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Origyptian Wrote:
---
> Their hypothesis is that the limestone softens
> when it gets wet so that carts using the exact
> same path will eventually cut into the bedrock
> leaving those tracks. And when the track gets too
> deep to continue using, another path is chosen,
> which itself eventually gets worn into a track,
> etc.

Yes that is a popular hypothesis, but it only works if you sort of squint at it while it's at the edge of your peripheral vision and you don't look too long (imo).

As soon as I start thinking about that hypothesis, the first question I have is, if the passage of the carts can dig ruts in limestone up to three feet deep, where are the tracks of the beasts of burden being used to pull the carts? I mentioned this in my initial post, and Jon asked it a few replies back. It is a good question; the answer is that there are no corresponding animal tracks between the ruts. Sometimes there are irregularities between a given set of ruts that might be tracks of some kind, however, these tracks(if that is what these irregularities are) are so heavily degraded that it is impossible to tell what they are. And they only appear in short stretches between a given set of ruts.

Next question, how did large-wheeled fixed-axle carts actually move along these ruts? They are too deep, too narrow. Going into a turn would break the wheels and probably snap the axle. At the very least, the cart would get jammed and be unable to move

Next question, what about the ruts that are 10-12 inches across each rut? They are too uniform to be anything but ruts made by wheels that are in fact close to the width indicated by the ruts. AFAIK wheels stayed rail-thin until the advent of inflated tires. The "limestone softened by rain" hypothesis doesn't really work if wheels have to somehow cut channels much wider than they are, with a relatively stable and uniform cross-section.

Next question, what about the ruts in rock other than limestone?

Next question, what about ruts that go right over cliff edges, or down beneath sea level? Remember that on Malta at least, human occupation is not supposed to begin until the Neolithic period, long after any major sea level rises have taken place. And how long exactly does it take, how many passes would it require, for the wooden wheels of a cart to cut deeply into stone? A hundred thousand passes? A million? It makes me suspicious that this idea is tossed out there as a tentative hypothesis, but no one seems keen to actually test it, you know, by setting up something fairly simple so that wooden cart wheels with heavy loads on them roll back and forth across limestone kept wet with a sprinkler or something to see if we can actually produce a rut this way. Instead, what we see is that the tentative hypothesis, after being unchallenged for a certain amount of time, begins to be referred to as fact.

I live on a limestone plateau. No wooden wheel ever cut into any limestone, if you ask me :)


