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Origyptian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> These are deflections that do not represent what I
> said in my posts. Certainly, Reisner
> can be accused of inventing a
> conspiracy in which Khufu's team
> coordinated a secret reburial of Hetepheres from
> Dashur to Giza. And he might also be accused of
> inventing a deception in which
> Khufu's team tried to slip the sealed but empty
> sarcophagus past Khufu without him knowing it
> didn't contain the remains of Hetepheres I. But
> I've never stated or implied that Reisner,
> himself, engaged in conspiracy or deception. On
> the contrary, I've stated several times that I
> thought Reisner's "motives were pure" but
> that he simply applied an obsolete standard of
> proof and his peers swallowed it whole.

I am reasonable certain you originally characterized Reisner as perpetuating some kind of fraud even saying something to the effect he tried to "deceive the world" with his Hetepheres hypothesis. A forum search only goes back a year so it is what it is. Since then I cannot find you have "stated" as such, but it is clear you imply it:

Quote

I've also read Lehner's excoriation of Reisner's decree in 1985 which clearly and neatly exposes Reisner's pure fabrication....

Such fabrication was necessary for Reisner to be able to keep the Egyptological narrative self-consistent....

...But, similar to Reisner, I know of no attempt by Engelbach to restrain others from making such leaps in logic. And I think Reisner's is the bigger transgression since he clearly was all-in on driving the hoax right at the start, unlike Engelbach who seemed to take a more passive stand to simply allow such claims to be made about the stele.
Here.

If one being "all-in on driving a hoax" is not a deliberate "deception" I am not sure what is particularly considering as you claim "Such fabrication was necessary for Reisner to be able to keep the Egyptological narrative self-consistent" which again sure sounds like some "conspiracy" to me.

Doing a search to quote you I have to say is intellectually nauseating: SEARCH

Again and again and again, more often than not completely out of context, you bring up Reisner's "fabrication" often in the same detail as some kind of smoking gun Egyptology is all some fraud and how a reevaluation using "modern standards of proof" is required as without it it's all just made up crap just like Reisner. Not to mention Engelbach and Stocks, the "trifecta" of exhibit A's of your Egyptological crimes against humanity. And this is just one year of searches. Don't you find this weird? Saying the same things over and over and over again? And this is but one example. How many times do you think you have written the words "modern standards of proof" and the like? Hundreds? Thousands? It's as bad as "musta used ramps" and "stinky footed bumpkins".

[snip]

Quote

"We already knew that the contents of the box had been gathered up from the original tomb [based on how it was found], and that the original tomb had been broken into by thieves [because it was now there]."

"The chipping of the upper edge of the coffin and the lower edge of the lid had been noted when the tomb was first opened [when Reisner and co opened it] and understood as proving that the coffin had been closed and opened again before deposition in the secret tomb [this is how they "understood" it]."

"I reached the conclusion that the deposit was a reburial brought here from another tomb...[Right or wrong we all come to "conclusions" i.e. "opinions" do we not?]"

Quote

"In a preliminary statement I set forth the facts as known at that time and outlined the various possibilities arising from the known facts...I never doubted that the mummy was in the coffin [but as he notes later he was wrong]...In my preliminary statement I had mentioned every possibility except the one which lay patent before us. There was no mummy in the coffin. It had seemed to me inconceivable that Cheops should have ordered the remains of his mother's burial transferred to Giza and hidden under a hundred feet of masonry unless the body, the most essential part of any burial, had been brought along with the coffin."

Hardly the stuff of "hoaxes".

For convenience The Mysteries of Queen Hetepheres' Burial in Egypt
Quote

Specifically, Mark Lehner, one of our best known modern Egyptologists, objects to Reisner's conclusions on a number of grounds. For example, he thinks that the robbers would have smashed the lid of the sarcophagus, as so often happened, rather than carefully lifting it off of the sarcophagus. Furthermore, it is difficult to believe that the robbers would have missed easily portable valuables such as the silver bracelets. Lehner also thinks that, were Hetepheres to have been buried originally at Dahshur, a theory for which there is really no evidence, the reburial should have taken place there as well. He also finds it difficult to believe that a shaft of such depth could have been dug secretly at Giza, and finally, he points out that it is hard to imagine Khufu knowingly allowing his mother to be reburied with broken pottery and violated funerary equipment.

