Jun-18 18:36
Re: Hieratic Numbers 307 Martin Stower 15-Jun-18 22:00
Re: Hieratic Numbers 296 Manu 16-Jun-18 01:05
Re: Hieratic Numbers 293 Origyptian 16-Jun-18 01:38
Re: Hieratic Numbers 267 Morten 18-Jun-18 10:38
Re: Hieratic Numbers 286 Manu 16-Jun-18 04:57
Re: Hieratic Numbers 329 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 10:27
Re: Hieratic Numbers 284 cladking 15-Jun-18 16:29
Re: Hieratic Numbers 320 gulsbo 15-Jun-18 17:49
Re: Hieratic Numbers 291 Origyptian 16-Jun-18 00:51
Re: Hieratic Numbers 342 Origyptian 16-Jun-18 00:39
Re: Hieratic Numbers 294 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 00:52
Re: Hieratic Numbers 309 Origyptian 16-Jun-18 01:33
Re: Hieratic Numbers 322 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 09:20
Re: Hieratic Numbers 285 Origyptian 16-Jun-18 12:14
Re: Hieratic Numbers 296 Morten 16-Jun-18 01:48
Re: Hieratic Numbers 324 Manu 16-Jun-18 02:34
Re: Hieratic Numbers 291 R Avry Wilson 16-Jun-18 02:46
Re: Hieratic Numbers 284 Manu 16-Jun-18 02:51
Re: Hieratic Numbers 287 R Avry Wilson 16-Jun-18 04:24
Re: Questioning......History : ) 289 Thunderbird 16-Jun-18 17:23
Re: Hieratic Numbers 285 Origyptian 16-Jun-18 04:32
Re: Hieratic Numbers 293 R Avry Wilson 16-Jun-18 04:38
Re: Hieratic Numbers 286 gulsbo 18-Jun-18 12:19
Re: Hieratic Numbers 308 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 09:37
Re: Hieratic Numbers 326 Morten 16-Jun-18 10:05
Re: Hieratic Numbers 316 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 13:10
Re: Hieratic Numbers 305 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 13:17
Re: Hieratic Numbers 341 gulsbo 18-Jun-18 12:24
Take a stand 276 Morten 16-Jun-18 13:30
Re: Take a piss or get off the pot.... 302 Scott Creighton 16-Jun-18 13:37
Re: Hieratic Numbers 284 Martin Stower 16-Jul-18 17:04
Re: Hieratic Numbers 301 R Avry Wilson 16-Jun-18 02:39
Re: Hieratic Numbers 314 Morten 16-Jun-18 00:56
Re: Hieratic Numbers 304 sfbey 16-Jun-18 01:02
Re: Hieratic Numbers 295 Manu 16-Jun-18 01:09
Re: Hieratic Numbers 337 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 01:15
Re: Hieratic Numbers 286 Morten 16-Jun-18 09:51
Re: Hieratic Numbers 293 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 10:42
Re: Hieratic Numbers 320 Morten 16-Jun-18 12:34
Re: Hieratic Number 10 vrs 1/2? 328 sfbey 15-Jun-18 19:14
Re: Hieratic Number 10 vrs 1/2? 323 Scott Creighton 15-Jun-18 19:38
Re: Hieratic Number 10 vrs 1/2? 311 sfbey 15-Jun-18 20:04
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 331 Corpuscles 16-Jun-18 02:02
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 342 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 10:12
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 314 Martin Stower 16-Jun-18 21:24
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 288 Jon Ellison 16-Jun-18 23:06
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 299 Jon Ellison 16-Jun-18 23:24
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 312 Jon Ellison 17-Jun-18 00:11
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 265 Martin Stower 17-Jun-18 09:07
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 279 Scott Creighton 17-Jun-18 09:19
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 308 Martin Stower 17-Jun-18 09:44
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 314 Jon Ellison 17-Jun-18 10:02
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 307 Jon Ellison 17-Jun-18 10:43
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 299 Jon Ellison 17-Jun-18 11:01
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 279 Martin Stower 17-Jun-18 11:09
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 297 Martin Stower 17-Jun-18 11:05
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 304 Jon Ellison 17-Jun-18 11:30
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 317 Jon Ellison 17-Jun-18 11:40
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 320 Scott Creighton 17-Jun-18 14:28
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 308 Martin Stower 17-Jun-18 17:20
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 341 Scott Creighton 17-Jun-18 17:29
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 321 Martin Stower 17-Jun-18 19:16
Reflected Roof Plan 319 Dr. Troglodyte 17-Jun-18 20:44
Re: Reflected Roof Plan 311 Martin Stower 17-Jun-18 21:09
Re: Reflected Roof Plan 309 Scott Creighton 17-Jun-18 21:13
Re: Reflected Roof Plan 351 Martin Stower 17-Jun-18 22:03
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 342 Corpuscles 17-Jun-18 02:20
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 322 Jon Ellison 17-Jun-18 07:10
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 333 Corpuscles 18-Jun-18 02:51
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 295 Martin Stower 18-Jun-18 09:39
Re: Creighton article slips out unannounced 357 Martin Stower 17-Jun-18 08:47


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