Mysteries :  The Official GrahamHancock.com forums
For serious discussion of the controversies, approaches and enigmas surrounding the origins and development of the human species and of human civilization. (NB: for more ‘out there’ posts we point you in the direction of the ‘Paranormal & Supernatural’ Message Board). 
Welcome! Log InRegister
Hi Thanos / Lee

Maybe take a little chill pill? It seemed like a somewhat aggressive request.
It was clear Merrell (note She) was merely briefly addressing some rather outrageous claims made by the OP.

Thanos5150 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Merrell Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > The crew-marks in the relieving chambers
> > incorporate the name of Khufu, and are
> connected with the placement of stone blocks that came
> from various quarries
>
> > The pyramid was built in the time of Khufu,
> using technology adequate for the task.

>
> What the quarry marks show is that Khufu was
> involved in the construction process at the very
> least at and to some extent beyond the RC, not
> that he originated the project or even completed
> it.
>
> Tell me how I'm wrong Merrell.

In isolation the quarry marks do only establish that fact. there being some considerable corroborating stuff
However, the contrary or any elaboration of such , of a pre existing structure, is merely speculation or conjecture.

It seems as you wish to discuss the elaboration?
M Stower also provided a very brief statement addressed to the OP that might be worthy of your consideration.

Anyway, over the years I am aware that you have speculated that perhaps some original older structure of some sort was placed on the site of G1.

I am inclined both previously (and still) to consider there might be some valid basis for such speculation.
Not limited to, but including, other points you have raised long ago such as:

Indication that
- Djosers Step pyramid shows almost indisputable signs (evidence) of staged development or enhancement.
- G3 has somewhat similar but less extensive indications
- Almost un disputed that Meidum supposedly Snefru's first effort, clearly at some stage was further developed.
- There are others like Bent (maybe, but maybe not).

In order to challenge Merrell's statement concerning G1 - have you got any evidence or reason to positively endorse such speculation that there was some original structure?

If so, what sort of pre existing structure?
Do you think some form of mastaba centered around the remnant plateau solid rock mound? Perhaps an earlier smaller stepped pyramidical structure? What about a Mesopotamian style smaller Ziggurat?
What?*

In contemplating such possibility one of two possible indicators would be the make up of G1's
ascending passage. It hardly could have escaped your notice the elaborate colourful 3D drawings made by and offered by Jon Ellison. They somewhat indicate to me a compacted rubble fill core, which is unlike even the more external rubble fill exposed by Col Vyse (ok reckless blasting ) on the South side of G1. However I disagree with Jon in that he presents it as a regular rectangular profile of VERY faint joint marks on a very eroded or damaged roundish profile shape. Joints that were hard to detect or identify as early as Edgar Bros detailed survey but almost exactly copied by M & R later.

So referring to whatever you believe existed* It is clear that any such original structure could only rise to the level of QC before and speculated renovation and enhancement by Khufu. It would be somewhat ridiculous to suggest higher but perhaps as a total height of KC. Not including the series of RC's.
Perhaps you think something like the shrine type top as is speculated on Ziggurats ? or sometimes atop Sth American pyramid structures?

The introduction of granite occurs at KC level. It as you know contains and the RC's the most amazing sized 60-80 ton granite slabs and no primitive builder put them there. If we concede they did???? then later the RC's were total sealed and enclosed and includes the writing which conclusively indicates Khufu. It is found totally sealed could not possibly have been intrusively transported via any known opening of G1. Even side sealing limestone blocks.
Thereafter whatever structure you or I imagine was embellished from either 50 metres or so height for a further height of 89 metres. The most scary and difficult (albeit not the most quantity) BUT quality finishing job. Then cased the project and enclosed it uber quality . HIGHEST TECHNOLOGY or craftsmanship!

Did it get finished before his death. You know more about AE than I, and would/ ought/ certainly be aware of such basis for the conjecture. Particularly possible touches by son Djedefre.
Not only that but the engineering marvel of a incredibly square base (casing/socket) and the incredible mind numbing orientation due North pole was obvious completed by Khufu!

Tell me where I am wrong so far?


>
> You also stated as "fact":
>
> "No, the Great Pyramid was built in the time of
> Khufu, the mid-3rd millennium BC".

>
> Again, we do not know to what extent Khufu was
> involved in the project.

Clearly the most signifigant and most awe inspiring part of the project. Mastabas and Ziggarats are trivial in comparison ???
>
> "He intended it for use as his tomb..."
>
> No, Merrell, we do not know if any pharaoh
> intended their pyramids to be their tomb.