Hence, Dr. Lehner has suggested an alternative theory for this tomb. He believes that Hetepheres died early in her son's reign, and was buried in this hastily dug shaft, similar in style to 3rd Dynasty tombs. He thinks that a superstructure was begun for the tomb, also in the style of the 3rd Dynasty, but was then abandoned when Khufu's cult was changed and the plan of the eastern field was modified because Khufu's upper temple would have interfered with it. Instead, he built the three small pyramids, referenced as G 1a, b and c. Dr. Lehner then believes that the queen's body was taken from G 7000x and reburied with new funerary equipment inside either G 1a or G 1b.

Dr. Lehner addressed and refuted Reisner's theory point by point, coming up with alternative explanations that fit his own theory. For example, he suggests that the basalt fragments found in the offering niche might be tools, and proposes that the limestone boulder might have been thrown into the niche to crush the skull and therefore invalidate the offering. He further suggests that the copper tools found in the burial chamber were left by the workmen who pried the lid from the sarcophagus to remove the body of the queen. On the grounds that the damage to the sarcophagus included chipping on the lid all the way around, he also believes that the sarcophagus could have easily been damaged in G 7000x.

But that's not all:

Quote

Mark Lehner's good friend and old associate at Giza and now head of the Egyptian Supreme Council of Antiquities, Dr. Zahi Hawass, doubts both theories. He asks the questions, if Hetepheres were originally buried at Dahshur, then where is her first tomb, and how could her burial equipment been moved all the way from Dahshur to Giza in secret? If instead, G 7000x was her first burial, as Dr. Lehner suggests, then why was it left in such disorder? Indeed, he wonders why the queen mother would be buried in such haste, and why would Khufu's officials have needed a completely new set of funerary equipment? Most importantly, he wonders why the Queen's body would be reburied elsewhere, while leaving her canopic material behind?

Hence, Dr. Hawass presents yet another theory to this mystery. He believes that Hetepheres was originally buried in G 1a, the northernmost of the small pyramids. It was Dr. Lehner who pointed out that the portable canopy and furniture found in G 7000x would have fit almost perfectly into the burial chamber of G 1a, which makes more sense if it was originally designed to go there rather than placed hurriedly into G 7000x. But then, why would it have later been moved into G 7000x.

He explains that, during the First Intermediate Period there was a considerable amount of vandalism taking place on the Giza Plateau, and points out that evidence suggests that much of Khufu's complex was destroyed during this time. He therefore believes that Hetepheres' burial could have been disturbed at this time, and her body stolen by thieves looking for jewels. He thinks that it is possible that afterwards, priests connected to Khufu's cult might have moved what remained of her burial equipment to hide it from further pillagers. He suggests that, since the style of G 7000x points to a date in the 3rd Dynasty, or even the 2nd, is could have been dug much earlier and abandoned before Khufu's complex was even begun. Thus, the priest would have found and used this ancient shaft to protect what was left of the burial of this important queen.

Dr. Hawass also points out that this would explain the reversal of the objects suggested by Reisner, since it would be more reasonable for such a reversal to occur if the equipment were moved only a short distance, item by item. He thinks that the offerings were also moved, being damaged in the process, and that the basalt chips found with the offerings were more likely from the destroyed pavement of Khufu's upper temple, and the limestone debris was probably residue from his vandalized temples. Furthermore, he points to the lack of an official seal over the entrance to the shaft, which might account for a later burial.

To his credit, Dr. Hawass points out holes in his own theory, suggesting that his theory does not completely explain the queen's missing body. Likewise, he agrees with Dr. Lehner that robbers would be more likely to have broken the lid, and of course, there is the matter of various small objects that robbers would have likely have taken, including the jewelry box mentioned above.

