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Mike D Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Before to answer to you on your point, hereunder
> is a post to Harry Wolf to expose the geological
> question raising about Malta ruts: About 90% of
> them run on the most recent limestone layer, the
> Coralline, whereas they are only a few on older
> and softer limestone layer, namely Globigerina.
> [url=http://grahamhancock.com/phorum/read.php?1,11
> 20291,1124753#msg-1124753]Malta geology and cart
> ruts distribution correspondence[/url]
> And after, please see my answer to Jon to clarify
> my views and state of mind:
> [url=http://grahamhancock.com/phorum/read.php?1,11
> 20291,1124920#msg-1124920]Answer to Jon
> Ellison[/url]
> To me, even if I am not opposed to the theory of
> very, very old imprints on soft clay that turn out
> solid afterwards, I don't think it can apply to
> the case of Malta, altough they must also be old,
> before catastrophes in the Mediterranean, may be
> contemporary of Atlantis, not impossible to me.
> Considering that more wet paleo climate may have
> helped the wear of tracks, I am thinking here to
> Robert Soch claims about the water erosion of
> Gizah Sphinx.
> Now, to answer your question: [quote="Tsurugi
> question:"]
> That said, your observations of quarry features
> around rut "hubs" is very interesting. Question:
> is there anything you noticed that definitely
> makes the quarry features and the ruts
> contemporary?
> [/quote]
> I cannot say definitely, not being a geologist,
> nor a quarry expert. But being an engineer
> familiar with technical and production questions,
> Clapham Junction looked to me a very old (stones
> wear, ground erosion) and well organised quarry.
> In the beginning it seems just to be a mess with
> random "cart ruts". And little by little you begin
> to understand the overall pattern, but it comes
> gradually.
> On the sides of the ruts areas are clear patches
> of rock extraction patterns, but they don't lie
> beside ruts and maybe are younger than ruts. Maybe
> Punic, Greek, Roman.
> But in the end I realized that in ruts areas we
> were walking on man-made artificially levelled
> parallel strips of rocky terrain, all flat (and
> inclined), all of same limited height and width.
> The idea of cutting benches became pregnant. And
> then I realized that they were all crossed by
> parallel cart ruts, and the crossing angle was
> constant. It seem to me that cutting benches were
> following geological sedimentary layers to
> optimize rock quality, whereas ruts direction was
> defined to optimize a constant tracks slope.
> No evidence of course.

Hi Mike..
No Worries..

