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Thanos5150 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> I do not respect your opinion as despite all that has
> been said you still have it.

More Thanos signature charm.

Yes, I still have my opinion because despite all that has been said, the evidence is not conclusive.



> Reisner was no more trying to "deceive the world"
> as Lehner was about the worker's town.

Not quite. According to your opinion, Reisner knew that the notion of a "displaced tomb" from the "original" at Saqqara to the secret pit at G7000x was pure speculation as a way to explain the artifacts in G7000x, and assuming that he monitored the acceptance of his hypotheses, he surely noticed that the field interpreted his speculation as being "historical fact" as observed by Lehner. And yet even though Reisner was quick to correct the media from initially erroneously reporting that G7000x was the tomb of Sneferu, Reisner apparently took no corresponding action to correct the misconception that Hetepheres' alleged original tomb in Saqqara was established historical fact rather than merely his speculation.

Not sure how that substantially differs from what you're objecting to.


Let's revisit Reisner's account of this episode in bmfa25_1927_01to36.pdf and see how clearly he made it known that he was merely speculating and not stating fact (bold emphasis is mine):

    "...the accumulated evidence permitted us to draw certain definite conclusions, many of which have been outlined in the preceding chapters. The intact tomb at Giza, which bears on our map the number G 7000 X, was a secret tomb made during the building of the pyramid of Cheops, and by its position could only be the tomb of a favored member of the family of that king. The deposit in the tomb was a reburial brought from another tomb. The great golden canopy, a magnificent example of the metal working of Dynasty IV. and the accompanying inlaid box, bore the name of Sneferuw, the predecessor and father of Cheops. Four other objects, the carrying-chair, the jewel box containing the inlaid silver anklets, an inlaid panel, and a gold disc, bore the names and titles of the Queen Hetepheres, a mother of a king of Upper and Lower Egypt ... The queen was buried by Cheops in her original tomb, for the broken seals of his storehouse were in the rubbish gathered up from the floor of that tomb. Therefore, in all reasonable human probability, Hetepheres was the mother of Cheops and a wife of Sneferuw."

Reisner clearly and unconditionally presents that Hetepheres was relocated from her original tomb at Dashur and reburied at G7000x. There is not a hint of speculation in his narrative on that point. Further along, Reisner states:

    "In accordance with Egyptian custom the original tomb of Hetepheres was at Dahshur beside the pyramid of her husband Sneferuw..."

    "...and I have no doubt that Queen Hetepheres inspected her tomb [in Saqqara] repeatedly during its construction and after completion. She outlived her husband and was buried by her son Cheops in the tomb prepared by Sneferuw."

    "We have no definite evidence of just when the queen-mother died, probably in the first half of the reign of Cheops. Nor have we any proof of how long a time elapsed before the royal police discovered that the tomb had been broken open by thieves, but it was certainly no great number of years after the burial."

    "The anger of the king can be imagined and the penalties meted out to every one who came under the suspicion of guilt or negligence. Resolved to place the burial of his mother beyond the reach of further desecration, Cheops ordered her body with the alabaster sarcophagus and all that remained of the equipment, to be transferred to a secret grave in the precincts of his own royal cemetery at Giza. One wonders whether the “annals of the Old Kingdom’’ ever showed any record of this event."

    "The Dahshur tomb of Queen Hetepheres after the plundering was left in great confusion. If there is one thing with which the Egyptian field archaeologist is familiar it is the state in which thieves leave an ancient tomb. Originally the floor of the Dahshur tomb was completely covered by the burial equipment. The alabaster sarcophagus stood in the southwestern quarter of the room under the cloth-lined gold canopy presented by Sneferuw. In the southern part of the room, in front of the canopy, the gold-cased furniture was set, together with the gold-cased boxes which contained the more valuable objects, the toilet-boxes, and the copper ewer and basin."

    "The doorway was blocked with rectangular blocks of fine white limestone set in plaster. The thieves forced a way through this masonry block, no doubt near the top, so that a part of the plaster and stone fell within the chamber. These men were probably of the cemetery workmen or guards and knew exactly where the valuables in a grave were to be found. In this case, they seem to have paid little attention to the deposit on the floor but made for the sarcophagus itself. They trampled over the pottery and the furniture to the canopy which they must have upset to the east or taken down to afford room for getting at the coffin lid. They were unable to lift the lid by the four short projections, two at each end, which served as handles, for they attempted to force the lid by driving wedges, probably of metal, between the box and the lid. The edges are chipped on all four sides by these efforts, and one corner of the lid is broken off. Whether the thieves succeeded before they were discovered we shall not know until we open the coffin."