Oops. Are they all just "necessary fabrications to be able to keep the Egyptological narrative self-consistent"?

Again, in conclusion, you make a mountain out of a molehill and the fact you bring up Reisner out of context ad nauseum as if it some kind of "proof" all should be doubted is more of a reflection on you than Reisner.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Creighton Persists Part 2 4096 JonnyMcA 19-May-16 14:30
That chemical analysis . . . 661 Martin Stower 19-May-16 17:30
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 588 Origyptian 19-May-16 20:50
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 563 Jon Ellison 19-May-16 21:31
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 531 Martin Stower 19-May-16 22:01
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 523 Martin Stower 19-May-16 21:42
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 503 Origyptian 19-May-16 22:12
The unfounded accusations continue..... 616 DScribr 19-May-16 22:46
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 595 Martin Stower 20-May-16 00:14
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 514 Thanos5150 20-May-16 00:35
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 401 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 01:57
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 529 Origyptian 20-May-16 02:47
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 416 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 03:20
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 486 Martin Stower 20-May-16 19:10
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 498 DScribr 20-May-16 23:23
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 509 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 23:35
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 490 DScribr 20-May-16 23:40
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 465 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:07
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 365 DScribr 20-May-16 02:58
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 517 Martin Stower 19-May-16 22:55
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 520 DScribr 19-May-16 22:43
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 500 Martin Stower 19-May-16 23:30
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 569 Origyptian 20-May-16 02:48
The lack of analysis . . . 615 DScribr 20-May-16 03:05
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 555 Audrey 20-May-16 04:13
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 469 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 06:58
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 509 DScribr 20-May-16 23:42
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 638 Origyptian 20-May-16 15:46
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 465 Martin Stower 21-May-16 01:28
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 457 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:32
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 506 Martin Stower 21-May-16 02:07
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 491 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 06:43
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 506 Origyptian 21-May-16 14:58
So much for chemical analysis . . . 486 DScribr 21-May-16 19:54
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 491 Martin Stower 21-May-16 22:49
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 484 Martin Stower 21-May-16 23:00
Re: What's the end game with this? 590 Thunderbird 20-May-16 17:20
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 487 Martin Stower 20-May-16 19:04
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 466 Audrey 20-May-16 22:43
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 436 Martin Stower 20-May-16 22:54
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 475 Audrey 20-May-16 23:12
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 411 Martin Stower 20-May-16 23:52
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 484 Audrey 21-May-16 00:33
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 561 Martin Stower 21-May-16 00:45
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 411 DScribr 21-May-16 01:35
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 373 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:06
