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Mike D Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Before to answer to you on your point, hereunder
> is a post to Harry Wolf to expose the geological
> question raising about Malta ruts: About 90% of
> them run on the most recent limestone layer, the
> Coralline, whereas they are only a few on older
> and softer limestone layer, namely Globigerina.
> [url=http://grahamhancock.com/phorum/read.php?1,11
> 20291,1124753#msg-1124753]Malta geology and cart
> ruts distribution correspondence[/url]
> And after, please see my answer to Jon to clarify
> my views and state of mind:
> [url=http://grahamhancock.com/phorum/read.php?1,11
> 20291,1124920#msg-1124920]Answer to Jon
> Ellison[/url]
> To me, even if I am not opposed to the theory of
> very, very old imprints on soft clay that turn out
> solid afterwards, I don't think it can apply to
> the case of Malta, altough they must also be old,
> before catastrophes in the Mediterranean, may be
> contemporary of Atlantis, not impossible to me.
> Considering that more wet paleo climate may have
> helped the wear of tracks, I am thinking here to
> Robert Soch claims about the water erosion of
> Gizah Sphinx.
> Now, to answer your question: [quote="Tsurugi
> question:"]
> That said, your observations of quarry features
> around rut "hubs" is very interesting. Question:
> is there anything you noticed that definitely
> makes the quarry features and the ruts
> contemporary?
> [/quote]
> I cannot say definitely, not being a geologist,
> nor a quarry expert. But being an engineer
> familiar with technical and production questions,
> Clapham Junction looked to me a very old (stones
> wear, ground erosion) and well organised quarry.
> In the beginning it seems just to be a mess with
> random "cart ruts". And little by little you begin
> to understand the overall pattern, but it comes
> gradually.
> On the sides of the ruts areas are clear patches
> of rock extraction patterns, but they don't lie
> beside ruts and maybe are younger than ruts. Maybe
> Punic, Greek, Roman.
> But in the end I realized that in ruts areas we
> were walking on man-made artificially levelled
> parallel strips of rocky terrain, all flat (and
> inclined), all of same limited height and width.
> The idea of cutting benches became pregnant. And
> then I realized that they were all crossed by
> parallel cart ruts, and the crossing angle was
> constant. It seem to me that cutting benches were
> following geological sedimentary layers to
> optimize rock quality, whereas ruts direction was
> defined to optimize a constant tracks slope.
> No evidence of course.

Hi Mike..
No Worries..