In your thread below I quickly scan read it again just to see whether (I erred and did not comment?- (LOL! not only for that reason) you state that you are aware of the extensive tomb robbing that occurred right throughout Dynastic Egypt even something like "even sons from fathers" so we ought not be surprised that bodies are no longer there - IF they were ever there?

Your previous seemingly long held conjecture was 'cenotaph'. I am not sure. However mountains of corroborating evidence indicates it was entirely related to what we would call religious (dare I suggest 'superstitious') and dealt with the afterlife of the deceased king.

>
> If Pyramids are not Tombs, then where are
> the Pharaohs?

>
> Readers would note your lack of participation
> there....
>
> But again, please tell me how I am wrong.

As above . No there isn't any mummies ,only some parts (maybe), nor dead intact undisturbed pharaohs.
Is absence, conclusive evidence? If so, of what?
>
> "...(it's been suggested that he died in the
> summer of 2483 BC, before his tomb was fully
> complete)".

>
> Oh...? So then this would mean some of it was
> built after the time of Khufu? I'm confused
> because you just said "the Great Pyramid was built
> in the time of Khufu". And "2483 BC", you say?
> That's a nice exact number and in the "summer" no
> less. Which regardless would be weird as by nearly
> all accepted chronologies "2483 BC" would place
> this in the 5th Dynasty in or around the reign of
> Sahure.
>
> You are going off the dates of 2509-2483BC for
> Khufu's reign which are not accepted by Egyptology
> though widely copy and pasted almost verbatim in
> internet articles appearing only on or after the
> Nov 2, 2017 press release of the Muon study (Nov
> 2, 2017) finding a void. It would appear these
> dates are only what was offered by the Muon team
> which unless they know something the rest of us do
> not would seem to be in error and/or are using
> dates otherwise not accepted by Egyptology at
> large. Source please.

You obviously was aware of where Merrell may have obtained such a date. You detail it later!

I refer you to her first post in reply to the OP

Quote
Merrell
Author: Merrell ()

Date: August 25, 2017 07:49AM

...
But, for example, there are crewmarks in Campbell's Chamber in the GP based on the name of the king, Khufu (d. 2566 BC).

Not everyone has an Encycopedic mind of dates of deceased pharaohs. Also you ought with your extensive knowledge know or be aware that even in what some claim to so called " fixed rigid Egyptology " there is constant conjecture and modification of the periods based on new proposals unfortunately based on conflicting Kings lists etc.

I hope this is of some value to someone

Thanks but you know the "quarry marks or "graffiti" or "rudimentary hieratic glyphs" discovered by Col Vyse were at least mostly (more likely certainly entirely) original (not forged) and dated to the 4th Dynasty reign of King Khufu.

You surely do not need convincing of that.

However any one in any doubt whatsoever, ought obtain and read both volumes of The Strange Journey of Humphries Brewer: Witness to a Forgery in the Great Pyramid?

At least you got a contribtion and reply. Pity it was not in one of your threads as this one is totally SICK and likely a troll or deranged numbskull's effort. Clearly showing the sick influence fringe writer such as Sitchin can have on morons - "Nibiru" !!????