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 441 Martin Stower 21-May-16 01:33
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 518 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:36
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 649 Martin Stower 21-May-16 02:49
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 546 Martin Stower 20-May-16 18:28
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 563 Origyptian 20-May-16 20:00
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 459 Thanos5150 20-May-16 20:13
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 495 Origyptian 20-May-16 21:03
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 502 Martin Stower 20-May-16 23:44
Höfer and Görlitz meet Stein 433 Martin Stower 21-May-16 00:36
Re: Höfer and Görlitz meet Stein 413 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:23
Re: Höfer and Görlitz meet Stein 624 Martin Stower 21-May-16 01:55
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 471 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:34
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 496 Martin Stower 21-May-16 03:15
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 427 Origyptian 21-May-16 04:08
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 500 Martin Stower 21-May-16 23:33
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 588 Origyptian 22-May-16 00:09
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 447 Martin Stower 22-May-16 00:49
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 536 Origyptian 22-May-16 00:57
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 508 Origyptian 22-May-16 01:11
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 502 Jon Ellison 22-May-16 01:14
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 518 Martin Stower 22-May-16 01:51
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 478 Origyptian 22-May-16 04:21
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 525 Martin Stower 22-May-16 14:20
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 490 Origyptian 22-May-16 17:32
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 525 Martin Stower 22-May-16 18:33
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 491 Origyptian 22-May-16 20:34
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 425 Martin Stower 22-May-16 21:30
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 514 Origyptian 22-May-16 23:04
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 531 Martin Stower 23-May-16 00:03
Re: That chemical analysis is all but forgotten...... 480 DScribr 23-May-16 03:11
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 517 Richard Fusniak 21-May-16 08:47
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 488 Origyptian 21-May-16 13:26
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 450 Martin Stower 22-May-16 00:32
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 479 Origyptian 22-May-16 00:50
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 511 Martin Stower 22-May-16 01:39
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 413 Origyptian 22-May-16 04:45
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 424 Martin Stower 22-May-16 16:13
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 417 Martin Stower 21-May-16 22:44
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 608 Origyptian 21-May-16 23:58
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 456 Martin Stower 22-May-16 01:28
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 705 Martin Stower 20-May-16 22:44
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 458 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:41
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 539 Martin Stower 21-May-16 03:28
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 566 Origyptian 21-May-16 04:14
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 378 Martin Stower 21-May-16 23:11
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 525 Thanos5150 19-May-16 22:50
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 505 Martin Stower 19-May-16 23:18
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 420 DScribr 20-May-16 03:07
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 504 Origyptian 20-May-16 02:52
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 448 DScribr 20-May-16 03:12
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 524 Thanos5150 20-May-16 05:20