One of the problems I have with the "Ruts cut by repeated traffic" idea is that where we see genuine cart ruts . Roman etc.. they are usually the result of the vehicles being constricted by a built road, side walls or a natural choke point. Not meandering all over the landscape. It would take the passing of probably hundreds of carts to even begin to define a cart track which could be subsequently followed by more carts. Of course this is entirely understandable in the case of a road or choke point as above.
Question is.. How do the meandering cart tracks on rock get started for others to follow? How did cart number two follow exactly cart number one? and so on until there was something well enough defined to follow.
One of the reasons why I currently think that the ruts are not the result high intensity, repeated traffic on hard stuff.
Rather low frequency traffic on soft stuff that is deliberately trying to avoid previous tracks.. For example driving a 4X4 over a deeply rutted, un-constricted area, you tend to try to stay out of the ruts due to your axle height and ground clearance issues. Resulting in sets of tracks meandering all over the place. The "Ski Resort" effect.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Clapham Junction Malta 1913 Rstevens1701 16-Oct-17 15:26
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 520 Origyptian 16-Oct-17 18:45
this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 391 Racho 16-Oct-17 22:45
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 490 Tsurugi 17-Oct-17 04:55
Not carts. 400 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 07:14
Re: Not carts. 326 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 15:00
Re: Not carts. 304 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 20:17
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 316 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 07:28
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 314 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 08:29
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 274 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 15:08
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 295 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 16:56
ships on land 291 molder 17-Oct-17 22:43
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 247 molder 18-Oct-17 12:22
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 303 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 13:00
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 274 Jon Ellison 18-Oct-17 17:23
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 275 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 18:26
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 281 Jon Ellison 18-Oct-17 19:01
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 236 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:44
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 221 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 05:36
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 341 molder 08-Nov-17 10:34
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 202 Tsurugi 09-Nov-17 05:55
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 254 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 01:53
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 204 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:47
Black Tracks 294 Barbelo 19-Oct-17 01:59
Re: Black Tracks 302 randompHactor 19-Oct-17 02:16
Re: Black Tracks 355 Barbelo 21-Oct-17 00:20
Re: Black Tracks 204 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:51
Turkey Tracks 303 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 22:51
Re: Turkey Tracks 322 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 23:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 243 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 02:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 285 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 02:07
Re: Turkey Tracks 289 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 03:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 275 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 04:22
Re: Turkey Tracks 352 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 05:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 330 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 23:54
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 258 Jon Ellison 19-Oct-17 01:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 237 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 19:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 187 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 04:07
Re: Turkey Tracks 205 Barbelo 07-Nov-17 05:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 236 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 18:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 221 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 19:15
Re: Turkey Tracks 208 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 19:20
Re: Turkey Tracks 223 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 20:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 229 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 20:12
Re: Turkey Tracks 276 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 20:34
Re: Turkey Tracks 239 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 21:21
Re: Turkey Tracks 225 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 22:44
Re: Turkey Tracks 201 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 22:51
Re: Turkey Tracks 337 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 22:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 222 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 23:52
Re: Turkey Tracks 307 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:38
Re: Turkey Tracks 273 Jon Ellison 08-Nov-17 09:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 200 Tsurugi 09-Nov-17 02:40
Re: Turkey Tracks 387 Jon Ellison 09-Nov-17 08:08
Re: Turkey Tracks 286 Tsurugi 25-Nov-17 08:10
Re: Turkey Tracks 231 Mike D 26-Nov-17 16:57
Re: Turkey Tracks 191 Jon Ellison 26-Nov-17 18:08
Re: Turkey Tracks 262 Mike D 27-Nov-17 09:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 249 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:16
Re: Turkey Tracks 215 Barbelo 07-Nov-17 21:26
Re: Turkey Tracks 300 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:46
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 216 Anonymous User 07-Nov-17 22:07
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 340 Mike D 25-Nov-17 13:44
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 232 molder 25-Nov-17 20:51
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 218 Mike D 26-Nov-17 12:46
The Diolkos 202 molder 26-Nov-17 21:36
Re: The Diolkos 205 Mike D 27-Nov-17 10:03
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 251 Mike D 26-Nov-17 13:15
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 215 Tsurugi 27-Nov-17 09:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 221 Mike D 27-Nov-17 10:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 244 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-17 11:07
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 232 Mike D 27-Nov-17 16:27
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 216 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-17 18:32
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 203 Mike D 28-Nov-17 10:05
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 200 Jon Ellison 28-Nov-17 11:03
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 237 Mike D 28-Nov-17 11:09
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 195 Jon Ellison 28-Nov-17 13:43
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 209 Mike D 28-Nov-17 14:55
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 173 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 16:05
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 203 Mike D 28-Nov-17 18:22
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 214 Origyptian 29-Nov-17 03:16
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 312 Mike D 29-Nov-17 09:54
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 235 Origyptian 29-Nov-17 15:06
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 161 Mike D 30-Nov-17 11:25
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 179 Jon Ellison 30-Nov-17 12:41
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 180 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 13:56
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 252 Mike D 30-Nov-17 14:11
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 354 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 15:32
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 199 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 15:49
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 196 Mike D 28-Nov-17 18:28
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 231 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 04:50
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 228 Mike D 28-Nov-17 10:46
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 200 Origyptian 27-Nov-17 15:48
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 334 Mike D 27-Nov-17 16:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 199 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 05:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 224 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:50
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 189 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 15:34
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 234 Mike D 29-Nov-17 18:23
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 194 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 05:15
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 212 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 05:09
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 191 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:44
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 222 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 18:18
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 481 Audrey 28-Nov-17 03:14
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 220 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:39
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 243 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 18:30
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 223 molder 28-Nov-17 21:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 449 molder 18-Nov-17 22:20
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 248 Mike D 23-Nov-17 21:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 228 Mike D 23-Nov-17 21:46
Re: Chariot Tracks on The Streets of Pompeii 211 molder 30-Nov-17 05:22
Re: Chariot Tracks on The Streets of Pompeii 272 Mike D 30-Nov-17 10:59


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