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Barbelo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But anyway, on the subject of one's self serving
> imagination, could you, as the leading proponent
> of the Causeway As A Processional Way Theory

Am I? I thought the whole of Egyptology at large might have greater standing on the matter than I. You said:
"The argument that this causeway was a Processional Way does not pass the test of logic. "

Which I replied:
"Why not"?....
"I fail to see any reason it could not have been or was not a Processional way...". All of which translates to you to mean that I am just feeding my "self serving imagination" and am the "leading proponent of the Causeway As A Processional Way Theory"? If I didn't know better I'd say you were selling porky pies Loveritas.

I do fail to see why it was not used as a processional way unlike nearly other pyramid complex, yet this does not mean it was its original purpose, if it was originally there at all, but I certainly have no reason to doubt it was not its last purpose.

As I have noted in other threads the limestone component of the VT does not appear to me be contemporary with the granite component with the latter added perhaps much later. Also, as I have noted in other threads, there appears to be a clear disparity in the chronology of construction of the phases of the mortuary temple as well with the megalithic "front" phase being older than the back and of the same building program as the VT:

Further to consider is that, even according to Lehner, the VT was built before the Sphinx Temple which was built from blocks taken to form part of the Sphinx enclosure. So if we remove the granite component, which the sloped entrance to the causeway as shown is formed and cut through the limestone blocks which without would otherwise be a wall higher than the causeway, we are left to wonder what in fact was originally there regarding a causeway connecting the VT and the MT.


So the VT was built first and the "Sphinx side" set at an angle with if just looking at internet photos appears to be a "passageway" between the later Sphinx Temple:

But it is not and leads directly into the embankment the causeway was made of regardless:


No, it is not a "passageway", but the remnants of the north side enclosure wall that the builders of the Sphinx temple removed (the massive blocks on the right side of the picture above are the remnants of this wall-compare to the Sphinx Temple):

According to Lehner:
Quote

Khafre built enclosure walls north and south of his Valley Temple. Parts of the south wall still exist, but the ancient builders removed most of the north wall.

You can still see the foundation track for the northern enclosure wall stones in front of the southeast corner of the Sphinx Temple. Part of the wall was incorporated into the southern wall of the Sphinx Temple.

Also as I have noted before the Sphinx temple is largely inferior in construction to the limestone component of the VT and according to Lehner the Sphinx Temple was never even finished. So what we supposedly have here, in the reign of one pharoah, is that he built the VT utilizing massive large blocks to make an enclosure wall on both sides then changed his mind and scrapped the north wall and carved out the Sphinx using the blocks to make the inferior Sphinx temple right next to the VT-a complete one off in the history of Egypt. In which no one cared about this Sphinx until the MK.

Here is an idea-when the VT and megalithic component of the mortuary temple were built there was no causeway. The Sphinx Temple was built by expanding and repurposing the Sphinx enclosure which at that time the Sphinx was carved into a statue. The causeway was built when the granite component was retrofitted to the limestone component of the VT which was made to join with the megalithic mortuary temple in which the last was to build the later "back" phase of the mortuary temple. As noted before, as seen here on the rump of the Sphinx, there are two levels to the Sphinx enclosure which the hack job lower level had to have been made to make the Sphinx meaning this was made after the VT but given the erosion the upper section was already there:

We can see in the older photo the cut in the bedrock made not only to make the Sphinx, but accommodate the Sphinx Temple:


Note the angle of the VT north wall, and "passage" (enclosure wall), are not the same as the causeway.

Also, compare the erosion of the enclosure behind the Sphinx temple compared to the rest:


Night and day.

But to continue with the 1st picture directly above, we can also see where the original north VT enclosure wall was meaning that the area where the Sphinx temple sit was already cleared to some degree as well as the upper level of the Sphinx enclosure to the right of the Sphinx. And we also note that the back of the Sphinx enclosure takes us directly to the front of G1. When looking at this photo what was directly to the left and behind the VT?

We see what we see today but in reality how it was not just then but during each phase, if not era, of construction was likely radically different:


For example, what did the area look like above the causeway before the mastabas were built? And keep in mind that the overwhelming majority of these mastabas were built in the 5th and 6th Dynasties. Hmm.

Oh, sorry. I forgot this was your thread.