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 416 Origyptian 20-May-16 13:36
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 525 Thanos5150 20-May-16 17:57
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 527 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 18:56
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 505 Martin Stower 20-May-16 19:23
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 579 Thanos5150 20-May-16 19:27
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 449 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 19:29
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 479 Audrey 20-May-16 21:02
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 491 Origyptian 20-May-16 21:12
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 480 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 21:26
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 539 Thanos5150 20-May-16 22:08
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 528 Audrey 20-May-16 22:34
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 432 Thanos5150 20-May-16 22:36
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 511 Audrey 20-May-16 22:47
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 418 Thanos5150 20-May-16 23:00
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 439 Audrey 20-May-16 23:11
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 422 Thanos5150 21-May-16 00:01
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 434 Audrey 21-May-16 00:23
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 488 Thanos5150 21-May-16 03:14
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 483 Audrey 21-May-16 05:02
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 417 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 09:10
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 557 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 09:28
The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 519 DScribr 21-May-16 13:37
Re: The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 432 Origyptian 21-May-16 13:56
Re: The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 480 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 17:48
Willful ignorance continues....... 510 DScribr 21-May-16 19:49
Re: Willful ignorance continues....... 534 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 21:28
Re: Stealing IS a crime! Willful ignorance continues....... 441 DScribr 22-May-16 00:39
Re: The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 514 Richard Fusniak 21-May-16 18:17
Re: The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 401 DScribr 21-May-16 19:57
Re: The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 534 Richard Fusniak 21-May-16 20:24
Stealing IS A Crime!!! 512 DScribr 22-May-16 00:32
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 511 Origyptian 21-May-16 15:04
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 431 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 17:53
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 486 Origyptian 21-May-16 21:39
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 480 Jon Ellison 22-May-16 00:46
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 433 Martin Stower 21-May-16 00:09
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 513 Audrey 21-May-16 00:26
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 522 Martin Stower 21-May-16 00:42
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 474 Audrey 21-May-16 01:04
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 539 Martin Stower 21-May-16 01:41
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 505 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 11:00
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 464 DScribr 21-May-16 01:44
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 473 Origyptian 20-May-16 19:25
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 487 Thanos5150 20-May-16 19:31
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 435 Origyptian 20-May-16 20:35
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 505 Thanos5150 20-May-16 22:03
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 429 Origyptian 20-May-16 22:38
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 512 Thanos5150 20-May-16 22:52