    "We do not yet know the state in which the thieves left the mummy of the queen, but probably at this point the mummy of the queen was taken out and placed on a bier or in some temporary receptacle for transport. Finally the lid and then the sarcophagus would have been manoeuvred out one at a time and taken up the sloping entrance corridor.[/b]"

    "The heavy coffin was loaded on a wooden sledge. That was the method used in transporting heavy blocks of stone in the Pyramid Age. It was probably dragged by large gangs of men from Dahshur to Giza, but whether by the desert or some valley road is uncertain. The sledge with its load might even have been carried part of the way by water. The time required would be measured by weeks, not months."

Nowhere does Reisner clarify that "what follows is my speculation that Hetepheres was originally buried in Dahshur and that her original tomb was plundered by contemporaneous robbers and so she was then reburied in Giza." Rather, throughout his report he repeats what clearly are factual decrees of her reburial. It seems obvious that he felt the need to do that because:

    1. he believed his team was the first to breach the G7000X Old Kingdom tomb of Hetepheres I.
    2. her body was missing from g7000x,
    3. he believed she was the wife of Sneferu, mother of Khufu,
    4. he believed she definitely was buried next to Sneferu in Dashur.
    5. decreeing the reburial reconciled what appeared to be her tomb in Giza rather than Dashur.

Regardless of the specific details he offers, there is nothing in his report that would lead anyone to believe he is merely speculating that Hetepheres' original tomb is in Dashur. Rather, he repeats several times that there is no doubt that she was first buried there and then her tomb was relocated.

So sure, there are a few "probablies" and "would have beens" inserted here and there in an attempt to fill in the details, but Reisner also is teaching a series of decrees that can be reasonably inferred to be accepted as fact. And it was indeed accepted as fact for 60 years until Lehner called him on it in 1985.

To say that Reisner wasn't trying to "deceive" anyone implies that he didn't realize how baselessly dogmatic his statements were. And while that's a possibility, it only means that he would then be guilty of lacking objectivity in reporting the results of his investigation. And that leads us back to it being another example of the far lower standards of proof that were tolerated in reporting facts vs. speculation back then.

