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cladking Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

[. . .]

> The masons of that time usually made mastaba sides
> and other steep walls at 70 to 72 degrees for
> stability. I'm merely assuming the five 81' 3"
> steps of G1 which show up on the gravimtric scan
> are similar. If they could make them steeper they
> would have but the steeper they are the more
> fragile they are.

So, you’re assuming that the task was one of building a step pyramid—and that building a step pyramid was the entirety of the task, with nothing else needing explaining.

Would you now like to explain how the topmost stones of a true pyramid were raised, within the constraints of your “no ramps allowed” stipulation?

How the stones converting the posited stepped core into a true pyramid were raised?

> > If they were dragging things up a slope anyway,
> > then reducing that slope would be a natural
> > step to take.
>
> No. Not necessarily.
>
> Indeed, the shallower the slope the more
> inefficient it is because total friction
> increases. It is zero total friction at 90
> degrees and it is infinite at 0 degrees. It is
> very high at 8 degrees and extremely low at 70
> degrees.

And again, reducing friction to a minimum is not necessarily an overriding consideration, if the low-friction or no-friction solution is infeasible. There are the larger stones (roofing blocks, including the granite ones) to explain—and, again, all of the ones which are not part of the posited stepped core.

> If they had a perfect 70 degree side on the step
> that required no effort to build then why expend
> effort to make it less efficient? Ever consider a
> job in Congress?

Congress is not in my country.

> > You were there? I see nothing less which would
> > justify so plonking an assertion.
>
> Ramps are debunked and this can't be changed with
> semantics. [. . .]

> Again, semantics are irrelevant. [. . .]

> > And without semantics, your words amount to . . . ?
>
> I'm asking you to look beyond the words to the
> meaning, [. . .]

So much for coherence again.

> > Yeah, common sense, right.
>
> Common sense insists they used the simplest, least
> complicated, and most efficient means to lift
> stones as evidenced by the largest public works
> project in human history. This means ramps are
> illogical and fly in the face of common sense.

No, common sense insists that they did what was doable.

> > Seems to me that you’re doing what you
> > constantly accuse others of doing: treating the
> > ancient Egyptians as bumpkins, who did things
> > which make no sense.
>
> ?

It remains unclear to me (for one) that your proposal is other than impractical and impracticable.

> > What fools people are to make use of it,
> > then—and yet somehow they do, to make things
> > doable. Total amount of work is not always an
> > overriding consideration.
>
> When you get a new engine put in your car the cost
> of lifting it up is incidental.
>
> Lifting isn't incidental when you're using
> primitive technology in a primitive economy to
> lift 6 1/2 million tons to an average of 150'.

If proposing that stones were raised by essentially a straight lift, perhaps you would like to explain how they were secured, without any sign of lewises being used—and what was used to stop them scraping that nice, dressed Tura.

Also, it might help if you worked through your ideas (covering inter alia the points mentioned above) and presented them pictorially.

M.