One of the problems I have with the "Ruts cut by repeated traffic" idea is that where we see genuine cart ruts . Roman etc.. they are usually the result of the vehicles being constricted by a built road, side walls or a natural choke point. Not meandering all over the landscape. It would take the passing of probably hundreds of carts to even begin to define a cart track which could be subsequently followed by more carts. Of course this is entirely understandable in the case of a road or choke point as above.
Question is.. How do the meandering cart tracks on rock get started for others to follow? How did cart number two follow exactly cart number one? and so on until there was something well enough defined to follow.
One of the reasons why I currently think that the ruts are not the result high intensity, repeated traffic on hard stuff.
Rather low frequency traffic on soft stuff that is deliberately trying to avoid previous tracks.. For example driving a 4X4 over a deeply rutted, un-constricted area, you tend to try to stay out of the ruts due to your axle height and ground clearance issues. Resulting in sets of tracks meandering all over the place. The "Ski Resort" effect.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Clapham Junction Malta 1796 Rstevens1701 16-Oct-17 15:26
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 449 Origyptian 16-Oct-17 18:45
this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 352 Racho 16-Oct-17 22:45
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 427 Tsurugi 17-Oct-17 04:55
Not carts. 353 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 07:14
Re: Not carts. 273 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 15:00
Re: Not carts. 255 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 20:17
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 273 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 07:28
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 264 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 08:29
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 243 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 15:08
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 251 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 16:56
ships on land 252 molder 17-Oct-17 22:43
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 211 molder 18-Oct-17 12:22
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 256 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 13:00
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 226 Jon Ellison 18-Oct-17 17:23
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 235 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 18:26
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 245 Jon Ellison 18-Oct-17 19:01
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 192 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:44
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 181 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 05:36
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 312 molder 08-Nov-17 10:34
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 173 Tsurugi 09-Nov-17 05:55
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 217 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 01:53
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 155 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:47
Black Tracks 241 Barbelo 19-Oct-17 01:59
Re: Black Tracks 256 randompHactor 19-Oct-17 02:16
Re: Black Tracks 310 Barbelo 21-Oct-17 00:20
Re: Black Tracks 174 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:51
Turkey Tracks 255 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 22:51
Re: Turkey Tracks 264 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 23:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 213 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 02:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 247 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 02:07
Re: Turkey Tracks 242 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 03:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 235 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 04:22
Re: Turkey Tracks 303 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 05:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 258 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 23:54
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 216 Jon Ellison 19-Oct-17 01:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 183 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 19:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 146 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 04:07
Re: Turkey Tracks 175 Barbelo 07-Nov-17 05:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 200 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 18:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 187 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 19:15
Re: Turkey Tracks 176 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 19:20
Re: Turkey Tracks 191 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 20:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 187 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 20:12
Re: Turkey Tracks 226 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 20:34
Re: Turkey Tracks 200 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 21:21
Re: Turkey Tracks 187 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 22:44
Re: Turkey Tracks 158 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 22:51
Re: Turkey Tracks 255 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 22:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 172 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 23:52
Re: Turkey Tracks 269 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:38
Re: Turkey Tracks 240 Jon Ellison 08-Nov-17 09:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 145 Tsurugi 09-Nov-17 02:40
Re: Turkey Tracks 338 Jon Ellison 09-Nov-17 08:08
Re: Turkey Tracks 246 Tsurugi 25-Nov-17 08:10
Re: Turkey Tracks 185 Mike D 26-Nov-17 16:57
Re: Turkey Tracks 157 Jon Ellison 26-Nov-17 18:08
Re: Turkey Tracks 196 Mike D 27-Nov-17 09:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 218 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:16
Re: Turkey Tracks 168 Barbelo 07-Nov-17 21:26
Re: Turkey Tracks 261 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:46
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 171 Anonymous User 07-Nov-17 22:07
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 288 Mike D 25-Nov-17 13:44
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 200 molder 25-Nov-17 20:51
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 175 Mike D 26-Nov-17 12:46
The Diolkos 170 molder 26-Nov-17 21:36
Re: The Diolkos 170 Mike D 27-Nov-17 10:03
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 202 Mike D 26-Nov-17 13:15
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 173 Tsurugi 27-Nov-17 09:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 180 Mike D 27-Nov-17 10:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 202 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-17 11:07
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 170 Mike D 27-Nov-17 16:27
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 152 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-17 18:32
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 170 Mike D 28-Nov-17 10:05
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 152 Jon Ellison 28-Nov-17 11:03
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 200 Mike D 28-Nov-17 11:09
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 150 Jon Ellison 28-Nov-17 13:43
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 165 Mike D 28-Nov-17 14:55
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 137 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 16:05
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 171 Mike D 28-Nov-17 18:22
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 176 Origyptian 29-Nov-17 03:16
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 271 Mike D 29-Nov-17 09:54
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 194 Origyptian 29-Nov-17 15:06
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 127 Mike D 30-Nov-17 11:25
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 139 Jon Ellison 30-Nov-17 12:41
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 150 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 13:56
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 200 Mike D 30-Nov-17 14:11
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 306 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 15:32
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 156 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 15:49
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 163 Mike D 28-Nov-17 18:28
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 187 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 04:50
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 191 Mike D 28-Nov-17 10:46
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 162 Origyptian 27-Nov-17 15:48
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 275 Mike D 27-Nov-17 16:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 155 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 05:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 182 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:50
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 146 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 15:34
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 196 Mike D 29-Nov-17 18:23
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 164 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 05:15
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 175 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 05:09
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 139 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:44
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 169 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 18:18
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 389 Audrey 28-Nov-17 03:14
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 183 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:39
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 201 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 18:30
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 177 molder 28-Nov-17 21:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 394 molder 18-Nov-17 22:20
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 203 Mike D 23-Nov-17 21:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 194 Mike D 23-Nov-17 21:46
Re: Chariot Tracks on The Streets of Pompeii 153 molder 30-Nov-17 05:22
Re: Chariot Tracks on The Streets of Pompeii 243 Mike D 30-Nov-17 10:59


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