______________________________________________________________
How can any of us ever know, when all we can do is think?



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 08-Jun-16 03:27 by Origyptian.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Creighton Persists Part 2 4096 JonnyMcA 19-May-16 14:30
That chemical analysis . . . 658 Martin Stower 19-May-16 17:30
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 587 Origyptian 19-May-16 20:50
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 563 Jon Ellison 19-May-16 21:31
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 531 Martin Stower 19-May-16 22:01
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 523 Martin Stower 19-May-16 21:42
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 503 Origyptian 19-May-16 22:12
The unfounded accusations continue..... 616 DScribr 19-May-16 22:46
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 595 Martin Stower 20-May-16 00:14
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 513 Thanos5150 20-May-16 00:35
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 400 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 01:57
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 529 Origyptian 20-May-16 02:47
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 414 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 03:20
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 486 Martin Stower 20-May-16 19:10
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 498 DScribr 20-May-16 23:23
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 509 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 23:35
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 490 DScribr 20-May-16 23:40
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 465 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:07
Re: The unfounded accusations continue..... 365 DScribr 20-May-16 02:58
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 516 Martin Stower 19-May-16 22:55
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 519 DScribr 19-May-16 22:43
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 499 Martin Stower 19-May-16 23:30
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 569 Origyptian 20-May-16 02:48
The lack of analysis . . . 615 DScribr 20-May-16 03:05
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 554 Audrey 20-May-16 04:13
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 469 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 06:58
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 509 DScribr 20-May-16 23:42
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 637 Origyptian 20-May-16 15:46
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 464 Martin Stower 21-May-16 01:28
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 457 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:32
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 506 Martin Stower 21-May-16 02:07
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 491 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 06:43
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 506 Origyptian 21-May-16 14:58
So much for chemical analysis . . . 486 DScribr 21-May-16 19:54
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 491 Martin Stower 21-May-16 22:49
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 484 Martin Stower 21-May-16 23:00
Re: What's the end game with this? 590 Thunderbird 20-May-16 17:20
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 487 Martin Stower 20-May-16 19:04
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 466 Audrey 20-May-16 22:43
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 436 Martin Stower 20-May-16 22:54
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 475 Audrey 20-May-16 23:12
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 411 Martin Stower 20-May-16 23:52
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 484 Audrey 21-May-16 00:33
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 560 Martin Stower 21-May-16 00:45
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 411 DScribr 21-May-16 01:35
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 370 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:06
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 441 Martin Stower 21-May-16 01:33
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 518 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:36
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 648 Martin Stower 21-May-16 02:49
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 544 Martin Stower 20-May-16 18:28
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 563 Origyptian 20-May-16 20:00
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 459 Thanos5150 20-May-16 20:13
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 494 Origyptian 20-May-16 21:03
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 500 Martin Stower 20-May-16 23:44
Höfer and Görlitz meet Stein 433 Martin Stower 21-May-16 00:36
Re: Höfer and Görlitz meet Stein 413 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:23
Re: Höfer and Görlitz meet Stein 624 Martin Stower 21-May-16 01:55