> please explain to the readers (I believe that
> there are some):

So these are the questions you think I did not answer because I "could not"? Lol. Oh, wait. I forgot- you were not being honest and just said what you did in a vapid attempt to goad me into playing your silly games by appealing to my vanity. Games upon games with you.

> (1) Why Khufu built his Valley Temple at the base
> of the cliff and not on the plateau?

Probably because he did not built it on the "base of a cliff", but rather well below it.
Given the location of said cliff in relation to G1, i.e. the elevation of G1, and the Nile it would stand to reason if water way access to the VT was the goal, which it seems was the norm, it would be obvious why it was not built on the plateau.

> (2) How did the procession ascend the cliff on
> their walk from the Valley Temple to the Mortuary
> Temple? Did they clamber up as best they could;
> use ropes or perhaps use a funicular (a popular
> theory at the moment)?

How many times must you be spoon fed this information? Or are you ignoring it on purpose as usual, which unfortunately you needed to be told of such things in the first place?

Again, for your convenience:
Quote

Herodotus:
Quote

Of this oppression there passed ten years while the causeway was made by which they drew the stones, which causeway they built, and it is a work not much less, as it appears to me, than the pyramid; for the length of it is five furlongs and the breadth ten fathoms and the height, where it is highest, eight fathoms, and it is made of stone smoothed and with figures carved upon it.

Eight fathoms would be roughly 48ft high which stands to reason "where it is highest" would be exactly where it was needed- "off the edge of the cliff".

Oh, right, but we can't trust Herodotus for such things.