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Subject Views Written By Posted
Removable plugs on purpose 2655 Open mind 21-Nov-15 17:11
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 804 cladking 21-Nov-15 17:39
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 736 Open mind 21-Nov-15 18:33
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 624 cladking 21-Nov-15 18:45
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 836 Open mind 21-Nov-15 19:44
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 706 cladking 21-Nov-15 19:52
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 780 Open mind 21-Nov-15 20:28
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 653 cladking 21-Nov-15 21:04
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 725 Open mind 21-Nov-15 23:26
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 727 Dr. Troglodyte 22-Nov-15 00:53
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 810 Corpuscles 22-Nov-15 11:32
Pragmatic Semantics 863 Dr. Troglodyte 22-Nov-15 18:18
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 637 Open mind 22-Nov-15 17:30
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 669 Dr. Troglodyte 22-Nov-15 18:45
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 727 Open mind 23-Nov-15 21:22
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 642 Origyptian 23-Nov-15 21:32
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 648 Open mind 23-Nov-15 22:27
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 681 Origyptian 23-Nov-15 22:39
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 591 cladking 23-Nov-15 22:39
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 669 Origyptian 23-Nov-15 22:53
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 626 Dr. Troglodyte 24-Nov-15 16:25
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 757 Open mind 24-Nov-15 19:06
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 699 cladking 24-Nov-15 19:47
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 746 Open mind 24-Nov-15 20:30
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 532 cladking 24-Nov-15 20:57
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 674 Jon Ellison 24-Nov-15 21:31
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 579 cladking 24-Nov-15 22:33
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 687 Origyptian 24-Nov-15 20:36
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 665 Open mind 24-Nov-15 20:49
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 623 Origyptian 24-Nov-15 21:02
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 624 Open mind 24-Nov-15 21:14
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 637 Jon Ellison 24-Nov-15 20:51
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 644 cladking 22-Nov-15 20:58
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 680 Origyptian 22-Nov-15 16:58
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 674 Open mind 22-Nov-15 18:14
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 731 Open mind 22-Nov-15 20:36
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 654 cladking 22-Nov-15 21:08
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 638 Brian Patterson 24-Nov-15 18:38
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 554 cladking 24-Nov-15 19:54
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 615 Brian Patterson 24-Nov-15 20:59
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 693 Open mind 24-Nov-15 21:35
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 628 Origyptian 24-Nov-15 21:38
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 660 Open mind 24-Nov-15 21:48
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 627 Origyptian 24-Nov-15 22:22
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 590 Jon Ellison 24-Nov-15 21:43
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 601 Origyptian 24-Nov-15 21:55
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 591 Brian Patterson 24-Nov-15 22:07
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 605 cladking 24-Nov-15 22:15
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 723 Origyptian 24-Nov-15 22:15
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 633 Jon Ellison 27-Nov-15 18:29
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 683 Brian Patterson 24-Nov-15 22:22
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 662 Origyptian 24-Nov-15 22:47
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 625 cladking 25-Nov-15 00:01
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 755 Martin Stower 27-Nov-15 16:25
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 531 cladking 28-Nov-15 00:04
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 663 Martin Stower 28-Nov-15 00:43
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 593 cladking 28-Nov-15 01:13
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 687 Martin Stower 28-Nov-15 02:03
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 594 cladking 28-Nov-15 02:48
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 776 Martin Stower 28-Nov-15 13:40
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 623 cladking 28-Nov-15 15:16
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 720 Brian Patterson 28-Nov-15 15:45
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 584 Martin Stower 28-Nov-15 20:47
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 600 Merrell 28-Nov-15 21:39
According to Archae... 602 Ratcho 28-Nov-15 22:09
Re: According to Archae... 600 Merrell 28-Nov-15 22:54
Re: According to Archae... 607 Ratcho 28-Nov-15 22:58
Re: According to Archae... 633 Martin Stower 28-Nov-15 23:11
Mindset 648 Ratcho 28-Nov-15 23:36
Re: Mindset 640 Martin Stower 28-Nov-15 23:49
Re: Mindset 625 Merrell 29-Nov-15 10:17
Re: Mindset 781 Thanos5150 29-Nov-15 18:33
Re: Mindset 652 Merrell 29-Nov-15 22:49
Re: Mindset 481 cladking 29-Nov-15 23:03
Re: Mindset 650 Origyptian 30-Nov-15 04:47
Re: Mindset 577 cladking 30-Nov-15 05:07
Re: Mindset 604 Martin Stower 29-Nov-15 23:31
Re: Mindset 670 Thanos5150 29-Nov-15 23:46
Re: According to Archae... 683 Martin Stower 28-Nov-15 23:28
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 575 cladking 28-Nov-15 23:13
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 474 cladking 28-Nov-15 01:21
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 633 Brian Patterson 24-Nov-15 22:57
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 733 Origyptian 24-Nov-15 23:19
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 627 cladking 24-Nov-15 23:57
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 626 Martin Stower 25-Nov-15 00:10
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 744 Dr. Troglodyte 25-Nov-15 00:42
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 677 Jon Ellison 25-Nov-15 01:14
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 649 Open mind 25-Nov-15 04:05
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 616 Jon Ellison 25-Nov-15 07:03
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 643 Open mind 25-Nov-15 13:18
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 508 Open mind 25-Nov-15 13:37
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 696 Open mind 25-Nov-15 03:47
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 735 Origyptian 25-Nov-15 03:58
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 718 Dr. Troglodyte 25-Nov-15 16:25
Why the Plugs were covered by dirt 709 Howard West 29-Nov-15 16:48
Re: Why the Plugs were covered by dirt 673 Origyptian 30-Nov-15 04:57
Re: Why the Plugs were covered by dirt 542 Howard West 30-Nov-15 16:07
Old Posters seem to act like the Caliph Omar 655 Howard West 30-Nov-15 17:11
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 608 Brian Patterson 30-Nov-15 17:17
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 580 Howard West 30-Nov-15 18:07
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 558 cladking 30-Nov-15 21:07
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 598 Origyptian 01-Dec-15 04:56
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 678 Brian Patterson 01-Dec-15 17:10
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 626 Brian Patterson 30-Nov-15 21:54
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 601 Brian Patterson 30-Nov-15 22:14
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 664 Howard West 30-Nov-15 23:01
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 599 Brian Patterson 30-Nov-15 23:15
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 649 Howard West 01-Dec-15 02:34
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 722 Howard West 01-Dec-15 22:36
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 704 Dr. Troglodyte 02-Dec-15 00:48
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 599 Brian Patterson 02-Dec-15 00:29
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 690 Howard West 02-Dec-15 03:46
Re: Removable plugs on purpose 625 Dr. Troglodyte 02-Dec-15 21:04
some people just need lots of pictures 908 Howard West 03-Dec-15 02:12


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