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 471 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:34
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 496 Martin Stower 21-May-16 03:15
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 427 Origyptian 21-May-16 04:08
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 499 Martin Stower 21-May-16 23:33
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 588 Origyptian 22-May-16 00:09
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 447 Martin Stower 22-May-16 00:49
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 536 Origyptian 22-May-16 00:57
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 507 Origyptian 22-May-16 01:11
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 502 Jon Ellison 22-May-16 01:14
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 518 Martin Stower 22-May-16 01:51
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 478 Origyptian 22-May-16 04:21
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 525 Martin Stower 22-May-16 14:20
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 489 Origyptian 22-May-16 17:32
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 525 Martin Stower 22-May-16 18:33
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 491 Origyptian 22-May-16 20:34
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 424 Martin Stower 22-May-16 21:30
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 514 Origyptian 22-May-16 23:04
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 531 Martin Stower 23-May-16 00:03
Re: That chemical analysis is all but forgotten...... 480 DScribr 23-May-16 03:11
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 516 Richard Fusniak 21-May-16 08:47
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 488 Origyptian 21-May-16 13:26
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 450 Martin Stower 22-May-16 00:32
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 478 Origyptian 22-May-16 00:50
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 510 Martin Stower 22-May-16 01:39
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 413 Origyptian 22-May-16 04:45
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 423 Martin Stower 22-May-16 16:13
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 417 Martin Stower 21-May-16 22:44
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 608 Origyptian 21-May-16 23:58
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 456 Martin Stower 22-May-16 01:28
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 705 Martin Stower 20-May-16 22:44
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 458 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:41
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 539 Martin Stower 21-May-16 03:28
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 565 Origyptian 21-May-16 04:14
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 378 Martin Stower 21-May-16 23:11
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 524 Thanos5150 19-May-16 22:50
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 504 Martin Stower 19-May-16 23:18
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 420 DScribr 20-May-16 03:07
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 503 Origyptian 20-May-16 02:52
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 448 DScribr 20-May-16 03:12
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 523 Thanos5150 20-May-16 05:20
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 416 Origyptian 20-May-16 13:36
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 525 Thanos5150 20-May-16 17:57
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 527 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 18:56
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 505 Martin Stower 20-May-16 19:23
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 579 Thanos5150 20-May-16 19:27
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 449 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 19:29
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 479 Audrey 20-May-16 21:02
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 491 Origyptian 20-May-16 21:12
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 480 Jon Ellison 20-May-16 21:26
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 538 Thanos5150 20-May-16 22:08
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 528 Audrey 20-May-16 22:34
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 432 Thanos5150 20-May-16 22:36
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 511 Audrey 20-May-16 22:47
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 418 Thanos5150 20-May-16 23:00
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 438 Audrey 20-May-16 23:11
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 422 Thanos5150 21-May-16 00:01
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 434 Audrey 21-May-16 00:23
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 488 Thanos5150 21-May-16 03:14
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 483 Audrey 21-May-16 05:02
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 416 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 09:10
