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Origyptian Wrote:
---
> Their hypothesis is that the limestone softens
> when it gets wet so that carts using the exact
> same path will eventually cut into the bedrock
> leaving those tracks. And when the track gets too
> deep to continue using, another path is chosen,
> which itself eventually gets worn into a track,
> etc.

Yes that is a popular hypothesis, but it only works if you sort of squint at it while it's at the edge of your peripheral vision and you don't look too long (imo).

As soon as I start thinking about that hypothesis, the first question I have is, if the passage of the carts can dig ruts in limestone up to three feet deep, where are the tracks of the beasts of burden being used to pull the carts? I mentioned this in my initial post, and Jon asked it a few replies back. It is a good question; the answer is that there are no corresponding animal tracks between the ruts. Sometimes there are irregularities between a given set of ruts that might be tracks of some kind, however, these tracks(if that is what these irregularities are) are so heavily degraded that it is impossible to tell what they are. And they only appear in short stretches between a given set of ruts.

Next question, how did large-wheeled fixed-axle carts actually move along these ruts? They are too deep, too narrow. Going into a turn would break the wheels and probably snap the axle. At the very least, the cart would get jammed and be unable to move

Next question, what about the ruts that are 10-12 inches across each rut? They are too uniform to be anything but ruts made by wheels that are in fact close to the width indicated by the ruts. AFAIK wheels stayed rail-thin until the advent of inflated tires. The "limestone softened by rain" hypothesis doesn't really work if wheels have to somehow cut channels much wider than they are, with a relatively stable and uniform cross-section.

Next question, what about the ruts in rock other than limestone?

Next question, what about ruts that go right over cliff edges, or down beneath sea level? Remember that on Malta at least, human occupation is not supposed to begin until the Neolithic period, long after any major sea level rises have taken place. And how long exactly does it take, how many passes would it require, for the wooden wheels of a cart to cut deeply into stone? A hundred thousand passes? A million? It makes me suspicious that this idea is tossed out there as a tentative hypothesis, but no one seems keen to actually test it, you know, by setting up something fairly simple so that wooden cart wheels with heavy loads on them roll back and forth across limestone kept wet with a sprinkler or something to see if we can actually produce a rut this way. Instead, what we see is that the tentative hypothesis, after being unchallenged for a certain amount of time, begins to be referred to as fact.

I live on a limestone plateau. No wooden wheel ever cut into any limestone, if you ask me :)


P. S. I am arguing against the hypothesis, not Origyptian.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Clapham Junction Malta 1645 Rstevens1701 16-Oct-17 15:26
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 370 Origyptian 16-Oct-17 18:45
this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 301 Racho 16-Oct-17 22:45
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 347 Tsurugi 17-Oct-17 04:55
Not carts. 297 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 07:14
Re: Not carts. 210 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 15:00
Re: Not carts. 209 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 20:17
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 214 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 07:28
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 211 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 08:29
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 202 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 15:08
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 204 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 16:56
ships on land 200 molder 17-Oct-17 22:43
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 170 molder 18-Oct-17 12:22
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 199 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 13:00
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 179 Jon Ellison 18-Oct-17 17:23
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 185 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 18:26
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 186 Jon Ellison 18-Oct-17 19:01
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 141 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:44
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 136 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 05:36
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 269 molder 08-Nov-17 10:34
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 133 Tsurugi 09-Nov-17 05:55
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 172 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 01:53
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 107 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:47
Black Tracks 189 Barbelo 19-Oct-17 01:59
Re: Black Tracks 196 randompHactor 19-Oct-17 02:16
Re: Black Tracks 247 Barbelo 21-Oct-17 00:20
Re: Black Tracks 136 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:51
Turkey Tracks 218 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 22:51
Re: Turkey Tracks 222 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 23:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 179 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 02:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 196 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 02:07
Re: Turkey Tracks 194 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 03:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 181 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 04:22
Re: Turkey Tracks 254 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 05:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 216 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 23:54
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 160 Jon Ellison 19-Oct-17 01:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 134 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 19:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 102 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 04:07
Re: Turkey Tracks 134 Barbelo 07-Nov-17 05:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 141 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 18:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 140 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 19:15
Re: Turkey Tracks 135 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 19:20
Re: Turkey Tracks 139 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 20:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 132 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 20:12
Re: Turkey Tracks 141 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 20:34
Re: Turkey Tracks 151 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 21:21
Re: Turkey Tracks 144 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 22:44
Re: Turkey Tracks 117 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 22:51
Re: Turkey Tracks 170 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 22:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 129 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 23:52
Re: Turkey Tracks 206 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:38
Re: Turkey Tracks 196 Jon Ellison 08-Nov-17 09:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 105 Tsurugi 09-Nov-17 02:40
Re: Turkey Tracks 258 Jon Ellison 09-Nov-17 08:08
Re: Turkey Tracks 171 Tsurugi 25-Nov-17 08:10
Re: Turkey Tracks 128 Mike D 26-Nov-17 16:57
Re: Turkey Tracks 108 Jon Ellison 26-Nov-17 18:08
Re: Turkey Tracks 137 Mike D 27-Nov-17 09:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 172 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:16
Re: Turkey Tracks 114 Barbelo 07-Nov-17 21:26
Re: Turkey Tracks 214 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:46
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 130 Anonymous User 07-Nov-17 22:07
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 205 Mike D 25-Nov-17 13:44
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 153 molder 25-Nov-17 20:51
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 126 Mike D 26-Nov-17 12:46
The Diolkos 130 molder 26-Nov-17 21:36
Re: The Diolkos 121 Mike D 27-Nov-17 10:03
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 140 Mike D 26-Nov-17 13:15
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 116 Tsurugi 27-Nov-17 09:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 129 Mike D 27-Nov-17 10:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 153 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-17 11:07
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 111 Mike D 27-Nov-17 16:27
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 107 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-17 18:32
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 116 Mike D 28-Nov-17 10:05
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 103 Jon Ellison 28-Nov-17 11:03
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 136 Mike D 28-Nov-17 11:09
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 105 Jon Ellison 28-Nov-17 13:43
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 105 Mike D 28-Nov-17 14:55
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 95 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 16:05
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 119 Mike D 28-Nov-17 18:22
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 124 Origyptian 29-Nov-17 03:16
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 198 Mike D 29-Nov-17 09:54
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 141 Origyptian 29-Nov-17 15:06
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 76 Mike D 30-Nov-17 11:25
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 89 Jon Ellison 30-Nov-17 12:41
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 104 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 13:56
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 139 Mike D 30-Nov-17 14:11
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 240 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 15:32
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 105 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 15:49
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 109 Mike D 28-Nov-17 18:28
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 123 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 04:50
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 133 Mike D 28-Nov-17 10:46
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 117 Origyptian 27-Nov-17 15:48
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 193 Mike D 27-Nov-17 16:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 102 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 05:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 134 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:50
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 100 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 15:34
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 141 Mike D 29-Nov-17 18:23
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 107 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 05:15
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 115 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 05:09
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 95 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:44
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 100 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 18:18
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 283 Audrey 28-Nov-17 03:14
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 123 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:39
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 134 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 18:30
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 119 molder 28-Nov-17 21:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 292 molder 18-Nov-17 22:20
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 153 Mike D 23-Nov-17 21:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 140 Mike D 23-Nov-17 21:46
Re: Chariot Tracks on The Streets of Pompeii 98 molder 30-Nov-17 05:22
Re: Chariot Tracks on The Streets of Pompeii 176 Mike D 30-Nov-17 10:59


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