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 444 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:31
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 507 Martin Stower 21-May-16 01:05
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 447 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:27
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 471 Martin Stower 21-May-16 03:31
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 445 Audrey 21-May-16 01:42
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 525 Martin Stower 21-May-16 03:34
Pending statement from Dr. Gorlitz 767 Richard Fusniak 20-May-16 12:04
Re: Pending statement from Dr. Gorlitz 535 Martin Stower 20-May-16 19:25
Martin Persists 586 drrayeye 23-May-16 01:30
Re: Martin Persists 552 Martin Stower 23-May-16 12:01
Re: Martin Persists 425 R Avry Wilson 24-May-16 19:58
Mainstream Persists 464 DScribr 25-May-16 00:56
Re: Martin Persists 640 Merrell 28-May-16 09:00
Re: Martin Persists 475 Martin Stower 28-May-16 11:11
as long as we are counting 565 Warwick 25-May-16 16:42
Re: as long as we are counting 535 DScribr 26-May-16 01:53
Re: as long as we are counting 570 cladking 26-May-16 16:57
Re: as long as we are counting 480 Martin Stower 26-May-16 17:31
Re: as long as we are counting 493 Origyptian 26-May-16 17:40
Re: as long as we are counting 409 cladking 27-May-16 00:21
Re: as long as we are counting 502 Warwick 27-May-16 01:27
Re: as long as we are counting 326 Origyptian 27-May-16 02:53
And work hard at obfuscation. 397 DScribr 27-May-16 00:57
Re: And work hard at obfuscation. 451 cladking 27-May-16 02:55
Re: as long as we are counting 426 Warwick 27-May-16 01:29
Re: as long as we are counting 533 cladking 27-May-16 02:59
Re: as long as we are counting 507 Warwick 27-May-16 03:35
Re: as long as we are counting 493 Audrey 27-May-16 04:32
Re: as long as we are counting 447 Warwick 27-May-16 05:34
Re: as long as we are counting 538 cladking 27-May-16 13:35
Re: as long as we are counting 497 Warwick 27-May-16 14:56
The original page on Indiegogo etc. 586 Martin Stower 25-May-16 22:10
Another performance . . . 476 Martin Stower 26-May-16 13:47
Re: Another performance . . . 432 Warwick 26-May-16 13:57
Re: Another performance . . . 376 Origyptian 26-May-16 14:53
Re: Another performance . . . 466 Martin Stower 26-May-16 16:09
Re: Another performance . . . 478 cladking 26-May-16 16:18
Re: Another performance . . . 385 Martin Stower 26-May-16 16:31
Re: Another performance . . . 645 cladking 26-May-16 17:54
Re: Another performance . . . 529 Martin Stower 26-May-16 18:29
Re: Another performance . . . 363 cladking 26-May-16 23:52
Re: Another performance . . . 503 eyeofhorus33 26-May-16 19:00
Re: Another performance . . . 405 cladking 27-May-16 00:05
Re: Another performance . . . 435 Audrey 27-May-16 00:23
Re: Another performance . . . 420 Warwick 27-May-16 01:42
Re: Another performance . . . 496 cladking 27-May-16 02:07
Re: Another performance . . . 445 Warwick 27-May-16 02:15
Re: Another performance . . . 480 cladking 27-May-16 02:48
Re: Another performance . . . 459 Warwick 27-May-16 03:48
Re: Another performance . . . 514 cladking 27-May-16 03:53
Re: Another performance . . . 549 Warwick 27-May-16 05:41
Re: Another performance . . . 439 Audrey 27-May-16 04:51
Re: Another performance . . . 479 Warwick 27-May-16 05:18
NOT Primitive, Low-Tech 438 DScribr 28-May-16 14:09
Re: NOT Primitive, Low-Tech 486 cladking 28-May-16 14:31
Re: Another performance . . . 515 Thanos5150 26-May-16 16:38
Re: Another performance . . . 404 cladking 26-May-16 16:44
Re: Another performance . . . 505 Origyptian 26-May-16 17:33
Re: Another performance . . . 521 cladking 26-May-16 17:40
Re: Another performance . . . 511 Martin Stower 26-May-16 17:49
Re: Another performance . . . 515 cladking 27-May-16 00:15
Re: Another performance . . . 504 Martin Stower 27-May-16 19:17
Re: Another performance . . . 521 Warwick 27-May-16 20:00
Re: Another performance . . . 457 cladking 27-May-16 20:21
Re: Another performance . . . 559 Martin Stower 27-May-16 23:06
Re: Oops....we missed the Basalt flooring and machine disc cuts 367 Thunderbird 27-May-16 23:28
Re: Oops....we missed the Basalt flooring and machine disc cuts 479 Martin Stower 27-May-16 23:41
Re: Another performance . . . 501 cladking 28-May-16 00:33
Re: Another performance . . . 490 Martin Stower 28-May-16 00:59
Re: Another performance . . . 484 cladking 28-May-16 02:36
