Mysteries :  The Official GrahamHancock.com forums
For serious discussion of the controversies, approaches and enigmas surrounding the origins and development of the human species and of human civilization. (NB: for more ‘out there’ posts we point you in the direction of the ‘Paranormal & Supernatural’ Message Board). 
Welcome! Log InRegister
Origyptian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Warwick Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Thanos5150 Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> >
> > > What I wish someone would do is to chisel
> with
> > > both copper and bronze and compare the
> > > differences. Mesopotamia had been using
> bronze
> > > for a thousand years before the OK which by
> that
> > > time the bronze age was well on its way. Its
> > > impossible the OK AE were not aware of bronze
> and
> > > given the fact "99.9%" of the copper they are
> > > claimed to have used to build these structures
> is
> > > missing from the archaeological record who is
> to
> > > say bronze was not utilized as well?
> >
> > Or even iron.
> >
> > The arguments re lack of evidence cut both ways
> in that regard.
> >
> > Warwick
>
> Respectfully, the lack of evidence of tools used
> to build those structures in the 3rd mill. BC does
> indeed allow the arguments to cut both ways, but
> if you're going to invoke the pure speculation of
> "iron"




excuse me but...It wasn't me that invoked iron. It was Jon

Pay bloody attention, if you are going to dismiss someone's argument


simply on the basis that the corresponding
> copper tools don't exist in the evidence either,
> then why not also invoke a non-terrestrial origin
> as well?


If you wish to go there...no one is stopping you.


Now you're using that 'backhoe ' to shovel words into my mouth


>
> In any case, in the spirit of showing how the
> arguments cut both ways, let's also include what
> some of us consider to be a more plausible
> alternative argument: The reason the copper that
> allegedly built those structures is nowhere to be
> found (as are many key tools and methods required
> to achieve such construction) could simply be that
> those structures were not built by 3rd mill. BC
> Egyptians.



While I dispute your claim re 'nowhere' I do not dispute the possibility that they were built elsewhen



>
> But when you jump to the conclusion the 4th
> Dynasty must have built those structures


I didn't JUMP to this conclusion

even
> though we don't see the evidence of the copper
> tools that they (allegedly) used,



again I did[ute this point


and then use
> that lack of evidence to also allow the
> possibility of other non-existent tools, you are
> simply attempting to secure the self-consistency
> of the traditional narrative, but it's all pure
> speculation with little basis in fact other than
> the conspicuous contradiction that there's no
> direct evidence that they had anything but soft
> copper-based tools and no indication in the
> documented record that they had the methods to
> achieve such a massive construction project.



Actually...in this instance we WERE discussing(or at least Racho and I were) how do properly put the disputed unknowns to the test. Instead of beating the poor horse senseless.

MY point, which I obviously failed to communicate adequately was and still is..

No matter what tests are carried out, they will not be seen as being good enough here.

UNLESS they are conducted in a professional manner, with the ideal materials , under the ideal conditions, with Fair Witness oversight.


>
> It's a circular argument to first speculate that
> they built all that stuff with non-existent
> copper-based tools and methods in the 3rd mill.
> BC, and then use that speculation as a logical
> foundation to propose other non-existent tools and
> methods.


As I did not attempt to do that I don't know why you are attributing that to me.

Perhaps in this instance if we tried to stay on topic instead of turning every thread into obtuse verbiage, we might get somewhere.

Or you can come up with some way of falsifying your claim that no one built them.

I say this based on the fact that you repeatedly REFUSE to share who you think may have built them.
When they built them

and why they built them.

This would be a refreshing change from your constant negativity towards those who have formulated opinions and shared them.