P. S. I am arguing against the hypothesis, not Origyptian.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Clapham Junction Malta 1688 Rstevens1701 16-Oct-17 15:26
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 398 Origyptian 16-Oct-17 18:45
this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 316 Racho 16-Oct-17 22:45
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 375 Tsurugi 17-Oct-17 04:55
Not carts. 317 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 07:14
Re: Not carts. 229 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 15:00
Re: Not carts. 223 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 20:17
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 231 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 07:28
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 228 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 08:29
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 218 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 15:08
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 217 Jon Ellison 17-Oct-17 16:56
ships on land 218 molder 17-Oct-17 22:43
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 183 molder 18-Oct-17 12:22
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 214 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 13:00
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 193 Jon Ellison 18-Oct-17 17:23
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 205 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 18:26
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 204 Jon Ellison 18-Oct-17 19:01
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 157 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:44
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 152 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 05:36
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 284 molder 08-Nov-17 10:34
Re: ships on land thousands of slaves dug tracks at corinth 147 Tsurugi 09-Nov-17 05:55
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 187 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 01:53
Re: this is at odds with Newearth/Russian scientist findings/conclusions 125 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:47
Black Tracks 206 Barbelo 19-Oct-17 01:59
Re: Black Tracks 213 randompHactor 19-Oct-17 02:16
Re: Black Tracks 268 Barbelo 21-Oct-17 00:20
Re: Black Tracks 146 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 03:51
Turkey Tracks 231 Barbelo 17-Oct-17 22:51
Re: Turkey Tracks 236 Origyptian 17-Oct-17 23:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 193 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 02:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 211 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 02:07
Re: Turkey Tracks 209 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 03:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 197 Origyptian 18-Oct-17 04:22
Re: Turkey Tracks 271 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 05:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 233 Barbelo 18-Oct-17 23:54
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 172 Jon Ellison 19-Oct-17 01:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 2 146 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 19:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 117 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 04:07
Re: Turkey Tracks 145 Barbelo 07-Nov-17 05:00
Re: Turkey Tracks 156 Tsurugi 07-Nov-17 18:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 153 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 19:15
Re: Turkey Tracks 148 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 19:20
Re: Turkey Tracks 154 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 20:03
Re: Turkey Tracks 151 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 20:12
Re: Turkey Tracks 155 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 20:34
Re: Turkey Tracks 165 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 21:21
Re: Turkey Tracks 159 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 22:44
Re: Turkey Tracks 131 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 22:51
Re: Turkey Tracks 190 Origyptian 07-Nov-17 22:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 142 Jon Ellison 07-Nov-17 23:52
Re: Turkey Tracks 226 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:38
Re: Turkey Tracks 210 Jon Ellison 08-Nov-17 09:58
Re: Turkey Tracks 121 Tsurugi 09-Nov-17 02:40
Re: Turkey Tracks 279 Jon Ellison 09-Nov-17 08:08
Re: Turkey Tracks 195 Tsurugi 25-Nov-17 08:10
Re: Turkey Tracks 146 Mike D 26-Nov-17 16:57
Re: Turkey Tracks 121 Jon Ellison 26-Nov-17 18:08
Re: Turkey Tracks 157 Mike D 27-Nov-17 09:47
Re: Turkey Tracks 189 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:16
Re: Turkey Tracks 133 Barbelo 07-Nov-17 21:26
Re: Turkey Tracks 227 Tsurugi 08-Nov-17 08:46
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 145 Anonymous User 07-Nov-17 22:07
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 224 Mike D 25-Nov-17 13:44
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 167 molder 25-Nov-17 20:51
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 140 Mike D 26-Nov-17 12:46
The Diolkos 142 molder 26-Nov-17 21:36
Re: The Diolkos 137 Mike D 27-Nov-17 10:03
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 154 Mike D 26-Nov-17 13:15
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 135 Tsurugi 27-Nov-17 09:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 148 Mike D 27-Nov-17 10:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 170 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-17 11:07
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 129 Mike D 27-Nov-17 16:27
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 120 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-17 18:32
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 133 Mike D 28-Nov-17 10:05
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 117 Jon Ellison 28-Nov-17 11:03
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 150 Mike D 28-Nov-17 11:09
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 121 Jon Ellison 28-Nov-17 13:43
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 119 Mike D 28-Nov-17 14:55
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 107 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 16:05
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 135 Mike D 28-Nov-17 18:22
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 142 Origyptian 29-Nov-17 03:16
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 221 Mike D 29-Nov-17 09:54
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 157 Origyptian 29-Nov-17 15:06
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 90 Mike D 30-Nov-17 11:25
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 102 Jon Ellison 30-Nov-17 12:41
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 122 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 13:56
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 152 Mike D 30-Nov-17 14:11
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 264 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 15:32
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 122 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 15:49
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 124 Mike D 28-Nov-17 18:28
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 142 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 04:50
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 152 Mike D 28-Nov-17 10:46
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 129 Origyptian 27-Nov-17 15:48
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 218 Mike D 27-Nov-17 16:40
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 120 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 05:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 148 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:50
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 118 Origyptian 28-Nov-17 15:34
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 158 Mike D 29-Nov-17 18:23
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 128 Origyptian 30-Nov-17 05:15
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 134 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 05:09
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 107 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:44
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 121 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 18:18
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 315 Audrey 28-Nov-17 03:14
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 138 Mike D 28-Nov-17 09:39
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 152 Tsurugi 28-Nov-17 18:30
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 137 molder 28-Nov-17 21:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 331 molder 18-Nov-17 22:20
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 169 Mike D 23-Nov-17 21:35
Re: Clapham Junction Malta 157 Mike D 23-Nov-17 21:46
Re: Chariot Tracks on The Streets of Pompeii 112 molder 30-Nov-17 05:22
Re: Chariot Tracks on The Streets of Pompeii 198 Mike D 30-Nov-17 10:59


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