Have at it Lovertitas.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 08-Jan-20 15:54 by Thanos5150.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Causeways And The Sun 3282 Barbelo 14-May-18 04:29
Re: Causeways And The Sun 507 kborissov 14-May-18 15:44
Re: Causeways And The Sun 513 Barbelo 14-May-18 21:25
Re: Causeways And The Moon 622 Barbelo 15-May-18 23:01
The Causeway of Unas 441 Barbelo 16-May-18 22:00
Re: Causeways And The Sun 402 Spiros 17-May-18 00:12
Re: Causeways And The Sun 414 Barbelo 17-May-18 01:35
Re: Causeways And The Sun 409 Spiros 17-May-18 01:46
Re: Causeways And The Sun 424 Barbelo 17-May-18 02:45
Re: Causeways And The Sun 410 Spiros 18-May-18 21:54
Re: Causeways And The Sun 333 Barbelo 18-May-18 22:31
Re: Causeways And The Sun 343 Spiros 19-May-18 11:54
Red Pyramid Causeway? 478 Barbelo 17-May-18 20:21
Re: Red Pyramid Causeway? 479 Thanos5150 18-May-18 04:20
Re: Red Pyramid Causeway? 374 Barbelo 18-May-18 05:00
Re: Red Pyramid Causeway? 405 Thanos5150 18-May-18 16:28
Re: Red Pyramid Causeway? 398 Barbelo 18-May-18 22:05
Re: Red Pyramid Causeway? 344 Thanos5150 18-May-18 22:49
Re: Red Pyramid Causeway? 391 Manu 18-May-18 05:31
Re: Red Pyramid Causeway? 378 Thanos5150 19-May-18 00:00
Re: Red Pyramid Causeway? 349 Manu 19-May-18 01:16
Re: Red Pyramid Causeway? 309 Thanos5150 19-May-18 02:08
Hor Us and Hat Hor 377 Barbelo 19-May-18 03:01
Re: Red Pyramid Causeway? 346 Thanos5150 19-May-18 14:46
Re: Giza - Ancient Prime Meridian 384 Thunderbird 18-May-18 17:59
Re: Giza - Ancient Prime Meridian 319 Barbelo 18-May-18 22:48
Step Pyramid Causeway? 881 Barbelo 18-May-18 22:29
Re: Step Pyramid Causeway? 343 Thanos5150 19-May-18 14:06
Re: Step Pyramid Causeway? 326 Barbelo 19-May-18 21:30
Khafre Causeway 385 Barbelo 19-May-18 22:05
Re: Khafre Causeway 356 Thanos5150 20-May-18 00:53
Re: Khafre Causeway 645 Barbelo 20-May-18 04:23
Re: Khafre Causeway 353 Thanos5150 20-May-18 17:27
Re: Khafre Causeway 382 Barbelo 20-May-18 21:50
Re: Khafre Causeway 396 Thanos5150 21-May-18 01:00
Re: Khafre Causeway 323 Barbelo 21-May-18 02:07
Re: Khafre Causeway 383 Thanos5150 21-May-18 04:17
Re: Khafre Causeway 330 Barbelo 21-May-18 21:12
Re: Khafre Causeway 340 Thanos5150 22-May-18 15:15
Unanswered Questions 310 Barbelo 22-May-18 22:06
Khufu Causeway 707 Barbelo 20-May-18 22:37
Re: Khufu Causeway 371 Thanos5150 21-May-18 04:08
Re: Khufu Causeway 353 Barbelo 22-May-18 04:08
Re: Khufu Causeway 393 DUNE 22-May-18 07:22
Re: Khufu Causeway 552 Thanos5150 22-May-18 14:38
Khufu'S Valley Temple 392 Barbelo 22-May-18 21:22
Re: Khufu'S Valley Temple 489 Thanos5150 23-May-18 02:45
Re: Khufu's Valley Temple 409 Barbelo 23-May-18 23:20
Re: Khufu's Valley Temple 528 Thanos5150 24-May-18 01:11
Re: Khufu's Valley Temple 388 Barbelo 24-May-18 04:11
Re: Khufu's Valley Temple 412 R Avry Wilson 26-May-18 00:41
Re: Khufu'S Valley Temple 412 Thanos5150 28-May-18 04:06
Re: Khufu'S Valley Temple 411 Origyptian 28-May-18 12:10
Re: Khufu'S Valley Temple 428 Thanos5150 29-May-18 03:54
Re: Khufu'S Valley Temple 349 Barbelo 29-May-18 06:20
Re: Khufu'S Valley Temple 360 Thanos5150 29-May-18 21:30
Wall of the Crow 375 Barbelo 29-May-18 22:12
Re: Wall of the Crow 380 Thanos5150 29-May-18 23:31
Re: Wall of the Crow 341 Barbelo 30-May-18 06:10
Re: LOL!.....No copper sheet/water Causeway at Coral Castle : ) 349 Thunderbird 30-May-18 17:41
Re: Wall of the Crow 521 Thanos5150 31-May-18 01:05
Re: Wall of the Crow 425 Barbelo 01-Jun-18 06:58
Re: Khufu'S Valley Temple 345 Corpuscles 29-May-18 22:30
Re: Khufu'S Valley Temple 330 Thanos5150 29-May-18 23:56