Warwick

Options: ReplyQuote


Subject Views Written By Posted
Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 3148 Racho 02-Apr-17 18:38
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 843 Fsbirdhouse 02-Apr-17 20:05
Whoever operated this saw (2:30 min mark)...made a mistake 761 Racho 04-Apr-17 14:02
Re: Whoever operated this saw (2:30 min mark)...made a mistake 740 Fsbirdhouse 04-Apr-17 14:51
If on purpose... 325 Racho 14-Apr-17 05:01
Re: If on purpose... 372 Origyptian 14-Apr-17 05:32
Re: Whoever operated this saw (2:30 min mark)...made a mistake 632 Origyptian 07-Apr-17 13:28
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 618 SandyJesse 07-Apr-17 22:42
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 395 Fsbirdhouse 09-Apr-17 16:59
Re: B 4 : ) 592 Thunderbird 05-Apr-17 05:22
Re: B 4 : ) 566 Warwick 07-Apr-17 17:50
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 619 SandyJesse 07-Apr-17 01:30
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 726 Warwick 07-Apr-17 18:03
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 808 Jon Ellison 08-Apr-17 10:53
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 508 Warwick 08-Apr-17 17:57
if I carried out a test... 587 Racho 09-Apr-17 02:15
Re: if I carried out a test... 537 Jon Ellison 09-Apr-17 08:44
I did check it out :) 433 Racho 25-Apr-17 05:59
Re: I did check it out :) 347 Origyptian 25-Apr-17 14:22
Don't even need to stop to think on this... 329 Racho 25-Apr-17 15:37
Re: Don't even need to stop to think on this... 388 Thanos5150 25-Apr-17 17:20
I believe you are a copper/bronze tool proponent 327 Racho 25-Apr-17 18:07
Re: I believe you are a copper/bronze tool proponent 422 Thanos5150 25-Apr-17 19:49
Would you agree... 370 Racho 25-Apr-17 20:29
Re: Would you agree... 408 Thanos5150 25-Apr-17 21:07
Re: Would you agree... 397 Origyptian 25-Apr-17 22:54
...just a lot of similarities at the 36 second mark and super telltale machine markings at 9:30 min mark 304 Racho 15-Oct-17 05:46
Re: ...just a lot of similarities at the 36 second mark and super telltale machine markings at 9:30 min mark 236 Jon Ellison 15-Oct-17 14:26
precision cut at 7:08 min mark...interesting photo angle I haven't seen before 303 Racho 15-Oct-17 16:49
Re: precision cut at 7:08 min mark...interesting photo angle I haven't seen before 272 Jon Ellison 15-Oct-17 19:20
Re: precision cut at 7:08 min mark...interesting photo angle I haven't seen before 287 Jon Ellison 15-Oct-17 19:35
Re: ...just a lot of similarities at the 36 second mark and super telltale machine markings at 9:30 min mark 289 Origyptian 16-Oct-17 03:27
Re: ...just a lot of similarities at the 36 second mark and super telltale machine markings at 9:30 min mark 294 Jon Ellison 16-Oct-17 07:58
Re: ...just a lot of similarities at the 36 second mark and super telltale machine markings at 9:30 min mark 261 Jon Ellison 16-Oct-17 09:19
Re: ...just a lot of similarities at the 36 second mark and super telltale machine markings at 9:30 min mark 541 Jon Ellison 16-Oct-17 11:03
an ancient quarry in France...same markings on side of a 'cliff' 77 Racho 20-Dec-19 20:04
Re: an ancient quarry in France...same markings on side of a 'cliff' 73 Martin Stower 20-Dec-19 23:47
? 62 Racho 21-Dec-19 01:25
Re: an ancient quarry in France...same markings on side of a 'cliff' 72 Open mind 21-Dec-19 02:03
Re: an ancient quarry in France...same markings on side of a 'cliff' 73 Thanos5150 21-Dec-19 04:19
Re: an ancient quarry in France...same markings on side of a 'cliff' 76 Open mind 21-Dec-19 05:07
Re: an ancient quarry in France...same markings on side of a 'cliff' 105 Thanos5150 21-Dec-19 16:25
Re: Would you agree... 598 Corpuscles 25-Apr-17 23:56
Re: if I carried out a test... 403 Warwick 09-Apr-17 15:39
Re: if I carried out a test... 450 Fsbirdhouse 09-Apr-17 22:34
Re: if I carried out a test... 363 Jon Ellison 09-Apr-17 23:20
could not have been 410 Warwick 10-Apr-17 15:34
Re: could not have been 416 Jon Ellison 10-Apr-17 16:18
Re: could not have been 450 Warwick 10-Apr-17 17:29
Re: could not have been 427 Jon Ellison 10-Apr-17 17:59
Re: could not have been 356 Warwick 10-Apr-17 18:48
Re: could not have been 359 Jon Ellison 10-Apr-17 19:18
Re: could not have been 381 Warwick 10-Apr-17 19:34
Re: could not have been 418 Jon Ellison 10-Apr-17 19:55
Re: could not have been 365 Warwick 11-Apr-17 17:29
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 393 Thanos5150 09-Apr-17 16:13
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 501 Warwick 09-Apr-17 16:42
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 410 Thanos5150 09-Apr-17 16:56
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 401 Warwick 09-Apr-17 17:21
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 463 Thanos5150 09-Apr-17 18:00
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 393 Warwick 09-Apr-17 18:06
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 417 Thanos5150 09-Apr-17 18:22
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 430 Warwick 09-Apr-17 18:31
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 399 Origyptian 09-Apr-17 20:02
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 464 Warwick 10-Apr-17 15:41
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 369 Jon Ellison 09-Apr-17 18:44
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 405 Warwick 09-Apr-17 19:03
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 393 Jon Ellison 09-Apr-17 19:17
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 412 Warwick 09-Apr-17 19:48
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 523 Jon Ellison 09-Apr-17 20:33
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 389 Warwick 10-Apr-17 15:53
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 468 Origyptian 09-Apr-17 20:06
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 486 Thanos5150 09-Apr-17 23:24
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 416 Origyptian 10-Apr-17 04:42
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 424 Jon Ellison 10-Apr-17 08:50
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 436 Origyptian 10-Apr-17 14:16
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 391 Thanos5150 10-Apr-17 15:25
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 370 Origyptian 10-Apr-17 15:44
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 428 Origyptian 10-Apr-17 14:44
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 400 Warwick 10-Apr-17 15:26
