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Mike D Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Before to answer to you on your point, hereunder
> is a post to Harry Wolf to expose the geological
> question raising about Malta ruts: About 90% of
> them run on the most recent limestone layer, the
> Coralline, whereas they are only a few on older
> and softer limestone layer, namely Globigerina.
> [url=http://grahamhancock.com/phorum/read.php?1,11
> 20291,1124753#msg-1124753]Malta geology and cart
> ruts distribution correspondence[/url]
> And after, please see my answer to Jon to clarify
> my views and state of mind:
> [url=http://grahamhancock.com/phorum/read.php?1,11
> 20291,1124920#msg-1124920]Answer to Jon
> Ellison[/url]
> To me, even if I am not opposed to the theory of
> very, very old imprints on soft clay that turn out
> solid afterwards, I don't think it can apply to
> the case of Malta, altough they must also be old,
> before catastrophes in the Mediterranean, may be
> contemporary of Atlantis, not impossible to me.
> Considering that more wet paleo climate may have
> helped the wear of tracks, I am thinking here to
> Robert Soch claims about the water erosion of
> Gizah Sphinx.
> Now, to answer your question: [quote="Tsurugi
> question:"]
> That said, your observations of quarry features
> around rut "hubs" is very interesting. Question:
> is there anything you noticed that definitely
> makes the quarry features and the ruts
> contemporary?
> [/quote]
> I cannot say definitely, not being a geologist,
> nor a quarry expert. But being an engineer
> familiar with technical and production questions,
> Clapham Junction looked to me a very old (stones
> wear, ground erosion) and well organised quarry.
> In the beginning it seems just to be a mess with
> random "cart ruts". And little by little you begin
> to understand the overall pattern, but it comes
> gradually.
> On the sides of the ruts areas are clear patches
> of rock extraction patterns, but they don't lie
> beside ruts and maybe are younger than ruts. Maybe
> Punic, Greek, Roman.
> But in the end I realized that in ruts areas we
> were walking on man-made artificially levelled
> parallel strips of rocky terrain, all flat (and
> inclined), all of same limited height and width.
> The idea of cutting benches became pregnant. And
> then I realized that they were all crossed by
> parallel cart ruts, and the crossing angle was
> constant. It seem to me that cutting benches were
> following geological sedimentary layers to
> optimize rock quality, whereas ruts direction was
> defined to optimize a constant tracks slope.
> No evidence of course.

Hi Mike..
No Worries..