Re: Khufu'S Valley Temple 377 Romulus the 2nd 04-Jun-18 11:53
Re: Khufu Causeway 272 Barbelo 22-May-18 21:29
Re: Khufu Causeway 372 Thanos5150 22-May-18 15:22
Re: Khufu Causeway 322 Manu 25-Sep-18 12:43
Re: Khufu Causeway 274 cladking 25-Sep-18 13:30
Re: Khufu Causeway 275 DUNE 25-Sep-18 14:30
Re: Khufu Causeway 284 Spiros 25-Sep-18 14:48
Re: Khufu Causeway 283 Manu 25-Sep-18 15:39
Re: Khufu Causeway 359 DUNE 25-Sep-18 17:07
Re: Khufu Causeway 323 DUNE 25-Sep-18 17:31
Re: Khufu Causeway 283 DUNE 25-Sep-18 19:13
Re: Khufu Causeway 281 cladking 25-Sep-18 19:52
Re: Khufu Causeway 331 DUNE 25-Sep-18 20:22
Re: Khufu Causeway 273 cladking 26-Sep-18 19:23
Re: Khufu Causeway 306 Thanos5150 26-Sep-18 03:02
Practical applications 333 Audrey 27-Sep-18 00:12
Re: Practical applications 339 Thanos5150 27-Sep-18 06:14
Re: Practical applications 376 DUNE 27-Sep-18 08:58
Re: Practical applications 341 cladking 27-Sep-18 13:48
Re: Practical applications 321 Audrey 28-Sep-18 02:46
Re: Practical applications 296 cladking 28-Sep-18 13:07
Re: Practical applications 342 Thanos5150 27-Sep-18 15:51
Re: Practical applications 324 Eddie Larry 27-Sep-18 16:36
Re: Practical applications 262 cladking 27-Sep-18 16:51
Re: Practical applications 291 cladking 27-Sep-18 17:13
Re: Practical applications 271 Eddie Larry 27-Sep-18 20:08
Re: Practical applications 266 Thunderbird 27-Sep-18 21:54
Re: Practical applications 283 Eddie Larry 27-Sep-18 22:07
Re: Practical applications 279 cladking 28-Sep-18 13:17
Re: Practical applications 286 Eddie Larry 28-Sep-18 13:52
Re: Practical applications (and infrastructure) 264 cladking 28-Sep-18 14:08
Re: Practical applications (and infrastructure) 275 Eddie Larry 28-Sep-18 15:20
Re: Practical applications (and infrastructure) 268 cladking 28-Sep-18 15:40
Re: Practical applications (and infrastructure) 262 Eddie Larry 28-Sep-18 18:00
Re: Practical applications (and infrastructure) 270 cladking 28-Sep-18 18:38
Re: Practical applications (and infrastructure) 325 cladking 30-Sep-18 23:41
Re: Practical applications (and infrastructure) 330 Eddie Larry 01-Oct-18 01:51
Re: Practical applications (and infrastructure) 263 cladking 01-Oct-18 02:50
Re: Practical applications 344 Audrey 28-Sep-18 02:25
The First Question 284 Barbelo 25-Sep-18 22:29
Re: The First Question 264 Manu 26-Sep-18 01:28
Re: The First Question 276 Barbelo 26-Sep-18 04:45
Re: The First Question 308 Manu 26-Sep-18 06:31
Re: The First Question 308 Thanos5150 26-Sep-18 16:17
Re: The First Question 290 Barbelo 26-Sep-18 21:48
Re: The First Question 254 Manu 27-Sep-18 03:23
Re: The First Question 273 cladking 27-Sep-18 04:22
Re: The First Question 289 Sirfiroth 27-Sep-18 17:23
"Original" Causeway 345 Barbelo 28-Sep-18 05:51
Re: A Change of Plan, The Trial Passage & That Platform 304 DUNE 28-Sep-18 10:22
Re: A Change of Plan, The Trial Passage & That Platform 356 Barbelo 28-Sep-18 11:48
Re: A Change of Plan, The Trial Passage & That Platform 269 DUNE 28-Sep-18 13:02
Re: A Change of Plan, The Trial Passage & That Platform 320 Barbelo 28-Sep-18 20:32
Re: A Change of Plan, The Trial Passage & That Platform 274 DUNE 28-Sep-18 21:13
Re: A Change of Plan, The Trial Passage & That Platform 286 Barbelo 28-Sep-18 22:34
Re: A Change of Plan, The Trial Passage & That Platform 264 Thanos5150 28-Sep-18 16:25
Re: "Original" Causeway 285 Spiros 28-Sep-18 13:14
Re: The First Question 313 Corpuscles 26-Sep-18 06:41
Re: The First Question 284 DUNE 26-Sep-18 09:16
Re: The First Question 282 Barbelo 26-Sep-18 11:20
Re: The First Question 282 Barbelo 26-Sep-18 11:30