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 556 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 09:28
The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 517 DScribr 21-May-16 13:37
Re: The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 432 Origyptian 21-May-16 13:56
Re: The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 479 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 17:48
Willful ignorance continues....... 510 DScribr 21-May-16 19:49
Re: Willful ignorance continues....... 534 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 21:28
Re: Stealing IS a crime! Willful ignorance continues....... 440 DScribr 22-May-16 00:39
Re: The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 514 Richard Fusniak 21-May-16 18:17
Re: The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 401 DScribr 21-May-16 19:57
Re: The chemical analysis is of little help without R-C Dating 533 Richard Fusniak 21-May-16 20:24
Stealing IS A Crime!!! 512 DScribr 22-May-16 00:32
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 511 Origyptian 21-May-16 15:04
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 431 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 17:53
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 486 Origyptian 21-May-16 21:39
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 478 Jon Ellison 22-May-16 00:46
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 433 Martin Stower 21-May-16 00:09
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 513 Audrey 21-May-16 00:26
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 522 Martin Stower 21-May-16 00:42
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 474 Audrey 21-May-16 01:04
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 539 Martin Stower 21-May-16 01:41
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 504 Jon Ellison 21-May-16 11:00
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 464 DScribr 21-May-16 01:44
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 473 Origyptian 20-May-16 19:25
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 487 Thanos5150 20-May-16 19:31
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 435 Origyptian 20-May-16 20:35
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 505 Thanos5150 20-May-16 22:03
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 429 Origyptian 20-May-16 22:38
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 512 Thanos5150 20-May-16 22:52
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 443 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:31
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 507 Martin Stower 21-May-16 01:05
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 447 Origyptian 21-May-16 01:27
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 471 Martin Stower 21-May-16 03:31
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 445 Audrey 21-May-16 01:42
Re: That chemical analysis . . . 525 Martin Stower 21-May-16 03:34
Pending statement from Dr. Gorlitz 767 Richard Fusniak 20-May-16 12:04
Re: Pending statement from Dr. Gorlitz 534 Martin Stower 20-May-16 19:25
Martin Persists 586 drrayeye 23-May-16 01:30
Re: Martin Persists 552 Martin Stower 23-May-16 12:01
Re: Martin Persists 425 R Avry Wilson 24-May-16 19:58
Mainstream Persists 464 DScribr 25-May-16 00:56
Re: Martin Persists 640 Merrell 28-May-16 09:00
Re: Martin Persists 475 Martin Stower 28-May-16 11:11
as long as we are counting 565 Warwick 25-May-16 16:42
Re: as long as we are counting 535 DScribr 26-May-16 01:53
Re: as long as we are counting 569 cladking 26-May-16 16:57
Re: as long as we are counting 479 Martin Stower 26-May-16 17:31
Re: as long as we are counting 492 Origyptian 26-May-16 17:40
Re: as long as we are counting 409 cladking 27-May-16 00:21
Re: as long as we are counting 501 Warwick 27-May-16 01:27
Re: as long as we are counting 326 Origyptian 27-May-16 02:53
And work hard at obfuscation. 397 DScribr 27-May-16 00:57
Re: And work hard at obfuscation. 451 cladking 27-May-16 02:55
Re: as long as we are counting 425 Warwick 27-May-16 01:29
Re: as long as we are counting 533 cladking 27-May-16 02:59
Re: as long as we are counting 506 Warwick 27-May-16 03:35
Re: as long as we are counting 493 Audrey 27-May-16 04:32
Re: as long as we are counting 447 Warwick 27-May-16 05:34
Re: as long as we are counting 538 cladking 27-May-16 13:35
Re: as long as we are counting 497 Warwick 27-May-16 14:56
The original page on Indiegogo etc. 586 Martin Stower 25-May-16 22:10
Another performance . . . 476 Martin Stower 26-May-16 13:47
Re: Another performance . . . 432 Warwick 26-May-16 13:57
Re: Another performance . . . 375 Origyptian 26-May-16 14:53
Re: Another performance . . . 466 Martin Stower 26-May-16 16:09
Re: Another performance . . . 478 cladking 26-May-16 16:18
Re: Another performance . . . 385 Martin Stower 26-May-16 16:31
Re: Another performance . . . 644 cladking 26-May-16 17:54
Re: Another performance . . . 528 Martin Stower 26-May-16 18:29
Re: Another performance . . . 363 cladking 26-May-16 23:52
Re: Another performance . . . 503 eyeofhorus33 26-May-16 19:00