One of the problems I have with the "Ruts cut by repeated traffic" idea is that where we see genuine cart ruts . Roman etc.. they are usually the result of the vehicles being constricted by a built road, side walls or a natural choke point. Not meandering all over the landscape. It would take the passing of probably hundreds of carts to even begin to define a cart track which could be subsequently followed by more carts. Of course this is entirely understandable in the case of a road or choke point as above.
Question is.. How do the meandering cart tracks on rock get started for others to follow? How did cart number two follow exactly cart number one? and so on until there was something well enough defined to follow.
One of the reasons why I currently think that the ruts are not the result high intensity, repeated traffic on hard stuff.
Rather low frequency traffic on soft stuff that is deliberately trying to avoid previous tracks.. For example driving a 4X4 over a deeply rutted, un-constricted area, you tend to try to stay out of the ruts due to your axle height and ground clearance issues. Resulting in sets of tracks meandering all over the place. The "Ski Resort" effect.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Clapham Junction Malta 1865 Rstevens1701 16-Oct-17 15:26
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 500 Origyptian 16-Oct-17 18:45
this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 379 Racho 16-Oct-17 22:45
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 456 Tsurugi 17-Oct-17 04:55
Not carts. 377 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 07:14
Re: Not carts. 302 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 15:00
Re: Not carts. 279 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 20:17
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 305 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 07:28
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 293 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 08:29
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 263 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 15:08
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 276 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 16:56
ships on land 275 molder 17-Oct-17 22:43
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 232 molder 18-Oct-17 12:22
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 284 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 13:00
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 249 Jon Ellison 18-Oct-17 17:23
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 254 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 18:26
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 270 Jon Ellison 18-Oct-17 19:01
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 217 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:44
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 208 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 05:36
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 333 molder 08-Nov-17 10:34
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 192 Tsurugi 09-Nov-17 05:55
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 239 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 01:53
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 181 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:47
Black Tracks 266 Barbelo 19-Oct-17 01:59
Re: Black Tracks 281 randompHactor 19-Oct-17 02:16
Re: Black Tracks 334 Barbelo 21-Oct-17 00:20
Re: Black Tracks 195 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:51
Turkey Tracks 290 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 22:51
Re: Turkey Tracks 297 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 23:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 232 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 02:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 270 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 02:07
Re: Turkey Tracks 266 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 03:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 265 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 04:22
Re: Turkey Tracks 342 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 05:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 289 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 23:54
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 244 Jon Ellison 19-Oct-17 01:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 206 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 19:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 171 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 04:07
Re: Turkey Tracks 195 Barbelo 07-Nov-17 05:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 220 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 18:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 209 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 19:15
Re: Turkey Tracks 198 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 19:20
Re: Turkey Tracks 212 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 20:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 205 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 20:12
Re: Turkey Tracks 255 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 20:34
Re: Turkey Tracks 224 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 21:21
Re: Turkey Tracks 213 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 22:44
Re: Turkey Tracks 178 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 22:51
Re: Turkey Tracks 306 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 22:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 198 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 23:52
Re: Turkey Tracks 294 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:38
Re: Turkey Tracks 261 Jon Ellison 08-Nov-17 09:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 175 Tsurugi 09-Nov-17 02:40
Re: Turkey Tracks 371 Jon Ellison 09-Nov-17 08:08
Re: Turkey Tracks 268 Tsurugi 25-Nov-17 08:10
Re: Turkey Tracks 211 Mike D 26-Nov-17 16:57
Re: Turkey Tracks 181 Jon Ellison 26-Nov-17 18:08
Re: Turkey Tracks 235 Mike D 27-Nov-17 09:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 240 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:16
Re: Turkey Tracks 195 Barbelo 07-Nov-17 21:26
Re: Turkey Tracks 280 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:46
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 206 Anonymous User 07-Nov-17 22:07
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 321 Mike D 25-Nov-17 13:44
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 221 molder 25-Nov-17 20:51
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 196 Mike D 26-Nov-17 12:46
The Diolkos 190 molder 26-Nov-17 21:36
Re: The Diolkos 194 Mike D 27-Nov-17 10:03
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 237 Mike D 26-Nov-17 13:15
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 205 Tsurugi 27-Nov-17 09:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 201 Mike D 27-Nov-17 10:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 224 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-17 11:07
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 198 Mike D 27-Nov-17 16:27
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 185 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-17 18:32
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 191 Mike D 28-Nov-17 10:05
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 179 Jon Ellison 28-Nov-17 11:03
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 225 Mike D 28-Nov-17 11:09
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 173 Jon Ellison 28-Nov-17 13:43
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 186 Mike D 28-Nov-17 14:55
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 159 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 16:05
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 190 Mike D 28-Nov-17 18:22
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 201 Origyptian 29-Nov-17 03:16
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 294 Mike D 29-Nov-17 09:54
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 215 Origyptian 29-Nov-17 15:06
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 148 Mike D 30-Nov-17 11:25
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 169 Jon Ellison 30-Nov-17 12:41
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 167 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 13:56
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 227 Mike D 30-Nov-17 14:11
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 336 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 15:32
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 182 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 15:49
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 187 Mike D 28-Nov-17 18:28
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 212 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 04:50
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 217 Mike D 28-Nov-17 10:46
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 188 Origyptian 27-Nov-17 15:48
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 322 Mike D 27-Nov-17 16:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 177 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 05:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 202 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:50
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 169 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 15:34
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 222 Mike D 29-Nov-17 18:23
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 182 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 05:15
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 196 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 05:09
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 169 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:44
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 201 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 18:18
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 438 Audrey 28-Nov-17 03:14
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 206 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:39
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 226 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 18:30
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 208 molder 28-Nov-17 21:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 431 molder 18-Nov-17 22:20
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 227 Mike D 23-Nov-17 21:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 216 Mike D 23-Nov-17 21:46
Re: Chariot Tracks on The Streets of Pompeii 189 molder 30-Nov-17 05:22
Re: Chariot Tracks on The Streets of Pompeii 261 Mike D 30-Nov-17 10:59


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