Khafre M.T. floor versus Khufu 307 Manu 26-Sep-18 12:06
Re: Khafre M.T. floor versus Khufu 267 Barbelo 27-Sep-18 06:04
Hetepheres I Boat Pit 297 Barbelo 28-Sep-18 05:13
Re: The First Question 281 Thanos5150 26-Sep-18 01:35
14 Degrees [?] 359 Dr. Troglodyte 22-May-18 14:34
Re: 14 Degrees [?] 364 Barbelo 22-May-18 21:42
Re: 14 Degrees [?] 337 Spiros 23-May-18 11:50
Giza’s Causeways – Proof of Concept Solar Study [Update: 4MAR19] 528 Dr. Troglodyte 23-May-18 16:48
Re: Giza’s Causeways – Proof of Concept Solar Study 372 Spiros 23-May-18 17:49
Re: Giza’s Causeways – Proof of Concept Solar Study 331 Spiros 26-May-18 17:47
what if.. 351 Spiros 27-May-18 02:45
Re: what if.. 304 DUNE 27-May-18 08:32
Re: what if.. 312 Spiros 28-May-18 21:57
Re: Giza’s Causeways – Proof of Concept Solar Study 407 Thanos5150 23-May-18 20:51
Re: Giza’s Causeways – Proof of Concept Solar Study 369 molder 26-May-18 06:31
Khufu’s Causeway - Update 463 Dr. Troglodyte 01-Jun-18 19:48
Re: Khufu’s Causeway - Update 327 Barbelo 02-Jun-18 03:42
Re, the Sun & causeways 210 hendrik dirker 07-Jul-19 05:57
Re: Khufu’s Causeway - Update 189 Spiros 10-Sep-19 13:34
Re: Causeways And The Sun 345 Origyptian 26-May-18 02:47
Re: Causeways And The Sun 432 Barbelo 26-May-18 05:41
Re: Causeways And The Sun 385 Origyptian 26-May-18 11:31
Re: Causeways And The Sun 383 cladking 26-May-18 13:55
Re: Causeways And The Sun 321 Barbelo 26-May-18 20:20
Re: Causeways And The Sun 342 Origyptian 27-May-18 02:37
Re: Causeways And The Sun 349 Barbelo 27-May-18 03:59
Re: Causeways And The Sun 338 Jon Ellison 27-May-18 09:01
Re: Causeways And The Sun 310 Barbelo 27-May-18 11:31
Re: Causeways And The Sun 312 Jon Ellison 27-May-18 11:52
Re: Causeways And The Sun 321 Sirfiroth 27-May-18 13:13
Re: Causeways And The Sun 331 Origyptian 27-May-18 13:32
Re: Causeways And The Sun 332 cladking 27-May-18 13:37
Re: Causeways And The Sun 314 Sirfiroth 28-May-18 01:23
Re: Causeways And The Sun 332 cladking 28-May-18 02:06
Re: Causeways And The Sun 349 Jon Ellison 27-May-18 22:58
Re: Causeways And The Sun 300 Sirfiroth 28-May-18 01:44
Re: Causeways And The Sun 318 Steve Clayton 28-May-18 03:29
Re: Causeways And The Sun 384 Jon Ellison 28-May-18 08:33
Re: Causeways And The Sun 374 Steve Clayton 28-May-18 14:45
Re: Causeways And The Sun 339 Jon Ellison 28-May-18 15:37
Re: Causeways And The Sun 333 Steve Clayton 28-May-18 15:42
Re: Causeways And The Sun 356 Steve Clayton 28-May-18 16:21
Re: Causeways And The Sun 298 Origyptian 29-May-18 13:10
Re: Causeways And The Sun 312 Steve Clayton 29-May-18 15:08
Re: Causeways And The Sun 342 Origyptian 29-May-18 16:18
Re: Causeways And The Sun 330 Sirfiroth 28-May-18 16:38
Re: Causeways And The Sun 318 Steve Clayton 28-May-18 17:08
Re: Causeways And The Sun 322 Sirfiroth 28-May-18 21:01
Re: Causeways And The Sun 321 Eddie Larry 28-May-18 21:11
Re: Causeways And The Sun 304 Steve Clayton 28-May-18 21:38
Re: Causeways And The Sun 310 Sirfiroth 29-May-18 02:07
Re: Causeways And The Sun 306 Eddie Larry 29-May-18 02:38
Re: Causeways And The Sun 310 Sirfiroth 29-May-18 02:36
Re: Causeways And The Sun 318 Jon Ellison 28-May-18 21:37
Re: Causeways And The Sun 310 Steve Clayton 28-May-18 22:29
Re: Causeways And The Sun 295 Steve Clayton 28-May-18 23:09
Re: Causeways And The Sun 351 Jon Ellison 28-May-18 23:58
Re: Causeways And The Sun 312 Sirfiroth 29-May-18 02:23
Re: Causeways And The Sun 354 Eddie Larry 29-May-18 04:07
Re: Causeways And The Sun 300 Origyptian 29-May-18 13:56
Re: Causeways And The Sun 344 Corpuscles 29-May-18 00:51
A Further Degree Of Difficulty 332 Barbelo 29-May-18 02:02