Re: Another performance . . . 464 Martin Stower 28-May-16 23:55
Re: Another performance . . . 411 cladking 29-May-16 01:23
Re: Another performance . . . 446 Martin Stower 29-May-16 19:35
Re: Another performance . . . 614 cladking 29-May-16 20:43
Re: Another performance . . . 500 R Avry Wilson 28-May-16 02:39
Re: Another performance . . . 522 cladking 28-May-16 03:41
Re: Another performance . . . 465 Thanos5150 28-May-16 06:20
Re: Another performance . . . 543 cladking 28-May-16 13:40
Re: Another performance . . . 493 Origyptian 28-May-16 15:04
Re: Another performance . . . 489 Jon Ellison 28-May-16 16:38
Re: Another performance . . . 353 cladking 28-May-16 17:52
Re: Another performance . . . 452 Jon Ellison 28-May-16 17:58
Re: Another performance . . . 378 Origyptian 29-May-16 02:51
Re: Another performance . . . 402 cladking 29-May-16 03:08
Re: Another performance . . . 462 Origyptian 29-May-16 04:03
Re: Another performance . . . 480 Thanos5150 29-May-16 05:03
Re: Another performance . . . 511 Origyptian 29-May-16 13:18
Re: Another performance . . . 527 Thanos5150 29-May-16 15:03
Focus on the axiom 470 Origyptian 29-May-16 15:27
Re: Focus on everything BUT the facts 531 DScribr 29-May-16 15:41
Re: Focus on everything BUT the facts 426 cladking 29-May-16 17:29
Re: Focus on the axiom 411 Thanos5150 30-May-16 01:49
Re: Focus on the axiom 468 Origyptian 30-May-16 05:32
Re: Focus on the axiom 461 Thanos5150 31-May-16 02:35
Re: Focus on the axiom 494 Origyptian 31-May-16 06:41
Re: Focus on the axiom 493 Thanos5150 01-Jun-16 00:28
Re: Focus on reality. 454 DScribr 01-Jun-16 00:51
Re: Focus on the axiom 440 Origyptian 01-Jun-16 06:20
Re: Focus on the axiom 485 Thanos5150 02-Jun-16 03:08
Re: Focus on the axiom 461 cladking 02-Jun-16 04:00
Re: Focus on the axiom 411 Origyptian 02-Jun-16 04:25
Re: Focus on the axiom 421 Thanos5150 02-Jun-16 16:34
Re: Focus on the axiom 422 cladking 02-Jun-16 18:20
Re: Focus on the axiom 475 Origyptian 03-Jun-16 18:04
Re: Focus on the axiom 463 R Avry Wilson 03-Jun-16 18:43
Re: Focus on the axiom 443 Origyptian 03-Jun-16 21:24
Re: Focus on the axiom 456 Corpuscles 03-Jun-16 23:59
Re: Focus on the axiom 314 Origyptian 04-Jun-16 06:29
Re: Focus on the axiom 384 R Avry Wilson 04-Jun-16 00:12
Re: Focus on the axiom 372 Origyptian 04-Jun-16 07:02
Re: Focus on the axiom 502 Jon Ellison 04-Jun-16 10:18
Re: Focus on the axiom 438 R Avry Wilson 05-Jun-16 04:15
Re: Focus on the axiom 434 Martin Stower 03-Jun-16 22:28
Re: Focus on the axiom 447 cladking 03-Jun-16 22:51
Re: Focus on the axiom 566 Thanos5150 04-Jun-16 01:08
Re: Focus on the axiom 454 Origyptian 05-Jun-16 01:25
Re: Focus on the axiom 501 Thanos5150 05-Jun-16 04:15
Re: Focus on the axiom 459 Origyptian 05-Jun-16 17:29
Re: Focus on the axiom 495 Martin Stower 05-Jun-16 19:35
Re: Focus on the axiom 509 Origyptian 05-Jun-16 22:48
Re: Focus on the axiom 425 Martin Stower 05-Jun-16 23:47
Re: Focus on the axiom 463 Origyptian 06-Jun-16 00:54
Re: Focus on the axiom 423 Origyptian 06-Jun-16 01:01
Re: Focus on the axiom 460 Thanos5150 06-Jun-16 01:05
Re: Focus on the axiom 445 Origyptian 06-Jun-16 02:40
Re: Focus on the axiom 473 R Avry Wilson 06-Jun-16 03:39
Re: Focus on the axiom 389 Audrey 06-Jun-16 04:59
Re: Focus on the axiom 395 Jon Ellison 06-Jun-16 07:59
Re: Focus on the axiom 400 Origyptian 06-Jun-16 14:00
Re: Focus on the axiom 458 cladking 06-Jun-16 16:13
Re: Focus on the axiom 417 Corpuscles 07-Jun-16 00:20
Re: Focus on the axiom 476 Origyptian 07-Jun-16 02:55
Re: Focus on the axiom 407 Thanos5150 06-Jun-16 15:33
Re: Focus on the axiom 347 Warwick 06-Jun-16 16:17
Re: Focus on the axiom 480 Audrey 06-Jun-16 16:39
Re: Focus on the axiom 466 Warwick 06-Jun-16 16:58
Re: Focus on the axiom 373 Audrey 06-Jun-16 17:46
Re: Focus on the axiom 415 Warwick 06-Jun-16 18:13
Re: Focus on the axiom 358 Audrey 06-Jun-16 23:44
Read what I wrote 371 Warwick 07-Jun-16 17:15
Re: Read what I wrote 394 Audrey 08-Jun-16 00:22
Re: Read what I wrote 385 Martin Stower 08-Jun-16 01:40
Re: Read what I wrote 550 Audrey 08-Jun-16 01:52
Re: Read what I wrote 408 Martin Stower 08-Jun-16 13:47
Vyse's veracity.... 414 Warwick 09-Jun-16 16:29
Re: Vyse's veracity.... 338 Audrey 09-Jun-16 16:51
Re: Vyse's veracity.... 435 Warwick 09-Jun-16 17:19
Re: Vyse's veracity.... 475 Audrey 09-Jun-16 17:45
Wilkinson's opinions 399 Warwick 09-Jun-16 18:47
Re: Wilkinson's opinions 414 Origyptian 09-Jun-16 20:57