Cheers
Kindest regards

Options: ReplyQuote


Subject Views Written By Posted
Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 2907 stephentuck25 25-Aug-17 02:08
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 495 Merrell 25-Aug-17 07:49
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 471 stephentuck25 25-Aug-17 16:58
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 493 Merrell 25-Aug-17 19:53
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 506 stephentuck25 25-Aug-17 21:13
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 426 Dr. Troglodyte 25-Aug-17 22:07
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 406 stephentuck25 26-Aug-17 04:13
Imagination Does Not Equal Facts 402 Barbelo 26-Aug-17 05:04
Re: Imagination Does Not Equal Facts 418 stephentuck25 26-Aug-17 07:45
Re: Imagination Does Not Equal Facts 401 Susan Doris 26-Aug-17 11:05
Re: Imagination Does Not Equal Facts 462 Barbelo 26-Aug-17 11:22
Re: Imagination Does Not Equal Facts 370 Susan Doris 26-Aug-17 11:45
Re: Imagination Does Not Equal Facts 372 stephentuck25 26-Aug-17 22:01
Re: Imagination Does Not Equal Facts 383 Barbelo 26-Aug-17 23:36
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 375 Dr. Troglodyte 26-Aug-17 16:18
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 382 stephentuck25 26-Aug-17 22:49
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 390 stephentuck25 27-Aug-17 00:16
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 376 Merrell 26-Aug-17 17:01
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 411 stephentuck25 26-Aug-17 23:08
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 144 Lee McGiffen 11-Apr-19 07:37
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 438 Reagent 25-Aug-17 09:09
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 447 stephentuck25 25-Aug-17 17:21
An Unconventional View 437 Barbelo 26-Aug-17 02:03
Re: An Unconventional View 665 stephentuck25 26-Aug-17 07:22
Re: An Unconventional View 381 Barbelo 26-Aug-17 11:34
Re: An Unconventional View 412 stephentuck25 26-Aug-17 22:38
Re: An Unconventional View 344 Barbelo 27-Aug-17 03:36
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 629 stephentuck25 27-Aug-17 16:20
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 316 Susan Doris 27-Aug-17 16:36
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 341 stephentuck25 27-Aug-17 17:05
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 488 Thanos5150 27-Aug-17 17:46
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 388 Susan Doris 28-Aug-17 04:54
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 425 Thanos5150 28-Aug-17 15:29
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 372 Susan Doris 28-Aug-17 17:24
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 431 Susan Doris 28-Aug-17 05:15
A Final Nail 394 Barbelo 27-Aug-17 20:52
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 505 Scott Creighton 27-Aug-17 23:55
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 451 Broker 28-Aug-17 14:34
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 603 stephentuck25 25-Sep-17 07:47
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 404 stephentuck25 29-Aug-17 02:22
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 369 Susan Doris 29-Aug-17 05:14
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 353 Thanos5150 29-Aug-17 15:43
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 351 stephentuck25 29-Aug-17 17:26
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 345 Thanos5150 29-Aug-17 18:14
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 366 stephentuck25 29-Aug-17 18:45
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 378 stephentuck25 29-Aug-17 16:57
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 368 Susan Doris 29-Aug-17 18:25
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 361 stephentuck25 29-Aug-17 19:17
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 318 Susan Doris 30-Aug-17 05:08
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 340 stephentuck25 30-Aug-17 06:45
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 340 Susan Doris 30-Aug-17 07:44
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 359 stephentuck25 30-Aug-17 08:28
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 367 Susan Doris 30-Aug-17 09:04
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 445 stephentuck25 29-Aug-17 19:39
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 386 Eddie Larry 29-Aug-17 21:41
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 409 Susan Doris 30-Aug-17 05:15
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 467 Eddie Larry 30-Aug-17 14:25
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 176 stephentuck25 08-Apr-19 17:27
Crews and copper tools 200 Merrell 08-Apr-19 19:58
Re: Crews and copper tools 192 stephentuck25 08-Apr-19 21:09
Re: Crews and copper tools 164 Merrell 09-Apr-19 22:03
Re: Crews and copper tools 147 engbren 10-Apr-19 01:08
Re: Crews and copper tools 170 Merrell 10-Apr-19 13:06
Re: Crews and copper tools 150 Thanos5150 10-Apr-19 04:11
Re: Crews and copper tools 161 Merrell 10-Apr-19 08:52
Re: Crews and copper tools 159 Thanos5150 11-Apr-19 03:48
Re: Crews and copper tools 199 Merrell 11-Apr-19 12:50
Re: Crews and copper tools 128 Thanos5150 12-Apr-19 15:09
Re: Crews and copper tools 172 Corpuscles 11-Apr-19 10:05
Two Things 138 Barbelo 11-Apr-19 11:30
Re: Two Things 145 Corpuscles 11-Apr-19 13:13
Re: Two Things 139 Barbelo 12-Apr-19 01:18
Re: Crews and copper tools 335 Thanos5150 11-Apr-19 23:30
Re: Crews and copper tools 200 Merrell 12-Apr-19 07:34
Re: Crews and copper tools 187 Thanos5150 12-Apr-19 15:26
Re: Crews and copper tools 178 Merrell 12-Apr-19 15:53
Re: Crews and copper tools 174 Corpuscles 17-Apr-19 10:51
Re: Crews and copper tools 190 Thanos5150 18-Apr-19 04:23
Re: Crews and copper tools 146 Martin Stower 10-Apr-19 21:10
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Garbage Theory! 157 Barbelo 08-Apr-19 22:50
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Garbage Theory! 214 stephentuck25 09-Apr-19 13:55
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Garbage Theory! 138 Barbelo 09-Apr-19 21:17
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! 180 Martin Stower 10-Apr-19 22:03
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! Congratulations! 273 jamesglory 09-Apr-19 03:25
Re: Tuck's Orion Precession Theory! Congratulations! 192 stephentuck25 09-Apr-19 13:49


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.