Re: Causeways or Sand? 358 Steve Clayton 29-May-18 04:56
Re: Causeways or Sand? 375 Corpuscles 29-May-18 07:31
Re: Causeways or Sand? 354 Jon Ellison 29-May-18 09:05
Re: Causeways or Sand? 377 Steve Clayton 30-May-18 19:47
Re: Causeways or Sand? 394 Steve Clayton 03-Jun-18 01:06
Re: Causeways or Sand? 335 Origyptian 29-May-18 15:44
Re: Causeways or Sand? 346 Corpuscles 29-May-18 23:31
Re: Causeways or Sand? 353 Steve Clayton 29-May-18 23:59
Re: Causeways or Sand? 325 Corpuscles 30-May-18 03:08
Re: Causeways or Sand? 356 Steve Clayton 30-May-18 04:33
Re: Causeways And The Sun 378 Origyptian 27-May-18 11:58
Re: Causeways And The Sun 330 Barbelo 27-May-18 20:33
Re: Causeways And The Sun 333 Origyptian 28-May-18 01:27
Causeways And Geysers 321 Barbelo 28-May-18 03:09
Divide and Conquer 327 cladking 28-May-18 03:38
Re: Divide and Conquer 302 Origyptian 28-May-18 04:58
Re: Causeways And Geysers 324 Origyptian 28-May-18 04:26
Re: Causeways And Geysers 324 Barbelo 28-May-18 05:38
Re: Causeways And The Sun 303 Origyptian 27-May-18 11:54
Re: Causeways And The Sun 345 Barbelo 27-May-18 21:29
Re: Causeways And The Sun 355 cladking 27-May-18 23:52
Re: Causeways And The Sun 345 Barbelo 27-May-18 23:59
Re: Causeways And The Sun 315 cladking 28-May-18 02:14
Re: Causeways And The Sun 322 Barbelo 28-May-18 03:16
Re: Causeways And The Sun 280 cladking 28-May-18 03:36
Re: Causeways And The Sun 313 Corpuscles 28-May-18 00:35
Re: Causeways And The Sun 300 cladking 28-May-18 02:28
Re: Causeways And The Sun 335 Origyptian 28-May-18 02:15
Re: Causeways And The Sun 376 DUNE 26-May-18 19:33
Re: Causeways And The Sun 333 Sirfiroth 26-May-18 22:05
Pyramids as Gnomons 382 Eddie Larry 26-May-18 20:28
Re: Causeways And The Sun 568 Corpuscles 27-May-18 22:36
Re: Causeways And The Sun 398 Barbelo 28-May-18 00:45
Re: Causeways And The Sun 321 Corpuscles 28-May-18 01:26
Re: Causeways And The Sun 362 Barbelo 28-May-18 03:54
Re: Causeways And The Sun 326 Origyptian 28-May-18 02:31
Re: Causeways And The Sun 304 Barbelo 28-May-18 04:01
Re: Causeways And The Sun 327 Origyptian 28-May-18 05:02
Re: Causeways And The Sun 354 Barbelo 28-May-18 05:56
Re: Causeways And The Sun 324 Origyptian 28-May-18 11:39
Re: Causeways And The Sun 318 cladking 28-May-18 13:52
Re: Causeways And The Sun 323 kborissov 29-May-18 01:45
Re: Causeways And The Sun 307 cladking 29-May-18 13:14
Re: Causeways And The Sun 318 kborissov 30-May-18 02:14
Re: Causeways And The Sun 269 cladking 30-May-18 03:30
Re: Causeways And The Sun 349 Origyptian 29-May-18 14:10
Re: Causeways And The Sun 324 kborissov 29-May-18 21:58
Re: Causeways And The Sun 323 Origyptian 29-May-18 22:02
Re: Causeways And The Sun 349 kborissov 29-May-18 22:26
Re: Causeways And The Sun 348 cladking 01-Oct-18 03:27
Re: Causeways And The Sun 299 Corpuscles 01-Oct-18 05:04
Re: Causeways And The Sun 328 Barbelo 01-Oct-18 06:44
Re: Causeways And The Sun 264 cladking 01-Oct-18 13:07
Re: Causeways And The Sun 430 cladking 01-Oct-18 13:59
Re: Causeways And The Sun 367 Steve Clayton 31-May-18 18:10
Re: Causeways And The Sun 300 Barbelo 31-May-18 22:17
Re: Causeways And The Sun 335 Steve Clayton 01-Jun-18 01:11
Re: Causeways And The Sun 336 Barbelo 01-Jun-18 03:50
Re: Causeways And The Sun 347 Steve Clayton 01-Jun-18 15:43
Re: Causeways And The Sun 285 Barbelo 01-Jun-18 20:08
Re: Causeways And The Sun 368 Steve Clayton 01-Jun-18 20:55
Re: Causeways And The Sun 361 Barbelo 01-Jun-18 22:47
Re: Causeways And The Sun 357 Steve Clayton 01-Jun-18 23:10


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