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 378 Origyptian 10-Apr-17 15:54
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 378 Warwick 10-Apr-17 16:01
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 429 Jon Ellison 10-Apr-17 16:23
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 403 Warwick 10-Apr-17 17:06
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 401 Jon Ellison 10-Apr-17 16:11
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 391 Warwick 10-Apr-17 17:23
I've come to recognize that I was wrong all along 547 Racho 08-Apr-17 16:54
Re: I've come to recognize that I was wrong all along 537 Warwick 08-Apr-17 18:23
Oranges and apples... 464 Racho 09-Apr-17 00:39
Re: Oranges and apples... 434 Warwick 09-Apr-17 15:59
Re: In plain sight 453 Thunderbird 10-Apr-17 19:53
It is in plain sight...or plane sight ;) 446 Racho 14-Apr-17 06:53
Re: It is in plain sight...or plane sight ;) 493 Thunderbird 15-Apr-17 01:31
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 424 Archae Solenhofen 09-Apr-17 16:47
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 412 Warwick 09-Apr-17 16:52
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 399 Origyptian 09-Apr-17 19:49
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 416 Warwick 09-Apr-17 19:53
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 399 Origyptian 09-Apr-17 20:09
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 476 Origyptian 09-Apr-17 19:49
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 491 Jon Ellison 09-Apr-17 19:59
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 404 Origyptian 09-Apr-17 20:26
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 404 Fsbirdhouse 10-Apr-17 15:26
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 406 Origyptian 10-Apr-17 15:46
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 447 Fsbirdhouse 10-Apr-17 18:45
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 412 Eddie Larry 10-Apr-17 18:49
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 396 Origyptian 10-Apr-17 18:50
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 422 Warwick 10-Apr-17 19:18
unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 379 Racho 11-Apr-17 06:22
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 491 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 09:27
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 293 Origyptian 11-Apr-17 19:32
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 443 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 19:38
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 286 Archae Solenhofen 11-Apr-17 14:11
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 396 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 14:27
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 381 Archae Solenhofen 11-Apr-17 14:49
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 363 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 15:27
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 370 Fsbirdhouse 11-Apr-17 15:53
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 434 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 15:55
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 439 Archae Solenhofen 11-Apr-17 16:35
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 251 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 16:49
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 278 Origyptian 11-Apr-17 19:54
once the mistake... 365 Racho 12-Apr-17 00:03
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 473 Thunderbird 12-Apr-17 04:20
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 311 Origyptian 12-Apr-17 13:14
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 445 Archae Solenhofen 11-Apr-17 17:31
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 370 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 18:17
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 360 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 18:26
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 438 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 18:43
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 364 Archae Solenhofen 12-Apr-17 14:43
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 375 Archae Solenhofen 11-Apr-17 18:41
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 411 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 18:45
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 320 Fsbirdhouse 11-Apr-17 18:48
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 400 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 19:00
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 325 Warwick 11-Apr-17 19:37
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 401 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 19:59
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 320 Warwick 11-Apr-17 20:29
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 383 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 20:34
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 420 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 20:29
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 314 Warwick 11-Apr-17 20:37
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 390 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 20:45
Re: unless the cuts were being made very, very quickly... 296 Warwick 12-Apr-17 17:24
science and technology...where minds come to meet 342 Racho 11-Apr-17 20:46
Re: science and technology...where minds come to meet 347 Jon Ellison 11-Apr-17 21:19
Re: science and technology...where minds come to meet 606 Archae Solenhofen 12-Apr-17 15:01
Re: science and technology...where minds come to meet 373 Warwick 12-Apr-17 17:52
43 second mark ...anyone care to take a crack at which tools were used? 379 Racho 12-Apr-17 20:20
Re: 43 second mark ...anyone care to take a crack at which tools were used? 464 Origyptian 12-Apr-17 21:34
and just after 30:30 min mark..china cave - chisels did this? 518 Racho 12-Apr-17 22:54
Re: and just after 30:30 min mark..china cave - chisels did this? 392 Warwick 13-Apr-17 17:15
taking sides...I suppose so but 414 Racho 14-Apr-17 04:18
beating the dead horse... 530 Racho 20-Apr-17 06:50
Re: Carved all this out with copper tools? Hell, I'll give em hardened steel and still scratch my head 564 Notinham 11-Apr-17 01:43


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.