Ori's opinions 547 DScribr 10-Jun-16 01:45
Re: The incredible Teflon Red Ochre 391 Thunderbird 10-Jun-16 04:07
Re: The incredible Teflon Red Ochre 513 Martin Stower 10-Jun-16 14:49
Re: The incredible Red Ochre lasted 4500 yrs. 430 DScribr 11-Jun-16 00:40
Re: Wilkinson's opinions 360 Martin Stower 10-Jun-16 02:28
Re: Wilkinson's opinions 351 Audrey 10-Jun-16 03:05
Re: Wilkinson's opinions 480 Martin Stower 10-Jun-16 14:09
Bibliography 424 Warwick 10-Jun-16 18:07
Re: Bibliography 441 Origyptian 10-Jun-16 18:35
Re: Bibliography 417 Warwick 10-Jun-16 20:01
Re: Bibliography 467 Origyptian 10-Jun-16 21:54
Re: Bibliography 484 Corpuscles 10-Jun-16 23:45
Re: Bibliography 307 Origyptian 11-Jun-16 17:01
Re: Bibliography 432 Corpuscles 11-Jun-16 22:36
Re: Bibliography 397 Audrey 11-Jun-16 23:08
Re: Bibliography 413 Corpuscles 11-Jun-16 23:26
Re: Bibliography 337 Audrey 12-Jun-16 02:30
Re: Bibliography 379 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 03:19
Re: Bibliography 324 Audrey 12-Jun-16 03:32
Re: Bibliography 353 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 03:40
Re: Bibliography 358 Audrey 12-Jun-16 03:50
Re: Bibliography 338 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 04:30
Re: Bibliography 318 Audrey 12-Jun-16 04:47
Re: Bibliography 306 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 05:02
Re: Bibliography 443 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 10:49
Re: Bibliography 403 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 15:56
Re: Bibliography 338 R Avry Wilson 12-Jun-16 17:41
But Avry.. 377 Warwick 12-Jun-16 17:58
Re: But Avry.. 460 R Avry Wilson 12-Jun-16 18:14
Re: But Avry.. 426 Audrey 12-Jun-16 18:37
Re: But Avry.. 423 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 20:15
Re: But Avry.. 424 Audrey 12-Jun-16 18:44
Re: But Avry.. 386 Warwick 12-Jun-16 18:59
Re: But Avry.. 387 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 20:11
This whole discussion is a boondoggle 464 DScribr 13-Jun-16 01:04
Re: This whole discussion is a boondoggle 423 Warwick 13-Jun-16 16:24
Re: Bibliography 301 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 10:28
Re: Bibliography 391 Origyptian 11-Jun-16 23:35
Re: Bibliography 423 Corpuscles 11-Jun-16 23:58
Re: Bibliography 393 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 00:48
Re: Bibliography 430 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 01:13
Re: Bibliography 462 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 01:33
Re: Bibliography 479 Martin Stower 11-Jun-16 02:05
Re: Bibliography 451 Origyptian 11-Jun-16 18:09
Re: Bibliography 438 Martin Stower 11-Jun-16 19:22
Re: Bibliography 382 Origyptian 11-Jun-16 19:56
Re: Bibliography 306 Martin Stower 11-Jun-16 20:47
Re: Bibliography 426 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 00:03
Re: Bibliography 419 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 00:22
Re: Bibliography 314 Audrey 12-Jun-16 01:58
Re: Bibliography 457 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 02:24
Re: Bibliography 366 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 12:23
Re: Bibliography 381 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 14:50
Re: Bibliography 407 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 16:46
Re: Bibliography 324 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 00:10
Re: Bibliography 422 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 00:18
Re: Bibliography 406 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 00:35
Re: Bibliography 458 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 00:39
Re: Bibliography 365 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 01:23
Re: Bibliography 365 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 02:18
Re: Bibliography 318 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 13:55
Re: Bibliography 386 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 15:45
Re: Bibliography 422 R Avry Wilson 12-Jun-16 17:32
Re: Bibliography 360 Warwick 12-Jun-16 17:41
Re: Bibliography 412 R Avry Wilson 12-Jun-16 18:08
Re: Bibliography 410 Audrey 12-Jun-16 18:48
Re: Bibliography 402 Audrey 12-Jun-16 18:35
Re: Bibliography 351 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 19:09
Gonna ignore the noise and try again 397 Warwick 12-Jun-16 19:53
Re: Gonna ignore the noise and try again 406 Thunderbird 12-Jun-16 20:18
Re: Gonna ignore the noise and try again 372 Audrey 12-Jun-16 21:04