Re: Another performance . . . 403 cladking 27-May-16 00:05
Re: Another performance . . . 435 Audrey 27-May-16 00:23
Re: Another performance . . . 420 Warwick 27-May-16 01:42
Re: Another performance . . . 496 cladking 27-May-16 02:07
Re: Another performance . . . 445 Warwick 27-May-16 02:15
Re: Another performance . . . 480 cladking 27-May-16 02:48
Re: Another performance . . . 459 Warwick 27-May-16 03:48
Re: Another performance . . . 513 cladking 27-May-16 03:53
Re: Another performance . . . 548 Warwick 27-May-16 05:41
Re: Another performance . . . 439 Audrey 27-May-16 04:51
Re: Another performance . . . 479 Warwick 27-May-16 05:18
NOT Primitive, Low-Tech 438 DScribr 28-May-16 14:09
Re: NOT Primitive, Low-Tech 486 cladking 28-May-16 14:31
Re: Another performance . . . 515 Thanos5150 26-May-16 16:38
Re: Another performance . . . 404 cladking 26-May-16 16:44
Re: Another performance . . . 505 Origyptian 26-May-16 17:33
Re: Another performance . . . 520 cladking 26-May-16 17:40
Re: Another performance . . . 510 Martin Stower 26-May-16 17:49
Re: Another performance . . . 515 cladking 27-May-16 00:15
Re: Another performance . . . 504 Martin Stower 27-May-16 19:17
Re: Another performance . . . 521 Warwick 27-May-16 20:00
Re: Another performance . . . 457 cladking 27-May-16 20:21
Re: Another performance . . . 559 Martin Stower 27-May-16 23:06
Re: Oops....we missed the Basalt flooring and machine disc cuts 367 Thunderbird 27-May-16 23:28
Re: Oops....we missed the Basalt flooring and machine disc cuts 479 Martin Stower 27-May-16 23:41
Re: Another performance . . . 501 cladking 28-May-16 00:33
Re: Another performance . . . 489 Martin Stower 28-May-16 00:59
Re: Another performance . . . 484 cladking 28-May-16 02:36
Re: Another performance . . . 464 Martin Stower 28-May-16 23:55
Re: Another performance . . . 410 cladking 29-May-16 01:23
Re: Another performance . . . 446 Martin Stower 29-May-16 19:35
Re: Another performance . . . 614 cladking 29-May-16 20:43
Re: Another performance . . . 499 R Avry Wilson 28-May-16 02:39
Re: Another performance . . . 521 cladking 28-May-16 03:41
Re: Another performance . . . 465 Thanos5150 28-May-16 06:20
Re: Another performance . . . 543 cladking 28-May-16 13:40
Re: Another performance . . . 493 Origyptian 28-May-16 15:04
Re: Another performance . . . 489 Jon Ellison 28-May-16 16:38
Re: Another performance . . . 353 cladking 28-May-16 17:52
Re: Another performance . . . 452 Jon Ellison 28-May-16 17:58
Re: Another performance . . . 378 Origyptian 29-May-16 02:51
Re: Another performance . . . 402 cladking 29-May-16 03:08
Re: Another performance . . . 461 Origyptian 29-May-16 04:03
Re: Another performance . . . 480 Thanos5150 29-May-16 05:03
Re: Another performance . . . 511 Origyptian 29-May-16 13:18
Re: Another performance . . . 526 Thanos5150 29-May-16 15:03
Focus on the axiom 470 Origyptian 29-May-16 15:27
Re: Focus on everything BUT the facts 531 DScribr 29-May-16 15:41
Re: Focus on everything BUT the facts 426 cladking 29-May-16 17:29
Re: Focus on the axiom 411 Thanos5150 30-May-16 01:49
Re: Focus on the axiom 468 Origyptian 30-May-16 05:32
Re: Focus on the axiom 460 Thanos5150 31-May-16 02:35
Re: Focus on the axiom 494 Origyptian 31-May-16 06:41
Re: Focus on the axiom 492 Thanos5150 01-Jun-16 00:28
Re: Focus on reality. 454 DScribr 01-Jun-16 00:51
Re: Focus on the axiom 439 Origyptian 01-Jun-16 06:20
Re: Focus on the axiom 484 Thanos5150 02-Jun-16 03:08
Re: Focus on the axiom 461 cladking 02-Jun-16 04:00
Re: Focus on the axiom 411 Origyptian 02-Jun-16 04:25
Re: Focus on the axiom 421 Thanos5150 02-Jun-16 16:34
Re: Focus on the axiom 422 cladking 02-Jun-16 18:20
Re: Focus on the axiom 473 Origyptian 03-Jun-16 18:04
Re: Focus on the axiom 463 R Avry Wilson 03-Jun-16 18:43
Re: Focus on the axiom 442 Origyptian 03-Jun-16 21:24
Re: Focus on the axiom 456 Corpuscles 03-Jun-16 23:59
Re: Focus on the axiom 314 Origyptian 04-Jun-16 06:29
Re: Focus on the axiom 383 R Avry Wilson 04-Jun-16 00:12
Re: Focus on the axiom 372 Origyptian 04-Jun-16 07:02
Re: Focus on the axiom 502 Jon Ellison 04-Jun-16 10:18
Re: Focus on the axiom 438 R Avry Wilson 05-Jun-16 04:15
Re: Focus on the axiom 433 Martin Stower 03-Jun-16 22:28
Re: Focus on the axiom 447 cladking 03-Jun-16 22:51
Re: Focus on the axiom 566 Thanos5150 04-Jun-16 01:08
Re: Focus on the axiom 454 Origyptian 05-Jun-16 01:25
Re: Focus on the axiom 501 Thanos5150 05-Jun-16 04:15
Re: Focus on the axiom 459 Origyptian 05-Jun-16 17:29
Re: Focus on the axiom 494 Martin Stower 05-Jun-16 19:35
Re: Focus on the axiom 508 Origyptian 05-Jun-16 22:48
Re: Focus on the axiom 424 Martin Stower 05-Jun-16 23:47
Re: Focus on the axiom 463 Origyptian 06-Jun-16 00:54
Re: Focus on the axiom 423 Origyptian 06-Jun-16 01:01
Re: Focus on the axiom 460 Thanos5150 06-Jun-16 01:05
Re: Focus on the axiom 444 Origyptian 06-Jun-16 02:40
Re: Focus on the axiom 473 R Avry Wilson 06-Jun-16 03:39
Re: Focus on the axiom 389 Audrey 06-Jun-16 04:59
Re: Focus on the axiom 395 Jon Ellison 06-Jun-16 07:59
Re: Focus on the axiom 399 Origyptian 06-Jun-16 14:00
Re: Focus on the axiom 458 cladking 06-Jun-16 16:13
Re: Focus on the axiom 417 Corpuscles 07-Jun-16 00:20
Re: Focus on the axiom 475 Origyptian 07-Jun-16 02:55
Re: Focus on the axiom 407 Thanos5150 06-Jun-16 15:33
Re: Focus on the axiom 347 Warwick 06-Jun-16 16:17
Re: Focus on the axiom 480 Audrey 06-Jun-16 16:39
Re: Focus on the axiom 466 Warwick 06-Jun-16 16:58
Re: Focus on the axiom 373 Audrey 06-Jun-16 17:46
Re: Focus on the axiom 414 Warwick 06-Jun-16 18:13
Re: Focus on the axiom 358 Audrey 06-Jun-16 23:44
Read what I wrote 371 Warwick 07-Jun-16 17:15
Re: Read what I wrote 394 Audrey 08-Jun-16 00:22
Re: Read what I wrote 385 Martin Stower 08-Jun-16 01:40
Re: Read what I wrote 550 Audrey 08-Jun-16 01:52
Re: Read what I wrote 408 Martin Stower 08-Jun-16 13:47
Vyse's veracity.... 414 Warwick 09-Jun-16 16:29
Re: Vyse's veracity.... 337 Audrey 09-Jun-16 16:51
Re: Vyse's veracity.... 435 Warwick 09-Jun-16 17:19
Re: Vyse's veracity.... 475 Audrey 09-Jun-16 17:45
Wilkinson's opinions 399 Warwick 09-Jun-16 18:47
Re: Wilkinson's opinions 413 Origyptian 09-Jun-16 20:57
Ori's opinions 546 DScribr 10-Jun-16 01:45
Re: The incredible Teflon Red Ochre 391 Thunderbird 10-Jun-16 04:07
Re: The incredible Teflon Red Ochre 513 Martin Stower 10-Jun-16 14:49
Re: The incredible Red Ochre lasted 4500 yrs. 429 DScribr 11-Jun-16 00:40
Re: Wilkinson's opinions 360 Martin Stower 10-Jun-16 02:28
Re: Wilkinson's opinions 351 Audrey 10-Jun-16 03:05
Re: Wilkinson's opinions 480 Martin Stower 10-Jun-16 14:09
Bibliography 423 Warwick 10-Jun-16 18:07
Re: Bibliography 441 Origyptian 10-Jun-16 18:35
Re: Bibliography 417 Warwick 10-Jun-16 20:01
Re: Bibliography 467 Origyptian 10-Jun-16 21:54
Re: Bibliography 484 Corpuscles 10-Jun-16 23:45
Re: Bibliography 307 Origyptian 11-Jun-16 17:01
Re: Bibliography 432 Corpuscles 11-Jun-16 22:36
Re: Bibliography 397 Audrey 11-Jun-16 23:08
Re: Bibliography 412 Corpuscles 11-Jun-16 23:26
Re: Bibliography 337 Audrey 12-Jun-16 02:30
Re: Bibliography 379 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 03:19
Re: Bibliography 324 Audrey 12-Jun-16 03:32
Re: Bibliography 353 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 03:40
Re: Bibliography 357 Audrey 12-Jun-16 03:50
Re: Bibliography 338 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 04:30
Re: Bibliography 316 Audrey 12-Jun-16 04:47
Re: Bibliography 306 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 05:02
Re: Bibliography 443 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 10:49
Re: Bibliography 403 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 15:56
Re: Bibliography 338 R Avry Wilson 12-Jun-16 17:41
But Avry.. 377 Warwick 12-Jun-16 17:58
Re: But Avry.. 460 R Avry Wilson 12-Jun-16 18:14
Re: But Avry.. 426 Audrey 12-Jun-16 18:37
Re: But Avry.. 422 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 20:15
Re: But Avry.. 424 Audrey 12-Jun-16 18:44
Re: But Avry.. 386 Warwick 12-Jun-16 18:59
Re: But Avry.. 386 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 20:11
This whole discussion is a boondoggle 463 DScribr 13-Jun-16 01:04
Re: This whole discussion is a boondoggle 422 Warwick 13-Jun-16 16:24
Re: Bibliography 301 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 10:28
Re: Bibliography 391 Origyptian 11-Jun-16 23:35
Re: Bibliography 422 Corpuscles 11-Jun-16 23:58
Re: Bibliography 393 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 00:48
Re: Bibliography 430 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 01:13
Re: Bibliography 462 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 01:33
Re: Bibliography 479 Martin Stower 11-Jun-16 02:05
Re: Bibliography 451 Origyptian 11-Jun-16 18:09
Re: Bibliography 437 Martin Stower 11-Jun-16 19:22
Re: Bibliography 382 Origyptian 11-Jun-16 19:56
Re: Bibliography 306 Martin Stower 11-Jun-16 20:47
Re: Bibliography 426 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 00:03
Re: Bibliography 419 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 00:22
Re: Bibliography 314 Audrey 12-Jun-16 01:58
Re: Bibliography 457 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 02:24
Re: Bibliography 366 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 12:23
Re: Bibliography 381 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 14:50
Re: Bibliography 407 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 16:46
Re: Bibliography 323 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 00:10
Re: Bibliography 422 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 00:18
Re: Bibliography 405 Corpuscles 12-Jun-16 00:35
Re: Bibliography 457 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 00:39
Re: Bibliography 365 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 01:23
Re: Bibliography 365 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 02:18
Re: Bibliography 318 Martin Stower 12-Jun-16 13:55
Re: Bibliography 385 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 15:45
Re: Bibliography 422 R Avry Wilson 12-Jun-16 17:32
Re: Bibliography 360 Warwick 12-Jun-16 17:41
Re: Bibliography 412 R Avry Wilson 12-Jun-16 18:08
Re: Bibliography 410 Audrey 12-Jun-16 18:48
Re: Bibliography 402 Audrey 12-Jun-16 18:35
Re: Bibliography 351 Origyptian 12-Jun-16 19:09
Gonna ignore the noise and try again 397 Warwick 12-Jun-16 19:53
Re: Gonna ignore the noise and try again 406 Thunderbird 12-Jun-16 20:18
Re: Gonna ignore the noise and try again 372 Audrey 12-Jun-16 21:04